Thought provoking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a42RHVmnUAA&feature=uploademail
The Value of a Godless World
by cantleave 109 Replies latest jw friends
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sizemik
Mmmmm . . . thought provoking indeed.
Living forever reduces the meaning/value of life to . . . nothing?
It's got wheels, but I need to ponder this more.
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PSacramento
History teaches us the with values, everything is permissible.
A godless world will only be a place where one can live if the "godlike' values are still there.
History has shown us what happens when we misapply "god"( inquisition), when we remove "god" (Communisim) and in both cases, it is NOT a desirable outcome is it?
Its fine to think of a godless world where the "godlike morals and principles" still help us to determine right and wrong, what is from what ought to be.
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cantleave
Sizemik - I know what you mean, I am not sure I am in full agreement with the premise, but I cant point to any specific reason.
Psac - I agree entirely!
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PSacramento
As a Christian to me the issue is CAN we DO IT without God?
I believe we are designed to do it WITH God and that moment we, all swollen and pugffed up with pride, believe we can do it without God is when we drop the ball. Bigtime.
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wobble
If thinking right and living right means I have got P. Sacs god in my life, even though I see no evidence for him/her, then O.K
I drop the ball when I go against my own moral compass.
I see more value in a world without "Religion", I know P. Sac and others will say "Communism tried that and failed" but that is a rather simplistic view of why Communism failed, and anyway religion was still there, and still is in other regimes that don't particularly like it , China and North Korea for example.
Religions are a way to control and enslave peoples minds and hearts, I heard a Muslim lady say on the BBC World Service the other day that she had so many children, more than twenty I think, because God would have cursed her if she did not.
Suicide bombers, hate-filled Westborough Baptists, Northern Irish murderers are all fuelled by religion.
Up until the end of the ninteenth century people firmly believed in fairys, hence Arthur Conan Doyle being taken in by the fake photo's, if someone mislaid a shoelace, the fairys had taken it, people believed in these mythical creatures with a strength that probably exceeded their belief in God.
Education has moved us on, we no longer believe in fairys, we need to educate the whole world so that no one believes in the anthropomorphic Gods of religion.
Then we will have a World that is a much much better place.
Not all problems will be solved, but educate and liberate the minds of the majority of people, and a lot of the suffering we see will be gone.
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tec
The meaning/value of life is not attached to time. Not as I see it. So no matter how short or how long our lives are, even if infinite, the meaning of our individual lives is not affected.
Peace,
Tammy
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thinking_1
A godless world will only be a place where one can live if the "godlike' values are still there.
History has shown us what happens when we misapply "god"( inquisition), when we remove "god" (Communisim) and in both cases, it is NOT a desirable outcome is it?
I can understand what you mean PS, but maybe you feel that way because to you morals and God are inextricable. I think one can have a different reason for holding to the ideas behind "Godlike values" with just as much conviction because they see the value in being good to their fellow man.
I like quotes and here's a good one from ol' crazy hair:
The foundation of morality should not be made dependent on myth nor tied to any authority lest doubt about the myth or about the legitimacy of the authority imperil the foundation of sound judgment and action. ~Albert Einstein
Today, people are doubting the myth, the Communist leaders compromise their ligitimacy, so we have to say "I'm not going to hurt this other man, because. . .I wouldn't want him to hurt me." That "Golden Rule" is usually attributed to Jesus at the Sermon on the Mount, but I bet he wasn't the first to think it up ; ) -
PSacramento
I see more value in a world without "Religion", I know P. Sac and others will say "Communism tried that and failed" but that is a rather simplistic view of why Communism failed, and anyway religion was still there, and still is in other regimes that don't particularly like it , China and North Korea for example.
Communisim failed because they replaced God with Man, religion was not replaced, it was renamed "athieisim".
Religions are a way to control and enslave peoples minds and hearts, I heard a Muslim lady say on the BBC World Service the other day that she had so many children, more than twenty I think, because God would have cursed her if she did not.
Religions are man made ideologies that use 'GOD" to control the majority by the minority.
Suicide bombers, hate-filled Westborough Baptists, Northern Irish murderers are all fuelled by religion.
And none by God.
Up until the end of the ninteenth century people firmly believed in fairys, hence Arthur Conan Doyle being taken in by the fake photo's, if someone mislaid a shoelace, the fairys had taken it, people believed in these mythical creatures with a strength that probably exceeded their belief in God.
Ok.
Education has moved us on, we no longer believe in fairys, we need to educate the whole world so that no one believes in the anthropomorphic Gods of religion.
Perhaps.
Then we will have a World that is a much much better place.
Not all problems will be solved, but educate and liberate the minds of the majority of people, and a lot of the suffering we see will be gone.
I have seen many an eductaed and liberated mind belong to a sociopathic killer.
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PSacramento
I can understand what you mean PS, but maybe you feel that way because to you morals and God are inextricable. I think one can have a different reason for holding to the ideas behind "Godlike values" with just as much conviction because they see the value in being good to their fellow man.
I have no problem with that.
I like quotes and here's a good one from ol' crazy hair:
The foundation of morality should not be made dependent on myth nor tied to any authority lest doubt about the myth or about the legitimacy of the authority imperil the foundation of sound judgment and action. ~Albert Einstein
Today, people are doubting the myth, the Communist leaders compromise their ligitimacy, so we have to say "I'm not going to hurt this other man, because. . .I wouldn't want him to hurt me."
That "Golden Rule" is usually attributed to Jesus at the Sermon on the Mount, but I bet he wasn't the first to think it up ; )
The golden rule was but the BEGINNING for Christ, not the end. Sometimes we forget that. Jesus reminded Us how important that rule was and THEN he commanded Us to go BEYOND it:
Matthew 5:43-48
New International Version (NIV)
Love for Enemies
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor [a] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.