Introducing Myself

by StandFirm 151 Replies latest jw friends

  • chrisjoel
    chrisjoel

    What ONE subject would you most want to debate with a JW defender?

    The fact that there is no proof whatsoever that Jesus and or Jehovah, set aside RUSSELLS GROUP from all the rest of the groups/religions/sects/cults at that time and Clearly and without any question chose THEM as his only visible representatives AND that it could be clear to anyone to see that throughout the preceding centuries there was an unbroken chain of the faithful and discreet slave class that had passed on "light" to the next generation until Mr CT Russell came on the scene to accept the honor of joining Said Faithful and discreet slave class that was supposed to be there when jesus came in 1914........

  • jgnat
    jgnat

    I'll put in another vote for "God having an Organization", and a follow up with Simon's questions, and your claim that the Jehovah's Witneeses most closely follow bible instructions.

  • AnnOMaly
    AnnOMaly

    Black Sheep: As you can see from the 1950's quote pre-Proclaimer's book, the rank and file were still considered Jonadabs and had to hang off the coat tails of the anointed 'body members' for their salvation. The only thing that changed in 1942 was that they would now also be known as Jehovah's witnesses.

    That was the only point I was confirming - Jonadabs were counted as Jws after a spell of being excluded. After all, (as you'll know - but for the benefit of any who don't) the Isaiah "you are my witnesses" Scripture applied to Israel, therefore, in the Christian era Rutherford applied it to 'spiritual Israel' and 'spiritual Israel' was the 'anointed class,' therefore, the earthly, non-anointed Jonadabs weren't included.

    I'm a bit fuzzy on this (need to look it up again), but around the same time, the 'city of refuge' doctrine appeared on the scene - the teaching that all of mankind (including the Jonadab class) was somehow bloodguilty before God and they needed to come to the antitypical 'city of refuge' (aka the Org of anointed) to be granted protection from Jehovah's 'Avenger of blood' at the Big A. The echos of this teaching (as you rightly alluded to) still stand today. The last detailed discussion of it was, I believe, in 1995.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    : Farkel writes: "Care to explain those "hardest tests" you mentioned?"

    ::Lots and lots of debates with opposers both intelligent and idiotic.

    Cite one debate in this board to prove your claim. Name the subject, the arguments and your counter-arguments. Post the ENTIRE debate. If you will actually do that, which you won't because you are a liar, I will jump in and make the counter-arguments, which I guarantee you, you will fail to rebut.

    If you won't do that, you are a liar and a charlatan and Watchtower-lying fraud and toadie for a legal Corporation that doesn't give a shit about you personally. They will sacrifice your sorry ass for jaywalking, in case you didn't know. They will destroy you and your entire family for looking cross-eyed at their doctrines and bullshit. You are loyal to them and they have ZERO loyalty to you. They will fry your sorry ass in two seconds if you question ANYTHING they say or do. And, according to your Religious Printing Masters, your very own Jehovah will roast your ass for lying in HIS name and lying in the name of Jesus Christ, but NOT for lying in their name. That is what THEY teach and that is what they've convinced YOU to believe.

    Y'all have a nice, lying day now.

    Farkel

  • Buster
    Buster

    I'm with Farkel on this.

    But just to play along to see where it goes: False Propehsy.

    Do you really think you can defend all the dates that went by, without a rapture, or armageddon, or great tribulation, appearance of Christ, anything. Can you really defend the society's claims to the power of prophecy? ... and by the way, their later claim that they never claimed the power of prophecy?

    - Cliff

  • yknot
    yknot

    Oh come-on yall......

    Standfirm is way tamer than Bane when he first joined.......

    ________________

    Standfirm...

    You should pick a topic that you feel you can give the best witness!

  • Terra Incognita
    Terra Incognita

    Standfirm; I noticed that you did not respond to a pointed rebuttal made by Beenthere26yr (on his post #9 pg. 4). You answered almost everyone's posts between your post #7 (on page 4) and the one immediately following on your post #9 (page 5). You even answered Leapofthefrog’s similar but not explicitly worded post.

    Beenthere26yr made reference to a Watchtower issue that is in blatant and irrefutable, contradiction to your claims about its tolerance on visiting Apostate websites.

    I quote a succession of posts below in chronological order to demonstrate your disingenuous and dishonest rationalizations.

    StandFirm:

    "I don't believe that the organization states that sites like this must be avoided when one already is familiar with the ideas presented. And no, I do not count time here. This is more of a hobby."

    "I see this to mean that those who are exposed to apostate arguments who do honest research on them will see them to be false."

    Beenthere26yr:

    From July 15, 2011 Watchtower, page 11 “What must we do to avoid false teachers? We do not speak to them or invite them into our houses. We also do not read their books, watch them on television, read what they write on the Internet, or add our own comments about what they write on the Internet.

    StandFirm quoting Leapofthefrog:

    Andre is shown as a bad example not to be followed. But if one was already exposed to apostate ideas, then it shows that from there that honest research is what would to dispel them. At least, that is how the Society must feel. I agree.”


    Bottom line StandFirm, I challenge you to stand firm to that explicit statement made in the July 15, 2011 Watchtower. Don't dodge the issue anymore or make silly statements like "that is how the Society must (MUST?!?!?!) feel." The Watchtower explicitly says "we" without making a distinction between apostate savvy "we" and weak minded "we".

    You know that Andre was used as an example for EVERY SINGLE WITNESS TO FOLLOW! NO EXCEPTIONS, YOU INCLUDED!

  • Aussie Oz
    Aussie Oz

    Another JW cherry picking the bits they want to follow!

    ''Oh, the warnings about apostates? Oh that doesn't apply to ME! I am waaaaaay to spiritual to have to obey the faithful slave like the others have too''...

    I dont have a problem with you being here either...but why not be honest enough with your self and us that you think you are above the rules regarding posting on 'apostate' sites?

    then, game on, you can debate any subject you like with that out of the way...

    oz

  • StandFirm
  • StandFirm
    StandFirm

    Farkel: The debates are here. Here's an example debate for you to read. It picks up a few pages in. Feel free to BTTT it.

    Terra Incognita: Adding comments to their writings is different from a forum discussion. The regular Watchtower makes clear that it is referring to their blogs and websites, not forums. If they meant forum why didn't they say it? And why can't I do research like Andre if I've already been exposed to apostate ideas?

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