by StandFirm 144 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
yknot wrote:
"Standfirm...however he felt 'mobbed' and he felt he couldn't do justice in responding to all. All in all he has an active account here and perhaps his return will be tempered to a comment here and there versus trying to spear-head larger topics that literally pit one man against many."
I agree with that.
Standfirm is looking to get laid by YKnot,HE also has the IQ of a rocking horse and is looking for the sympathy vote, NO CHANCE, when you come here, expect a robust response, ok son Im not going to go hard on you, but your under scrutiny here !!!
20571pnt428571 You have so much garbage in your reply post that I don't know where to start, other than to say that you did not reply to any of the very valid specifics of my earlier post.
Is this some kind of 'jedi mind trick' to avoid the blatant, numerous and so very obvious distortions and misrepresentations of what the scriptures actually say? You sound as a hater of The Church started by Jesus. Do you think that you have found the 'hidden truth' written in the scriptures. The 'hidden truth' that says, "NO!, The bible doesn't mean that"? There it is in black and white. Let me answer some of your quotes as to what the scriptures say and forgive the lengthy rebuttal. This is going to take too much time for me to answer everything that was copied and pasted.
No, we claim to have in our midst, the last of the legal group within Chrost's specific Kingdom covenant, which as a group, from the 12 to it's final number of 144000, have always been the means Christ communicated to the "other sheep" and the world at large.
Legal how? By a self proclaimed group that has no Jewish virgins in it's midsts? As a matter of fact, has not that group of self proclaimmed 'annoited' grown in numbers in recent years?
This is why so much confusion has been thrown out of Xtednom against the legal flock, by the illegal ones assuming to be able to enter the Heaven Covenant, by means of a broad road of many many religions claiming such a privelege as if it was some sort of given.
The legal flock can be traced from the apostles to today. Some 2000 years of documented proof, not a myth, but see the proof in the scriptures of Jesus building his church on Peter and the apostles. And that his church would last for all ages and gates of death shall not overcome it. And Peter is given the keys of heaven and Peter leads the church council in act 15 [even though James is the Bishop of Jerusalem]. The authority is in the scriptures, point blank, no room to wiggle out or around from that fact.
It is not, in fact like Christ himself, it is dependant on God's choosing not flesh and blood self-will, such as can be seen in the many many many many sects of Xtendom attempting to do this, including the GrandDaddy cult of all time in apostasy, the Catholic global error, which spawned the rest, in one way or another, to the point where Jehovah had to clarify a final warning before Har-magedon.
If your point is that Jesus is not God because of the scriptures that show his humanity, then you won't understand that Jesus Christ was a man, he was fully man. The only way to the Father is through the the Man, Jesus Christ. The bible is quite clear that Jesus is God, and that he gave up His glory and humbled himself to be a man. He was not always a man, but the scriptues are clear in that Jesus is unchanging and is the same today as yesterday and tomorrow. Is; 9;6 speaks of Jesus
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That is why they are called Jehovah's witnesses, speaking of all of Jehovah's truths which of course Xtendom, upon close inspection, has not gleaned 1 single truth concerning God, his name, his son, and his Kingdom, and are far from understanding the will of God, because they all, amidst this shattered house, teach their own will to gather the gullible.
Do I need to address the error in the name Jehovah? Even the WTS books admit that Yahwey is the more correct name and that isn't even a correct name. No one knows the true name of Father except the Son and those who the Son reveal his name to. Jehovah is a nick name at best.
The Truth:the "little flock" are the lead sheep, that brings in the rest. They are also, the only ones in that covenant, which is the provision to also recover ALL of the dead world Jesus bought.
The dead in the graves ALSO do not partake of emblems, they will partake of the REAL thing, the Last Adam, in blood (forgiveness/life) AND perfect body (bread of heaven, for earthlings).
(For real, in the flesh, were it's final meaning is applied, God's will on earth)
Twisting scriptures from here and there to come to that conclusion? Which scriptures would I read to get those ideas?
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This is an important bible truth, read carefully please...
God is not offering a house of mirrors is he? God is a God of order, he has ONE gate, ONE way, ONE truth, ONE Christ, not 2 billion who all think they are going to go through Christ, in that Kingdom capacity, for they are not, we have a gate way.
Hey, maybe you're not so bad, I agree with you.
What is it it? The way, the truth. The first thing is recognizing the truth, that God instituted a covenant with his son for a Kingdom. The son IN LIKE MANNER offered his brothers, a similar institution for Kingdom.
Jesus is the only Son of God. He has no real, physical brothers. He has spriritual brothers, he is "King of Kings" [rev19;13,16] and His kingdom has no end. It is eternal. Only God is the King of Kings and has an eternal kingdom, as we all know from the scriptures that there will be a new heaven and earth and Jerusalem, but his kingdom is forever. Of course, that's only if your read and believe what you read.
(Hebrews 8:6)...But now [Jesus] has obtained a more excellent public service, so that he is also the mediator of a correspondingly better covenant, which has been legally established upon better promises.
