Do you think you should have the right to decline business on Personal or Religious grounds?

by PokerPlayerPhil 16 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  DJS

  Thanks Onager for catching this.

  Yes it should be. A bit more about the way things work:

  Last week I completed the annual ethics' training for my company, which has an international footprint. One of the policies specifically prohibits discriminating against anyone in hiring, promoting or doing business with because of sexual preference, transgender, etc. in addition to the usual suspects (religion, race, etc.). I am certain that the official policies of nearly every major US business are similar. These companies are not going to change policies regardless of the SCOTUS' actions or state laws.

  Once the x-tian bakery in Oregon loses out on a major bakery job because of their hate filled policies, it will be interesting to see how strong their beliefs. Losing business to a few gays and lesbians won't hurt them; losing business, because of their hateful policies, to Fortune 500 companies and those with deep pockets is a horse of a different color.

  I am certain that the high profile national and international businesses located in that Oregon city, if they don't already have them, are crafting policies that enable them to not do business with businesses such as this bakery. That's how businesses work; they understand the potential harm to their public image, they consult legal, craft policies and silently begin implementing them.

  Methinks the X-tian bakers will lose some of their religion once Nike, Columbia, FLIR and other companies stop buying cakes and other sweets from this bakery based on their policies. Although this isn't exactly what Adam Smith was thinking about when he discussed the "Invisible Hand" that controls economics, this is the 21st Century version of it. Regardless of what SCOTUS determines soon, we will see these things occurring.
• 

  done4good

  The law aside, (which is quite clear, btw...), I even knew many JWs that owned businesses and performed work for churches, performed wedding services, such as photography in churches, etc., years ago. Even hardcore JWs understood the law, and complied.

  This should be a non-issue at the state legislation level. The1993 Freedom of Religion Act, has been highjacked and twisted for a use that it was never intended for, by right wing nutjobs, who know nothing of history or the Constitution.

  d4g
  
• 

  Giordano

  http://blogs.findlaw.com/free_enterprise/2014/02/can-your-business-legally-refuse-to-serve-gays.html

  "With a patchwork of federal, state, and local laws in place regarding the rights of gays and lesbians in public accommodations -- i.e., most businesses that are open to the public -- the issue can get a bit confusing.

  Here is a general overview of what business owners need to know:

  Federal Law and Private Businesses

  Title II of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 -- the federal law which prohibits discrimination by private businesses which are places of public accommodation -- only prevents businesses from refusing service based on race, color, religion, or national origin. Federal law does not prevent businesses from refusing service to customers based on sexual orientation.

  This is true both for customers and employees of private businesses, although forces in Congress have been attempting to pass laws which protect gay and lesbian employees for decades.

  So if there are no state or local laws to the contrary, private business owners may legally choose to refuse service to customers based on their sexual orientation -- and some have publicly done so.

  State, Local Anti-Discrimination Laws

  However in some states like California and New York, discrimination based on sexual orientation by private businesses is prohibited by state law. In many of these states, bona fide religious organizations and religious non-profits have been exempted from these laws when they conflict with their religious beliefs; private businesses are not exempt.

  Even in states which do not prohibit refusing service to gays -- like Texas or Arizona -- local laws or ordinances in specific cities may prevent LGBT discrimination. This may be part of the reason for Arizona's controversial SB 1062, a bill which would reinforce the ability of private business owners to refuse to serve gays and lesbians based on religious beliefs.

  
  
  
• 

  DJS

  Thanks Giordano,

  Like Indiana, a number of state legislatures, which are typically disproportionately filled with X-tian fundies, have passed or are trying to pass hate legislation. They have to know that the laws will likely be determined unconstitutional. Now they know that corporate America has its own way to effect change.

  Either way, it is hate masquerading as X-tian theology. It will interesting to watch it all play out, but the same haters were doing exactly the same thing when civil rights' laws were being passed and enforced decades ago. They are just hating a different group now.
• 

  OrphanCrow

  Maybe someday in the future, when society has evolved beyond cave man thinking, those religious institutions that promote hatred of gays and other marginalized groups will lose their tax exemptions if their doctrines promote hatred and discrimination.

  In an ideal world, a religion that bans gays and promotes misogynist behavior would no longer be able to hide under the religious banner for tax purposes.
• 

  DJS

  OrphanCrow,

  Excellent comment. I've often thought that the same could be said for the Dark Lords' DFing policy. Destroying families can't be in the vested interest of governments. It has to hurt the economy and stress health care, etc. It is hate speech/actions. We need a few liberal EU countries to establish laws against it, and the dominoes will begin to fall. Thanks again.
• 

  Clambake

  If I were that baker in Indiana , I would have said sure , for 2 million dollars.

  Honestly a little common sense would sure go along ways sometimes. If someone doesn't want your business, just don't give it to them. It is not like it was an essential service.

  Is it just me or does it seem like the Gay and Lesbian community have more of a pre-occupation with the religious right than the other way around.