How to help my son escape

by rebel 13 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • rebel
    rebel

    The quote below was on another thread but I was afraid it would get lost.

    "As a side note - if anyone can help me and tell me how to broach the subject of my drifting away to my youngest son, I would be so grateful.. What do I tell him? He asks why I don't go to meetings any more. He is so concerned and thinks I am in danger of dying at Armageddon. How do I start explaining things to him. I want to get him out of this hateful cult, but I do not want to hurt him. "

    xxR

    My son is such a good boy but he is torn between me and his dad. I think he will feel disloyal to discuss the society in a negative light. Any sugestions on how to approach this (bear in mind that I dragged my family into this mess)

    XXR

  • blondie
    blondie

    rebel, I don't have the dilemma you do, because my husband "saw the light" at the same time I did. It doesn't sound like your son is seeing anything at the KH that he finds out of harmony with the Bible, e.g., lack of love, hypocrisy, etc. There are several on here with spouses that are still fairly faithful but have been quietly feeding them information that makes them question and think deeply about what the WTS says and what it actualy "does." Minimus' wife is now reading COC. He might have some suggestions.

    If your son isn't unhappy with the way things are, he won't be too open to anything negative.

    We are fading and don't want to get into discussions with JWs. We have been avoiding phone calls and unannounced visits. If cornered, we will just say we are happy with the way things are, are studying the Bible and praying more than ever in our lives, and we are confident that a loving God will not destroy those who love him the best way they can. We are secure in having God be our judge not humans.

    Blondie (getting calls from JWs she hasn't heard from in over 4 years and who never had time for her then)

  • jgnat
    jgnat

    This link might help.

    http://www.freeminds.org/psych/exithelp.htm

    I find talking to a JW who is devoted to the WTS to be a delicate balancing act. The WTS does not respect free will, and uses many coercive methods to gather people in and keep them in. You, by example, must behave very differently. Respect your son's decision on how he choses to live his life. Present other ideas, but do not be insistent that he believe as you do. Demonstrate love and acceptance for him always.

    ...and to allay his fears, regularly reinforce with him that you love Jehovah, you know he loves Jehovah deeply, and you will never leave him or forsake him. In time, you may be able to explain that your love DOES NOT extend to the human-run organization of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.

  • Gamaliel
    Gamaliel

    rebel,

    I don't know how old the boy it sounds like he is sweet and impressionable and loves his parents. I think you know that the JWs have a bit of an advantage over children like this. Children want to be rewarded for doing what's right. The father can capitalize on that need, especially since the boy has only a youthful perception of the JWs. (It may be years before more serious issues can be looked at deeply by him, and by then, you know that the control mechanisms and his own group survival instincts will have been played upon for too long.)

    I don't mean to imply that you will sit idly by while he is indoctrinated but this indoctrination can lead to very serious consequences and the measures taken to guard your son should be that much stronger.

    The JWs can quite blatantly make a child hate a parent -- and couch that hatred in terms of love. (Having your eternal interests at heart.) At an impressionable age, it wouldn't be fair to the boy to allow him to keep heading down a road that might get him stuck forever. It may even be worse if he's stuck for 18 years and something finally hurts him and makes him realize that he should have never been fooled. He could end up wondering then why you didn't do more. It is akin to sending a child to prison for a crime he didn't commit, and the child finally gets let out and realizes how much of his life has been stolen and wasted. Although the risk is fortunately small, there are also certain life-threatening dangers he may face within the WTS walls that he might not face outside. The biggest one is the pressure to avoid medical care involving blood. Also, the options for good education are minimized. It's tempting to think of the JW morality as making him safer inside the Watchtower "box," but the people who will have the greatest influence on him will have a very narrow view of "success" which minimizes his opportunities to live a full and truly successful and enjoyable life.

    If the situation allows for it, I would have a lot of private talks with him (your little secret) designed to make him think about how people get fooled by controlling people, politicians, presidents, dictators, religions, etc. Believe it or not, a lot of the material he needs can be selected from right inside the Watchtower and Awake magazines, even the Bible itself -- if you are looking for a source that he considers unimpeachable. That might be a lot slower route than a few choice "apostate" Web sites or books, but it might fit the situation. Will he and your husband respect your right to talk about religion with him? Can it be done without downgrading him or his father for their religious choices?

    Personally, I'd start with a route that discusses advertising and propaganda. Calling something "The Best" or "The Truth" can be seen as very similar in terms of marketing and "mind-share". You can tell him about the features of controlling religions like the Moonies, Scientologists, Mormons without ever mentioning the JWs (unless he asks !!). The Amy Smart case has brought up the perfect opening to discuss whether there is a such thing as "brainwashing" or if it is merely a very high level of zeal/fanaticism for an idea or religion. The "religion of Capitalism" works through repetition of phrases on TV, for example, that you aren't supposed to think much about, but that you hear week after week after week.

    If he is school-age, there are gong to be many opportunities to point out the parts of stories or articles that highlight the importance of breaking out of a rut, thinking independently, freedom from all forms of slavery. If one parent shows a healthy respect for ideas and people that a JW parent would not likely say anything good about, that is going to leave an impression. If disasters happen in parts of the world and someone is apt to worry only about JWs there, you can make it clear that you are concerned about the others, too. I think a parent on the lookout for opportunities could even take a vocabulary list and sow seeds of freedom. (Can you say "myopic"? What does it mean to be open-minded? etc. etc.)

