I Want My Dub Friend To See The Truth

by ADubsFriend 11 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  ADubsFriend

  Hello All.

  I used to post here as Imissthedub. After almost 2 years, the dub and I are now in contact and friends. This is now a strictly platonic relationship, and always will be. We have found that despite the pain caused by our mistake, we do care about each other as humans and we want to be friends.

  I do believe I may be this persons only true friend. I am unhappy to know that he and his wife and children are still dubs. I would like to show him the sham the Watchtower really is. However, some of the names of sites and things would just raise "flags" to him, even though they would prove the point. An example is the Escapethewatchtower.com. That would be excellent for showing the whole UN thing, but the name of the site would make him say "That has got to be Apostate, and I will not go there."

  Just the fact that we are friends shows me he is not completely braindead to them. Do any of you have suggestions on threads or sites that I can send him to that won't scare the pants off him just by their names? I would like him to see what he is doing to his wife and family. I belive they have only been in about 4 years. Hopefully, it is not too late.

  Also, since we have just started talking again, how long should I wait before I try to get him to look at these things? And how to I approach the subject? Or, should I just be his friend and leave religion out of it?

  Thanks, all.

  ADubsFriend
• 

  Francois

  What is the topic that most interested him when he was just a study? Become an expert on why Jws are wrong about that issue and why. And be able to explain why the Jws are wrong about it in 50 words or less. (Just kidding about the 50 words, but you get the point.) That's how I handled it in a similar situation. My friends topic was evolution. And I could discuss issues around evolution until the cows came home.

  So that's what we discussed; calmly, objectively, as friends. It was the issue that got thim in; it's also the discussion that got him out.

  Try that. Might work for you.

  francois
• 

  sf

  Hello,

  Let me give you some very useful 'tools' in searching and re-searching 'all things watchtower/ jw' that have taken me far beyond what I ever expected to discover and uncover and have allowed me to help many in their own search projects.

  Many of the sites known to jws as 'apostate/ opposers' websites/ pages contain original documents that can be seen without actually going into the 'opposing site'. Simply pull the properties off the said document or scan and link it into the location bar (URL) and 'bookmark' it.

  I send out these URLs daily; through emails, chat systems and covert 'activities' on other jw boards. I am not liked by internet jw chatters at all. I pump out so much 'wt/jw' related material to chat rooms and such, that I am persecuted daily for this passion to innoculate. haahaha...you should experience it sometime. I encourage it even!

  Also, show him that the search engines hold much more and that he can sift through those and read captions, yet not actualy go into the site. But let me tell you this...

  It is snowballing. The superhighway is now virtually littered with 'all things wt/jw'. He simply will not be able to avoid all avenues that are present. Choices will be hard. There will be days he feels overwhelmed. It can and does take a toll. So 'spot' him as if he is lifting a huge 'weight'. The journey to the Kore is going to be the Ride Of His Life! Tell him to hang on.

  Now, let me share with you the yahoo VOICE CHAT system that has 'jw/exjw' room(s). We have lots of fun there yet when someone such as yourself 'stumbles' in, we are Awake! and Armed! and ready to provide you with support, info and 'homework' projects. If you haven't downloaded 'messenger' yet, I highly suggest you do. And get a microphone.

  Any other question, you can find me in yahoo under the name 'wturls' (wtURLs) and read my profile, as it is updated often with news and sites and documents.

  Happy trails!

  sKally
• 

  ADubsFriend

  Francois:

  Thanks. Excellent idea. It sounds level headed and nonthreatening. A great way to start. I will find out and then I will look up my "ammunition" and learn it.

  SF:

  Thanks to you also. I will be needing some of these threads. I do have yahoo messenger and, as you now probably know, I have added your name.

  Since we have just started talking again less than 2 weeks ago I don't want to start on this too soon. We have catching up to do and we need to settle in to the comfortableness of being friends again. But, I want to be ready when the time seems right.

