144,000

Bruce144

Hl GIANCULA,

The signs and wonders that Jehovah gave us, added to the Bible writings completes the Bible's outline directed to us. By using the animals representing certain people it just makes it easier to understand Jehovah's direction.

Besides this, the number 144,000 stands alone with its exact numbeerrneeded in heaven. Its quite clear that they are brought to heaven only after the places are prepared. Only after the places were prepared by Michael, could Jesus call the 12 apostles to their 12 thrones after sitting on his own throne. Just the fact that the 12 apostles are the foundation stones of the 144,000 makes then an elite group chosen from the earth to replace the fallen angels

To insist that the 144,000 are all Jews or just a large symbolic number is pushing the truth beyond the boundaries of sound biblical understanding.

aChristian

: To insist that the 144,000 are ... a large symbolic number is pushing the truth beyond the boundaries of sound biblical understanding.

Why is that, Bruce? The number 144,000 is, after all,the product of what you believe are two symbolic numbers. Is it not? 12 X 12,000. The number 12 being the number of the tribes of spiritual Israel. (Spiritual Israel is not divided into 12 literal tribes.) And the number 12,000 being the number of people Revelation says are taken from each of those non-literal tribes. Thus the number 12,000 is also a symbolic number.

If you don't mind me asking, what kind of math do you use to multiply one symbolic number by another and by so doing produce a literal
number?

Farkel

: Why is that, Bruce? The number 144,000 is, after all,the product of what you believe are two symbolic numbers. Is it not?

Bruce never cared about facts, and he's not about to start now. He has two and only two issues that HE feels are of utmost value:

1) The 144,000 (including him) are replacements for "fallen angels." (That sure affects MY life and the lives of 6 billion other people, huh? :) )

2) How many "clean" and "unclean" animals actually went into the non-existent ark and survived the non-existent flood.

That's it. And THAT is what your salvation depends upon, according to Bruce's postings. If he thought differently, he would talk about other things, but on a thread with a title of say, "Ten Ways to Avoid Flatulence," Bruce would work into his reply the 144,000 replacing the fallen angels. I've seen him do it a million times and my mother told me several billion times to never exaggerate.

Farkel

P.S. He also believes that the WTS got a number of major things right. If that alone doesn't convince you he's goofy, then nothing else will. :)

Sozo

I've gotta say that the many of the teachings are so off base and the only 144,000 going to heaven is one of them.

Please read the entire chapter book of Revelation and I believe you will walk away with questions needing answered.

This is the last book that prophecy will be fulfilled. Those who have said Yes to Christ being their Lord/Savior await for His return and His calling to come up. Yes, the rapture, I know the word doesn't exist but Christ does say that "in a twinkling of an eye" we will meet Him in the clouds. Those who are living and don't go to meet Christ will be left behind on earth and go through the Tribulation. The antichrist comes to rule the earth and all mankind will be under him, one religion, one world currency, one world government - he will sign a peace treaty for 7 years and all mankind will believe this is it but only God releases the seals and bowls upon mankind - to get man's attention to turn to Him!

The 144,000 are selected members from the 12 tribes (that is true), God knows who these men will be. They will be instructed to go throughout the earth to proclaim Christ. These men will be sealed and protected - no one can harm them and only until they have completed God's tasks will they be called up to heaven.

In Revelation - God will also send 2 great prophets to earth where they will be seen only in the areas where Christ was and they too will proclaim Christ in the streets - many will attempt to kill these 2 but will not succeed. When they have completed what God wants them to do then they will be killed and lay in the streets for 3 days for all mankind to see and they too will be brought back to heaven.

In Revelation there are only 2 areas where the 144,000 are mentioned. But in many areas of the bible God promises that those who accept Christ will go to heaven. Christ says that if we do, he will prepare a place for us - there are many rooms in heaven! Those who say Yes will reign along side with Christ.

aChristian

: But in many areas of the bible God promises that those who accept Christ will go to heaven. Christ says that if we do, he will prepare a place for us - there are many rooms in heaven! Those who say Yes will reign along side with Christ.

How do you reconcile your belief with Rev 5:10, which says in all translations of the Bible, except the JW NWT, that those who will rule as kings and priests with Christ will do so "on the earth"?

Sozo

After the Tribulation ends, Christ and His kingdom from heaven will come down on earth and reign for 1000 years, this is found in Rev. 20, satan will be released for only a short period of time and then he will be thrown into the lake of fire. To answer your question is simple - that all who reign with Christ in heaven - will reign with Christ on earth as well.

JWs don't give Christ the credit he deserves being the Lamb of God he is. They assume that they will cultivate the earth and live happily ever after...........they are soooooo wrong.

JanH

Bruce never cared about facts, and he's not about to start now. He has two and only two issues that HE feels are of utmost value

Wasn't there something about bigfoot as well, or am I confusing several loonies here?

- Jan

Edited by - JanH on 21 March 2001 10:25:5

Bruce144

Hi Lurker,

I have asked the question many times, why me ?? Until I was 50 years old I had over 100 jobs. everything was just so much fun and games. I had given up on religion except for the fact the Society could not count to 14. Then in 1984 when I received the message about the animal's my life took a completely change. My aggressiveness became overbearing and I hounded the elders and GB. When ALS hit I was stopped dead in my tracks. I truly belief that Jehovah allowed it to happen so that I could find other avenues to spread the news. The Internet was the way now being used. This news about the fallen angels must be made known. My temporary impairment will only add to the joy of replacing a fallen angel.

ICHING

bruce - i dont care what anyone says you sound very spiritual to me - and i believe you are one of the 144,000 and will enjoy freedom and life everlasting as a son of GOD.

too bad for the fallen angel but lucky for you - oops sorry that's right i'm not allowed to believe in luck.

i'm looking into your noahs ark/my book of bible stories conspiracy theory - you might be onto something there.

bruce i know this is off the track a bit but i believe that as one of the 144,000 chosen ones of christs brothers you may be able to help me

i know the faithful and discreet slave class (144,000) dispenses food to gods people at the right time

so my question is :

in what ways does the Writing Committee consult with the faithful and discreet slave in the dispensation of the spiritual food?

do you guys send in a report every month specifying what is now "food at the proper time"

how does it work - how do all of you who are of the anointed remanant communicate the proper food to the writing department?

i've never had any of the elders explain this to me in a way that made any sense -

and you are the first person i've "met" believe it or not of the annointed remnant

thanks in advance for your reply bruce

I-CHING

Edited by - iching on 21 March 2001 9:49:21

Edited by - iching on 21 March 2001 9:53:17

dark clouds

hey Bruce
Dark Cloud here, dont mean to hang over you, but i have a queston that perhaps you can answer being one of the annointed class members who will goto heaven. along with iching, i too, in my 20 years in the "service", never had the opportunity to have any kind of conversation with a member of your class. so if you can field this.
I remember being taught that physical matter had no place in heaven and that when we died we went into the earth to decompose because we had no spirit, we WERE souls, i believe this doctrine was reiterated in the red book, you can live forever and in the blue pocket one called truth, so my question is this, if indeed we are souls with no spirit, when you bruce, pass from this realm, what part of you exactly is going to meet jesus in heaven?
question #2, where exactly did you get the number of fallen angels from, is this a literal swap, eye for an eye, 144 for 144? cause no where that i remember, not even in the book of enoch and the fallen angels do i recall seeing this number.
question #3, yahweh created man, thus he knows us intimately, i would say inside and out, exactly how does he need mans help in heaven? what can we tell him that he may not know?
from the inquiring class left on earth
CHUCK

144,000

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