Utter Disgust !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Infrared

I just returned home from the hospital. My sister in law had a mis- carriage today. It was a very sad day for her and my wifes family. She was two weeks away from her due date, and two years seperated from a previous mis-carriage. This was, to say the least, an upsetting day. But as if it was not bad enough, the elders showed up. My sister in law is unfortunately a witness, but in her day of need, it did not matter to us. Regardless of our differences, we came to comfort her. And of course the "loving elders" came to comfort her with these loving words. "We certainly will see this baby in paradise." OK harmless enough so far.Then he proceded to say, "With children like they are these days, you never know if they would make it through armageddon." So in essence saying, its a good thing this happened because we know for sure the baby will be in paradise. I wanted to shoot him, right then and there!

Stephanus

I'd not be too judgemental. People don't always know what to say, not having been through the stuff, so they try to say something that they think is comforting. When my daughter died some tried to comfort me by saying things like "At least you don't have to suffer through the pain of her teenage years and boyfriends and what-not!" I understood that they were talking from total ignorance of the realities of such a bereavement and I forgave them as such...

"You've got the brain of a four-year-old boy, and I'll bet he was glad to get rid of it."
- Groucho Marx

beepers

I am so sorry for your and your family's lose. All that I can say is continue to be supportive to your sister-in-law. Let the ignorant continue to be ignorant. Don't give them the power to bother you.

Best wishes,
Amy

LB

I've learned long ago that at times like this, it's best to keep your damn mouth shut. Something a lot of elders need to learn. No one remembers anything kind that is said, they are too numb. But stupid comments stick around forever. Best to just be there for someone.

Sorry it was so horrible.

Scully

Infrared
I am so sorry for your family's loss. I work as a nurse in maternal-newborn care, and situations like this are so terribly sad. Please encourage your sister-in-law to contact services that might be available in her area for this kind of bereavement. And if I can be of any assistance at all, please feel free to e-mail.

In defense of the elder's behaviour, I'd just like to offer a comment. Most people have very little in the way of training in how to deal with situations like this, and JW elders are no exception. Very often people make remarks that are well-intended (such as his comment that the baby would be resurrected), and then completely shatter the compassionate intent with a thoughtless remark that is very hurtful (which he did with his further comments).

The best thing for a friend or family member to do is to 'be there' for your sister-in-law (and her husband). Let her say whatever she needs to say. Let her cry as much as she needs to cry. Reassure them that it's OK for them to be angry with God. After all, He is supposed to be understanding and compassionate and forgiving, and he should be able to handle a little bit of anger from someone in these circumstances. Hug them if they need to be hugged. Let them have time alone if they need time alone. If they say something and you don't know how to respond, just be honest and say "I don't know what to say. But I'm here, and I care about what you're going through, and I'm listening."

Many hospitals offer pregnancy-loss bereavement services, and I hope your sister-in-law will take advantage of them. Hopefully she and her husband were able to hold the baby for as long as they wanted, and give the baby a name, and take some photographs and have other mementos like a lock of the baby's hair or pressings of the hand and footprints. As difficult as that might be to do right now, it can be a very healing experience for them. If now is not a good time for them to cope with doing this, the nurses at the hospital are usually happy to do these things for the couple, and keep them safely for the family to retrieve at a later time.

Thanks for sharing your loss (and theirs) with us. If you or she needs to talk privately, I'm just an e-mail away.

Love, Scully

It is not persecution for an informed person to expose a certain religion as being false. - WT 11/15/63

Angharad

So sorry ((((Infrared))))),

I know how devestating this is, my brother and his partner lost a full term baby a few years ago. Will be thinking of you.

Dont take any notice of the elders.

ofcmad

My condolences to you and your sister's family. I know when my friend had her 5th miscarrage, and the baby was 5 mos., we held a small service at the church for her and her family. It helped them out alot.

Ususally in times like these, it is hard to say anything that can comfort someone. It's best just to be there.

"Noah was a drunk and look what he accomplished." The Metatron/ Dogma

avengers

Ignorance is bliss. That goes especially for these WT elders. I've experienced similar. Don't expect anything from them. You're better off then.

"Few are they that look through their own eyes and feel with their own heart"
A Einstein

ashitaka

Well, I have to take Stephanus' approach to it...I believe it was callous, but ignorant. They thought they were doing the right thing. It is a testament to their warped thinking, though, I agree with that.

I never speak when a tragedy occurs. I cry with the person, hold their hand, etc.

My grandfather is dying, and when I went to visit him, I just held his hand and smiled, talked just a little, but not about how sick he was. It was hard, but people in grief want to be held, not preached to.

ashi

patio34

Dear Infrared,

I can understand your utter disgust at the callousness of the elders' barb. IMO, it is hurtful to say such things and you are within your rights to express the pain and disgust.

It also seems to be human nature for some to 'counsel' you on the wrongness of your feelings. Or maybe they're trying to help you get over it. But when folks have done that to me, it just adds to the anger, puts the already-hurt person on the defensive. This well-meaning 'counsel' negates, even trivializes, your hurt and anger.

Go ahead and feel it. I believe it is what the Bible calls "righteous indignation."

And, while people can be forgiven, it doesn't happen automatically, especially when you're hurting.

IMO, thoughtless people should keep stick to the basics, even when offering condolences, such as the elders were.

I feel utter disgust too at the insensitivity of the elders.

Warmly,
Pat

Utter Disgust !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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