WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon 865 Replies latest social current

  • dubla
    dubla

    search-

    okay...your post assumes quite a bit, but ill reply to what i can, with my personal opinions.

    How is it that if the administration knew that the order had been given to deploy chemical weapons, they did not know where these WMD would be stored?

    i never heard that the administration "knew that the order had been given".....i remember announcements that it was possible, but i dont remember them saying they knew for a fact....either youre twisting the facts here, or i just completely missed it....in which case a link might be helpful.

    When the US bribed senior military officers not to defend Baghdad and gave them safe passage out of Iraq, why was the location of these chemical weapons not provided to the US as part of the payoff plan?

    i didnt even know that had been confirmed. again, a link might help here.

    Could the Iraqi officers deploy WMD without knowing where to go and get them?

    i dont see how.

    And remember, it has been reported that Iraq had the capability of deploying WMD within 45 minutes of that command. Someone had to know where to go to obey that command. Didn't they?

    again, i dont know that any of those reports of "orders" have ever been confirmed. links?

    If the Collin Powell telephone intercepts presented to the UN were authentic, why couldn't the intelligence community trace the location of these intercepts and secure those sites after the invasion of Iraq?

    perhaps youre a little bit naive in the ways of tracing cell phone satellite intercepts....or perhaps i am. maybe you could provide some facts showing that this would be possible? im unaware of it.

    And whatever happened to those big missiles he showed us?

    which missiles? a link please?

    How is it that the administration was able to know the whereabouts of Saddam and launch the initial bunker attack that started the war, and yet this "source" within the inner circle of power never provided WMD location data that was crucial not only to safety of the world but to the safety of our military personnel who were about to invade Iraq?

    i think youre smart enough to know the answer to this one; maybe you just asked it for fun. getting a leak from downtown baghdad, say a person walking on the street that just witnessed saddam and his senior officials entering a building, is quite a bit different than that same person just happening to notice someone working on a secret chemical weapons site.....wouldnt you say? some of these assertions are so far out in left field that im hoping youre just kidding.

    Now this same administration says we must be patient because it will take time to find these WMD that they used to know the whereabouts of, but must now guess and search.

    ive covered this one with simon, and i think the entire antiwar crowd simply ignores my responses to this one....sort of a "hands over the ears" tactic. the fact is that we didnt know exactly where anything was before the war, and never claimed to. colin powell presented what was supposedly wmd sites that had been cleaned and moved (to where? no one ever said) before the war. was powells intelligence accurate? i dont think that has been established yet....maybe, maybe not. either way, no one ever claimed to know the exact whereabouts of the sites before the war.....if they would have, it wouldve been simple to bomb the hell out of them, i would think.

    Ahmed Chalabi and other sources insist that Saddam Hussein is still alive and hiding in Iraq. It seems to me if that is true, then surely he and his surviving supporters know where to get the remaining WMD and use them against the occupying forces.

    if that is true, then yes, id agree with you....to an extent. the country is currently being run by the u.s and u.k., so it would be pretty difficult to get to these weapons, i would think. but possibly if there was a remote enough location.

    Are our soldiers in danger?

    could very well be. chalabi has also stated that saddam is offering a bounty for any dead soldiers, so if his story is true, i think we would have to assume a certain amount of danger.....especially with conventional weapons.

    How is it that a nuclear waste site was left unguarded and subject to looting without regard to possible contamination, even as the US military previously found and guessed this site was part of the "secret" nuclear weapons program?

    actually the site you speak of, al tuwaitha, was a known nuclear site, not a "secret" site as you said. how was it left unguarded? someone dropped the ball.....a pretty scary drop too, considering the implications. i saw a stat on that, something like 98% of the materials had been found/recovered, but still, definitely a mistake in planning somewhere up the line.

    After the capture of various Iraqi high officials and scientists, how is it that no WMD locations have been revealed thus far? Are these officials so uncooperative and able to resist all interrogation that there is no hope of getting answers?

    well, i think they did lead them to the only find so far, the mobile biolabs......and i know there are a large number of sites being searched on an ongoing basis just on these leads alone. some of them probably do resist interrogation, but i would think that wed find something off of their leads.....if we dont eventually, then my beliefs about the extent of saddams wmd will be proven to be exaggerated. i certainly dont think im above being incorrect on the amounts he had left........after all, ive never seen any of his wmd first hand, its only been logic and common sense thats lead me to my opinion on it.

    If as Rumsfeld now claims, Iraq may have destroyed the WMD at the last possible moment in order to embarrass the US, how is it that satellite photos and other intelligence technology failed to notice such large scale efforts? Wouldn't it take major activity and trailers, and Lord knows what else, to destroy the vast quantities of chemical weapons supposedly in stock? And how were these destroyed? Burned and incinerated? Would not the air quality samples around Iraq reflect these chemicals and toxic substances? What about soil and water samples? Didn't we have air sensors deployed with our troops to detect and warn about poisons in the air?

    i dont buy that claim, personally.

    Why is the US not interested in casualty statistics in Iraq?

    i hadnt seen this.....links?

    Still, I have to ask: If we knew where it was, why don't we know where it is?

    again, no one ever claimed, going into war, that they knew the exact whereabouts of anything, other than sites that had already been cleaned free of wmd, and "suspected" sites. pretty simple, but im sure youll deny it just as the rest of your crowd has.

    These shouldn't be that hard to explain to a stupid conspiracy theorist like me....should they?

    when did i ever call you a conspiracy theorist? are you into conspiracy theories? i dont even know.

    now that ive answered your questions one by one....i have a couple for you to answer...and im really hoping to hear something reasonable, as ive yet to get decent answers on these.

