How should I reply?

by hotchocolate 33 Replies latest jw friends

  • I quit!
    I quit!

    I feel bad that you had to get such a nasty email from your brother on Christmas morning. I don't think at this stage there is anything you can say that will get throught to him so don't be surprised if you get another nasty email from him or no reply at all. There is nothing more blind and than a new dub except maybe a newly reformed dub. If you choose to reply I would try to say what you feel is most important to get across to him first because if he does read your email at all he won't get too far into it before all his Watchtower defences go up and he will become completely unreasonable. I would let him know that just because at this time he feels that way about you it doesn't mean that you feel that way about him and that you intend to email him once in a while to see how he is doing and it will be his choice whether he wishes to reply or not.

    After a while he may soften but right now he is on fire for the Watchtower so don't expect to see anything other than the ugly behavior that Witnesses are so good at dealing out to those can no longer put their faith in the cult.

    You know when I look at posts like yours I think. How did I ever believe that crap? What a nasty piece of work I must have been while thinking I was in the one true religion serving the one true God. Anyway I got over it and I hope and pray that some day your brother will also.

  • journey-on
    journey-on

    hotchocolate, every family has their own dynamic, so it's difficult to predict what effect my words or anybody's words would have on your brother. I have dealt with my own fanatical JW sibling for many many years. Early on, you want so very much to lash out, talk back, point out all the Society's wrongs and errors, but, believe me...it does no good. All it does is tear down your relationship with your family and drain your energy and break your heart.

    My sibling tried to shame me early on; wrote me a shunning letter and cut me off for several years; then reconnected when "new light" broke. I welcomed her back with love and open arms...she has preached, bloviated, and bragged about the "specialness" of the organization...she has gloated over her elder husband's climb up the congregational ladder like it's some great privilege...you name it. She NEVER commended me for going to college or for ANY achievements and rewards I have earned in my secular, business, and personal life. She minimizes me as if none of it is worth squat because I'm no longer a member of the great WATCHTOWER BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES ;-)

    Through it all, I knew I could not change HER. People change themselves. She stopped the holier-than-thou attitude not long ago when I finally got up the nerve to tell her that "I pray about it and have a very personal relationship with Him and I allow myself to be guided by holy spirit and not doctrine from a man-made organization. It feels wrong to me." That has stopped her "witnessing" to me....probably stopped her getting to count time on our phone conversations as well.

    I live my life and it's a good one. She can see that for herself, so she is well aware that leaving that idiotic religion does not necessarily mean your life becomes a cesspool of debauchery or constant struggle.

  • AGuest
    AGuest
    She stopped the holier-than-thou attitude not long ago when I finally got up the nerve to tell her that "I pray about it and have a very personal relationship with Him and I allow myself to be guided by holy spirit and not doctrine from a man-made organization. It feels wrong to me."

    Yeah, there's something going on with them about the Holy Spirit/holy spirit, dear JO (the greatest of love and peace to you, dear one!). I cannot remember how I know/heard this, but apparently, if someone brings up the Holy Spirit or holy spirit, they're now directed to stop the discussion... and pursue it no further, even at a later date. I think I'm going to post a question about that to the board.

    Sorry for side-tracking, dear HotChoco (peace to you, as well)!

    Peace to you both!

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • journey-on
    journey-on

    Hello, Shelby.....I think you're right about the mention of holy spirit/Holy Spirit. I have noticed that, too. When Christ pulls you to him (TheHoly Spirit) and you feel his holy spirit working with you, there can be no legitimate argument. It's a very personal experience.

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    MUAH! dear JO... as always, and as always... peace to you and your household!

    YOUR servant and fellow slave of Christ,

    SA

  • Mad Sweeney
    Mad Sweeney

    Find an actual copy of the July 2009 Awake!, open it to page 29, highlight the sentence that says no one should have to choose between family and religion, and mail it to him without further comment.

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    Good one, dear MS (the greatest of love and peace to you!)... although he'll most probbly "reason" that that only applies to them (which is the insinuation, isn't it?).

    Peace to you!

    Your servant and a slave of Christ,

    SA

  • ablebodiedman
    ablebodiedman

    Hotchocolate,

    You have already told him that you love him.

    Sure you could send some stuff to scold him for not loving you in return however, that might undermine the fact that you love him (you do don't you?)

    If you feel compelled to answer then I recommend that you reassure him that you do indeed love him and if he ever wants to get in touch you will be there for him.

    Thats the true Christian way isn't it?

    abe

  • jamiebowers
    jamiebowers

    I like both of your responses. The longer you're out and the happier you are, the more he will get the message. My "worldly" relatives always make it a point to mention to my jw mom how happy my life has been since I left the cult.

  • djeggnog
    djeggnog

    @hotchocolate:

    So I wrote an email to my brother to tell him that I love him and that it's sad that a religion has come between us. This is the reply I got:

    stupid and ignorant. You have no idea what i have been thru in my life. I was living a worldly life and i saw the shallowness of it all so i made my decision based on lots of study to return to the truth. MY DECISION. Things have never been clearer. Don't send me anymore messages.