Yes, what that says is that Jesus has made a better covenant, with better promises for those whom are in his covenant. Heaven anyone?
Jesus is mediator to the little flock, which was to be the instrument by which Jesus "brings" in the whole.
Yes, he is the mediator for us all, not just the little flock, are you for real? Are you trying to insinuate that Jesus is the mediator only for the 144K. Of course scripture says that all men [or makekind] is eligible for salvation. Jesus paid for us all with HIS blood. We were made by him, through him and most importantly for Him [see Col] The scriptures futher say that all things were made for the glory of God====
(Luke 12:32)...“Have no fear, little flock, because YOUR Father has approved of giving YOU the kingdom.
(John 10:2-4)...But he that enters through the door is shepherd of the sheep. 3 The doorkeeper opens to this one, and the sheep listen to his voice, and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has got all his own out, he goes before them, and the sheep follow him, because they know his voice.
Again for what purpose later in the same scripture?
(John 10:16)...“And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.And how would they "listen to his voice"?
VERY IMPORTANT:
(John 17:20-21) 20 “I make request, not concerning these only (Little Flock), but also concerning those putting faith in me
THROUGH THEIR WORD;
21 in order that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, in order that the world may believe that you sent me forth.
These randon scriptural referrences have just wasted too much time and energy because, no matter what the bible says, you won't see it. The bible could say 'point blank' the word trinity or God is a trinity and you still would not believe. All the worship Jesus received [and still receives] you seem to find him unworthy of, the fact that scripture says to 'honor the Son the same as the Father' means the same to when Jesus said "I am". Means nothing to to folks who won;t believe the bible.
Is 43;11 God says 'I am the only Savior'
Acts 4;12 Speaking of Jesus Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."
People who twist scripture twist everything. It says what it says.
respectfully,
dc
1point-I haven't the time or inclination to address all of the bs that you have pasted and copied but to quote you
***The bible says what it says. Yes it does, and that is why I clarify these things FROM THE BIBLE.
That's right, the bible says what it says and if you [or anyone] ignores certain scripture because they're not to your liking, well that really doesn't make those scriptures or those questions go away, does it?
obiwon -"these are not the drones you're looking for"
stormtrooper-'these are not the drones we're looking for"
the bible shows the authority of the apostle Peter and the church that Jesus built for all ages. That Jesus would build his church on Peter. [mt 16;18]
That there is an unbroken line of bishops that have their direct authority from Jesus Christ himself as recorded in the bible. [ep 2 ;19-22]
Furthermore, the bible states explicitly as to the authority of Jesus Christ as Savior and God, not a god as all gods are false.[see Is 9;6 or rev 22;12-20]
The 1st generation Christians would confirm their priests, deacons, bishops by laying their hand on by the power of the Holy spirit [see Acts],
they would give alms to the poor, help the sick, the widows, the orphans. That's what they did. They would baptize entire families and households immediately or at once. That's what they did.
It is much easlier to take all of the scriptures into account lest you fall into error by placing one scripture over another.
dc
The early church did more than merely help sick people, widows and orphans. Starting with the Apostles and right through to this very day exist those who were persecuted and tortured to maintain the faith pure ... they are the living Acts of the Apostles in the Bible and continued in the marks of their bodies; in their martyrdoms. These Saints are the very proof people look for when looking for how the Euaggelio was spread across the world. Just read an excerpt of the condition of all the Bishops of the Church at the 325 Council ... only 11 had not been tortured to maintain the faith passed down to them.
The General Council having thus received authority from the king (Constantine I), the fathers directed that there should be gradations in the assembly and that each Bishop should sit in his place according to his rank. Chairs were there made for all and the king entered and sat with them. He kissed the spots which were the marks of Christ in their bodies.
Of the 318 fathers, only 11 were free from such marks, whose name were Absalom, Bishop of Edessa, and son of Mar Ephrem's sister, Jonah of Raikson, Mara of Dora, George of Shegar, Jacob of Nisibis, Marouta of Mepairkat, John of Goostia, Shimon of Diarbekir, Adai of Agal, Eusebius of Caesarea and Joseph of Nicomedia.
But all the others were more or less maimed in their persecutions from heretics.
Some had their eyes taken out; some had their ears cut off. Some had their teeth dug out by the roots. Some had the nails of their fingers and toes torn out; some were otherwise mutilated; in a word there was no one without marks of violence; save the above-named persons. But Thomas, Bishop of Marash was an object almost frightful to look upon; he had been mutilated by the removal of his eyes, nose and lips; his teeth had been dug out and both his legs and arms had been cut off. He had been kept in prison 22 years by the Armanites [Armenians] who used to cut off a member of his body or mutilate him in some way every year, to induce him to consent to their blasphemy, but he conquered in this fearful contest to the glory of believers and to the manifestation of the unmercifulness of the heretics.
The fathers took him with them to the Council and when the king saw him, he fell down upon the ground and venerated him saying,
"I venerate thee, O thou martyr of Christ, who art adorned with many crowns."