    You may not be in a good position to take it to the next step yet, but if you are sure he is getting the point about OTHER groups and religions and organizations, then I wouldn't hesitate to drive the point home about the dishonesty of the WTS. The JWs are hypocritically anxious to point out how no one should want to be involved with any religion or organization that has been dishonest, or that has covered things up. I'm sure this could drive a wedge where you don't want it, but your opinion has to be valid, too. If a son grows up where only one parent's ideas are respected, it's a disservice to the child's own ability to grow up and form happy family relationships.

    Gamaliel

  • Maverick
    Maverick

    Gamaliel has chosen his user name well, rebel. These inquires may be coached by a respected adult J-dud. They see no moral dilemma in using the child to 'find you out'. Or to separate this child from you. I did not take action when this happened to me between my J-dud Ex and my then 13 year old daughter who I have custody over. We still have problems with 'the religion' as my baby calls it. The ex wife lays all manner of guilt and mental maneuvers on my now 18 year old girl! I step in now, took the kid half way round the world to give her a break. I am sure there are people here who can help you...listen to them. I wish you peace, Maverick

  • blackout
    blackout

    Why dont you try just reading the bible with him and pointing out your point of view of what the scriptures mean, this way he will feel safe as he trusts the bible and he trusts you and your husband cant oppose it. This will help him to reason and look at things in a different light.

    I feel for you as it can be very difficult, but remember your child will always love you.

  • jgnat
    jgnat

    *Ahem* this child is 20 years old...

  • LB
    LB

    I've felt that asking questions is one of the best ways to get friends or family members to understand. For example you can ask your son "what did Christ say is the identifying charaterisic of his followers". Of course the answer would be "By the love shown among the brothers". Then a little comment such as "I have troulbe seeing that all too often.

  • rebel
    rebel

    Thanks fo your input guys.

    As jgnat pointed out, he is 20 now, but a very naive 20. He doesn't like confrontation and hates to upset anyone. He is really a sweet kid but I worry about him.

    I take on board what you all say. My eldest says I should leave him to make up his own mind. I think I should, but I don't want him to get hurt. The more I find out about this organisation, the more worried I get. I'd hate for him to get in deeper, such as become an MS. He is well liked in the congregation and very popular. I panic when I think of him marrying a JW and bringing up his kids as JWs. Mabe I should just mind my own business.

    I have tried to look at it this way. If he feels he can serve God by being a JW, then I should let him. It's just that he hates it when the elders come down on me for non-meeting attendance. He will be gutted if/when they DF or DA me, which I feel is only a matter of time. I haven't done anything worthy of being DFd, but I have seen them do this to someone else who hadn't done anything other than not go to meetings. I won't be going to the Memorial which will annoy our PO even more. He said he 'expects' to see me there (message relayed via my husband). I told my husband to tell him to go and boil his head!

    xxR

  • Gamaliel
    Gamaliel

    rebel

    He's 20? Scratch almost everything I said. When you said your youngest was such a good boy, torn between you and his dad, I remembered one of your recent posts about how your husband was so much stricter with issues like karate, Scouts, school music shows, etc.

    I was hoping he was still under 16. I have a 10, 15 and 17 year old and I know less now about dealing with teenagers than I did before I got married . But that never stopped me from trying to give advice before.

    Is he baptized? Ministerial Servant? Indoctrinated? In college? Pioneering? Working? Internet-savvy? At home? Independent? Dating? Married? Does he have "worldly friends?" At 20, most JWs are oblivious to most JW issues. Things that happened even 25 years ago in the JW's might as well have been 1,000 years ago; they'll make no difference. If he's not a serious student of the doctrines (and at his age, there is no encouragement to delve too deeply), he won't worry about any doctrinal issues.

    He is of an age where he might get hurt by Kingdom Hall class systems. You've mentioned the lack of association between the affluent and the non-affluent. The "position class" and the prejudice they have toward non-positioned JWs. These problems can have a great influence on JW dating. (If he's not dating, encourage the Internet!!) If he's studying in college, ask what he's learning, and focus on philosophy, sociology, history -- there are thousands of jumping off points to draw parallels with the Society or JW religion.

    I like LB's idea about asking questions. Many questions are quite legitimate for JWs to consider and the questions themselves do not put the Society in a "negative light"?

    Ask him point blank what he thinks about the blood issue and if he knew that a lot of JWs have dared to speak out against it, and it actually appears to have made the Society change their view. Ask if he thinks that this is right. Should these JWs have spoken out? (It's a question where either answer forces independent thinking. If No, then why might the Society have begun restating their position? Also, if it's not OK, then what if the people speaking out were part of the remnant, (by WTS definition, the remnant is the faithful and discreet slave, even if they just became JWs in Belgium, Bulgaria, Burma or Mozambique. Would it have been OK for one of these "FDS" to speak out?) Also, does he know what blood factors he or his JW friends might be allowed to take (without getting into any trouble) in the event of an emergency, or would he leave that up to the Hospital Liaison Committee? You can express your motherly worry that these JW laws are getting so complex that you wonder if even the men on the HLC have kept up.

    I also think that living in the 21st century gives exJWs a great new opportunity to chip away at what is becoming a larger psychological crack in the Watchtower. I have some material I prepared a few years ago for a Website. When I find it I'll post it in another thread.

    Gamaliel

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