    It might have been illuminating to have seen the email you sent that elicited such a reply from your brother. However, you should respect his request since I would imagine someone with such an unloving mindset is more likely than not to delete any future emails from you without giving any of them a read (unless your brother's curiosity should get the best of him). A lot of people even have emails sent from certain individuals automatically deleted from their Inbox as they do spam, so it's probably not a good idea to just assume that your brother is even aware of having receive any of your emails should you elect to send a reply to his message anyway, since such would likely have been deleted by his spam filter automatically without his explicit knowledge of having received them.

    Look: I am not going to try to explain why it is that some folks feel moved to say hurtful, unloving things to others, for I, too, am guilty of having said hurtful things to others in the past (when I was younger). However, if your brother were someone else like you, someone that had expressed a romantic interest in you, and you were to have sent this "suitor" a similar email containing what amounts to a request that he not send you any more email messages, and, just to stack the deck a bit here, that he is no longer welcome to drop by your home for a visit or to call you on the telephone, either at your home or at the place where you work, nor to text you on your cell phone, the moment that you actually did any of these things, I suppose you could conceivably file a police report of some sort complaining of harassment or stalking from this "suitor," seeking a restraining order, and such an order would accordingly be granted.

    Now I read @jwfacts' post to you where he suggested that you should reply and add to it the following sentence, which he took out of context from an article published in the July 2009 Awake! ("Is It Wrong to Change Your Religion?"):P

    "No one should be forced to worship in a way that he finds unacceptable or be made to choose between his beliefs and his family."

    The context of what @jwfacts quotes is regarding whether someone, who is one of Jehovah's Witnesses, should feel forced to worship in a way that he or she finds unacceptable, or whether a Christian should be made to choose between the dictates of his or her beliefs and those of his or her own family.

    You went on to refer to this Awake! quotation as being "ironic," and then went on to opine that "[n]o one should be made to pay the price of their family in exchange for truth and freedom...," but Matthew 10:34, 35, indicates that it is on account of the kingdom issue that a division has come to exist between "a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a young wife against her mother-in-law," and, in the case of disfellowshipped Witnesses, this "sword" divides those that do no longer wish to continue 'accepting their torture stake and follow after Jesus' from those that accept their torture stake and do wish to continue follow after Jesus.

    Today there are definitely people that are united in the worship of "the god of this system of things," the one "who is misleading the entire inhabited earth" and who is responsible for the spiritual blindness that exists among mankind (2 Corinthians 4:4; Revelation 12:9), but Jesus came to unite families in the worship of his heavenly father, "the only true God," Jehovah. (Jeremiah 10:10; John 17:3) Jesus also indicated that those making themselves enemies of God could be "persons of [one's] own household," because those family members themselves, including those who were formerly Jehovah's Witnesses, have decided to make "those related to [them] in the faith" their enemies over the kingdom issue. (Matthew 10:36; Galatians 6:10)

    From the perspective of Jehovah's Witnesses, if a Christian should actually have greater affection for their disfellowshipped family members, who came to decide that they would no longer walk in the truth, than they do for Jesus, if they should actually have "greater affection for father or mother" than they do for Jesus," as Jesus himself says three times at Matthew 10:37, 38, then that person "is not worthy of me; and he that has greater affection for son or daughter than for me is not worthy of me. And whoever does not accept his torture stake and follow after me is not worthy of me."

    Your brother's email message strikes me as unloving and even mean-spirited, but I don't know your brother to say if it is either of these, and I believe you would be in a much better position than I to interpret the tenor of his email. I merely wanted to say that you should respect your brother's request. Jesus said that we should "continue to love our enemies and to pray for those persecuting us" (Matthew 5:44), so while your brother may properly view you as being an enemy of God and his enemy over the kingdom issue, and he may regard you as being no longer related to him in the faith, no longer his spiritual sister, you remain his fleshly sister, a member of his family, and you can hope that he comes around.

    I read another post in this thread from @I quit!, who wrote --

    "Anyway I got over [believing that "I was in the one true religion serving the one true God"] and I hope and pray that some day your brother will also."

    -- but to whom exactly does @I quit! or does anyone else that leaves off from worshipping Jehovah pray? No prayer can properly be directed to Jesus; all such requests must be directed to Jehovah through Jesus Christ, so how does one anyone that marginalizes Jehovah by praying to Jesus that your brother will one day 'get over' believing Jehovah's Witnesses to be a part of "the one true religion" that is serving Jehovah? Is such a prayer in harmony with God's will? (1 John 5:14) I mean, you wouldn't really expect Jehovah to affirmatively answer any request that is not in accord with his will, would you?

    Jesus told that Samaritan woman, "You worship what you do not know," and then he told her, in contrast, that "We worship what we know," that is to say, we worship a God that is known to us, THE TRUTH, for 'God is looking for suchlike ones who will worship Him with spirit and truth.' (John 4:22, 23) Consequently, anyone whose striving is like that of Christendom that seeks to worship a graven image, whether it be that copper serpent that Moses raised up on a signal pole, which was designed to be a symbol of Jehovah's saving power, but which had become an object of worship before Hezekiah destroyed it, or that cross upon which the image of an impaled Jesus is now being worshipped, apart from Jehovah, Jesus cannot independently save anyone, for Jesus is not God, but the Son of God, Jehovah's means of salvation. (2 King 18:4; John 3:14, 15; John 10:36; Luke 3:6)

    Anyone that worships Jesus is really worshipping a nonexistent god, so, in effect, that worship goes to "the god of this system of things," Satan the Devil, who accepts all worship that is not based on truth. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

    @djeggnog

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