    1) if saddam destroyed all of his wmd, as he claims, why could he not show where and how this was done? as hans blix said, mustard gas isnt marmalade, youre supposed to know what you did with it.......yet iraq couldnt ever show documentation on this mass destruction. maybe it wasnt important? to me, it should have been a very simple matter of saying "they were destroyed on XX dates, and here is the sites they were destroyed on....heres the proof"

    2) if saddam didnt have any wmd, why did he put his country through over a decade of sanctions? why not let inspectors in years ago, proving what hes claimed all along, that he doesnt have any left? why play games for 12 years, if there was nothing there to hide?

    aa

  • Realist
    Realist

    hello dubla,

    just noticed this comment of yours:

    perhaps youre a little bit naive in the ways of tracing cell phone satellite intercepts....or perhaps i am. maybe you could provide some facts showing that this would be possible? im unaware of it.

    as far as i know the russians located the chechnyan leader via his cell phone and killed him with a GPS guided missile while he was still on the phone.

  • dubla
    dubla

    pleasure-

    yes that's right, i'm just as full of $hit as you are.

    youve got me beat by a long shot. at least ive provided solid sources from respected indivuals in their field.......all youve provided is blather, conjecture, and "scooby doo"-like mystery possibilities.

    aa

  • Trauma_Hound
    Trauma_Hound
    "scooby doo"-like mystery possibilities.

    You mean, like the still non-existant WMD? You people can go round and round, but this is the one fact that still remains, there has been NO WMD found yet.

  • dubla
    dubla

    realist-

    as far as i know the russians located the chechnyan leader via his cell phone and killed him with a GPS guided missile while he was still on the phone.

    ive heard this, and ive also heard that a lot of the terrorists are using cell phones and equimpent now that are much harder to trace, and even intercept. im far from an expert in technology, so maybe someone else could jump in here and shed some light on it....like i said, maybe im the naive one. do you have any facts about the current technology? as search asked, would it have been reasonable that we couldve simply pinpointed the location of the people on that tape powell presented? that still wouldnt prove they were calling from the weapons sites, but id be interested to know regardless.

    aa

  • dubla
    dubla

    t h-

    You people can go round and round, but this is the one fact that still remains, there has been NO WMD found yet.

    i agree....and im happy to just wait it out until the issue answers itself....but there are posters on here bound and determined to continue discussing it on a daily basis, so i just humor them by keeping a voice from the other side on here.......otherwise its "looks like the prowar crowd is silent all of a sudden, LOL".

    aa

  • rem
    rem

    It doesn't matter if we don't find any WoMD... I don't understand why this is such a difficult concept to understand. We went to war because Iraq failed to meet its obligations under several UN resolutions over a period of over a decade. The implication of that noncompliance was that Saddam was still a threat to both his neighbors, the US and our alies, and that his posession of WoMD was an extremely high probability. All he had to do was comply. He didn't. Other dictators will now think twice before stringing the civilized world along for over a decade. Now if we can only get Israel in compliance....

    rem

  • Pleasuredome
    Pleasuredome

    what you spout out dubla is regurgitated BS from politicians, there's nothing solid about that. and links to what so-called 'respected individuals', means we have to believe whatever they say does it, even when they cant back up what they say?

    to suggest that publishing this material if it is 'a how to' manual, would allow rogue countries to build nukes is completely absurd. do you think the US, Israel, Russia with all the technology wouldn't know that it was happening, if they tried to do it? do you think that these nations dont know how to do it already? no of course not, dubla, 'cos most of these nations aren't white then they're going to be a bit thick and not as mentally advanced as those living in the US. there you are, a black and white view for a black and white person. hope you enjoy living in your black and white world.

    you're the one who's always talking about this crap. your posts span over 22 pages, and you dont humour, you just bore the pants off people. reading your posts is like watching CNN.

    i dont agree with thichi or jayson on subjects like this, but at least they put a bit of style and charisma in their posts.

    usually it's not what you say, it's the way you say it and incessently argue with people, like you did with simon. you cant prove anything, so give it a rest. but no, anyone who comes on here with different opinion to yours has to go through the dubla treatment of the endless slime of official stories and quotes with no proof.

  • Realist
    Realist

    rem,

    this time i have to dis agree with you.

    you said:

    The implication of that noncompliance was that Saddam was still a threat to both his neighbors, the US and our alies, and that his posession of WoMD was an extremely high probability.

    hussein posed a threat to his neighbors? whom? to the US and its allies? how??????? this guy had NOTHING!

    All he had to do was comply. He didn't.

    how do you know that? because Bush says so?

    even if he didn't comply...what gives the US the right to attack a sovereign country without a shred of solid evidence that hussein worked together with al queda.?

    Now if we can only get Israel in compliance....

    for that you only have to throw out 50% of your congress man and advisors to the president first!

  • rem
    rem

    Realist,

    hussein posed a threat to his neighbors? whom? to the US and its allies? how??????? this guy had NOTHING!

    Were those blanks he was shooting at US and UK aircraft patroling the no-fly zone?

    how do you know that? because Bush says so?

    Because that's the reason there were so many UN resolutions. Do you honestly believe Saddam was complying? The last resolution, 1441, was very explicit in what was required. It was his last chance and he blew it, providing outdated and incorrect information in his report. He did not comply. He thought the world was bluffing yet again. We were not bluffing, though it seems many European nations still were.

    If the everyone would have united and required compliance perhaps war could have been avoided. Even France admitted that the only reason Saddam was complying at all (not enough to meet his obligations) was because of the threat of force by the US. Let's not re-write history.

    for that you only have to throw out 50% of your congress man and advisors to the president first!

    Maybe. Or maybe since Israel is a democratic nation they can change their government on their own, which will in turn lead to other changes in policy which today bring them out of compliance. The Iraqi's didn't have that opportunity.

    rem

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