  I will probably be asking questions about things, to make sure my "argument" is sound...and does not sound, well, argumentive! This is so important to me...I don't want to blow it. I have never been jw but came very close. I need to be well prepared in an area he will know much more about. (or think he does) What saddens me is his 16 year old daughter is now in service. :(
• 

  Lord Zagato

  Know first what topics he is interested in, and do your research first of all, before letting him see the sites/documents himself. It always helps to be informed and at least have a working knowledge of the sites you visit, so as to know which sites and documents you can recommend safely. After being comfortable with those, then perhaps you can delve deeper and suggest sites that might, as you say, raise flags for him.
• 

  Jayson

  

  You should prepare yourself for what you are doing. I only wish that someone had told me to before I began to have relationships with Jehovah Witnesses. They will take advantage of nativity. It is one thing to be friendly with a Jehovah Witness they are benign if you are not a threat. But if you move against the Organization then I can say with quite a bit of certianty that the relationship will change. Educate yourself for them and for you.
• 

  playdrums

  I agree with sf, the internet is going to collapse this thing eventually in my opinion. I've never been a JW but I am dating one. For this reason I brought an older Mac G3 home to setup for my girlfriend. I'm going to get her a modem, etc. And I'm going to teach her how to use google. When we have discussions I'll simply suggest that we both research the topic. I'm not even going to discuss the subject of "apostate" because I'm hoping she "stumbles" upon some damaging information on her own before she can look away. On a practical level I don't see how the lies can stand against the easy access to informations.
  
  On a less practical level, I am one of those who thinks the JW lies have been crafted at the deepest core by a great deceiver. I don't doubt that there will be some methods attempted to counterattack the internet efforts.
  
  We certainly have similar goals though. You should keep in touch and let us know how you're doing.
• 

  sf

  KickAss playdrums!

  On a less practical level, I am one of those who thinks the JW lies have been crafted at the deepest core by a great deceiver. I don't doubt that there will be some methods attempted to counterattack the internet efforts.

  Indeed.

  sKally
• 

  sf

  Hey DubsFriend,

  What is YOUR yahoo handle? Silly.

  sKally
• 

  bebu

  There are some great ideas here. Like you, I am hoping to help a friend out of the JWs.

  One approach that has helped me is to simply be totally honest, and it works with pretty much any religon/philosophy you're having trouble with: "I realize that you don't have a problem with the doctrines of the WT, but I've been running into problems. As long as they are unresolved, I can't ever see myself becoming a JW. I am sure that if the WT is the truth, then there must be a way to explain these difficulties, but so far no one has. Perhaps you could show me where I'm mistaken, or being misled..." They might feel glad to help you, and be willing to even look at what is causing you trouble.

  Be sincere! If they give any credible argument, acknowledge it, because it helps establish that you are not just playing like a partisan but can recognize truthful points. It takes the pressure off of "proving" something against him, and puts the subject inbetween where you can show him that you are really trying to be objective. You can agree with part of an argument, and disagree/disprove the rest, if that is right.

  (BTW, so far no one has been able to give me a convincing argument to overcome the hurdles for JW doctrines.)

  With my JW friend, I plant certain attitudes/ideas in ways she can accept. For example, we've discussed North Korea (which she doesn't know too much about, unfortunately). The advantage of withholding information from the citizens results in their being convinced that Americans are babykillers, N. Korea is paradise on earth, and their leader is God. "If only N. Koreans had telephones or TVs! They don't, of course, as that would spoil the mirage. But if they did--and if they started to use them! How long do you think that they'd keep on believing that they lived in paradise? Or that their leader is God?"

  The result was that I could show her that when we don't have enough information--or that we've been given bad information--we can be seriously misled.

  So, stress to him when it seems appropriate, that you are NOT interested in basing your opinions and arguments on falsehoods and rumors. You want to have enough information, and you want to be sure it is GOOD information. Establish that as your attitude, and challenge him to show you if what you've run into is false (if shouldn't matter the source as long as the information is TRUE, right??). Remind him of this, if he begins to backpedal.

  Good luck, and let us know when anything develops further. As for me and my friend, we're supposed to be discussing the trinity booklet sometime... It keeps getting postponed.

  bebu