You Can't Have Purpose Without Intelligence, And?

by D wiltshire 46 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  D wiltshire

  Seeker,

  Do you beleive "EVERY" thing about the Evolution theory?
  Even the unproven parts?

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  RWC

  I would agree with you Seeker if intelligence is defined as the ability to understand why something is engaging in certain behavior. A single cell organism doesn't understand why it is doing what it is doing and doesn't even understand that it is for survival. The fact that we interpret that behavior as a survival instinct is because we have the ability to think rationally and can assign that purpose to it. The cell doesn't even know that its behavior is for survival or for the protection of its species. It just acts and if that action enhances its chances for survival that is either an accident or the result of instinct that was placed there by someone else (God).

  I do not believe that the idea of an intelligent designer dodges the question. On the contrary it is the answer to the question. Only a being with rational thought could contemplate a God. The animals without this ability do not. And when we believe that we have come so far that we no longer have to believe in a God as the designer of our universe, we don't lose the ability to think rationally, we just believe that we have become too smart to give him credit. But, we can't explain everything and even those who try and determine the origin of life know we are far from doing so. The popular theories of today will be debunked in the future just as the ones in the past were.
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  Seeker

  RWC,

  Thanks, you seem to get what I am saying. It may be that we are all viewing these words differently since they haven't been pinned down precisely. But that is what I meant that you can have purpose without intelligence.
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  Carmel

  Excellent point Jan. My original question to Seeker was based on my frustration while in college where there were terms used so loosely that they became meaningless. "Instinct" is one of my favorites. There is such a continuum of of complex animal behavior that it is really impossible to say how much "thought" an organism puts into its behavior. What triggers a finch to build a nest that is identical to all other nests built by that species is still a mystery. Kind of like the JWs misuse of the word "spiritual". I got so dam tired of hearing that term, and noone would answer me what it really meant, I threw up my hands in disgust.

  The ant bridge has been studied by entomologists for decades and in controlled studies, given the choice within limits, certain ant species will only tackle a body of water that is moving less than a certain velocity and over a limited distance. The ologists surmise that they somehow calculate the number of lives needed to sacrafice to succeed, register that with what the colony population is and then decide whether or not to make the bridge. Of course, this is only an hypothesis but it is one of those mysteries that if it is true, then "instinct" is much more intellectual in this instance than one would have thought. Hence, where is the definition of instinct and intellegence?

  cheers, carmel
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  D wiltshire

  RWC,
  

  RWC,
  Thanks, you seem to get what I am saying. It may be that we are all viewing these words differently since they haven't been pinned down precisely. But that is what I meant that you can have purpose without intelligence.

  RWC did you give the impresion to Seeker you agree with him?

  Camel,
  I like you skeptacisim.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  Seeker

  RWC said:

  I would agree with you Seeker if intelligence is defined as the ability to understand why something is engaging in certain behavior.

  Since that is the definition of "intelligence" I have been using all along, I said what I said. I realize RWC and I don't agree on all aspects of this topic, but at least my intent was understood.
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  D wiltshire

  Intelligence has of coarse more than one definition.
  the American College Dictionary gives this one:

  1)capacity for understanding and for other forms of adaptive behahavior;

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?