by zeroday 91 Replies latest jw friends
Rapunzel, as far as Manifest Destiny. Hill is right, groups of people taking over other groups of people, and more importantly their resources, has been happening since the dawn of man. I still feel hopeful that we are evolving, and will one day live in a paradise new earth where we ...................NM.
Not all groups of people. Only certain cultures have this 'take over' mentality. Many other cultures don't. Just because ours is one that does, doesn't make it right.
The general gist of my post was a condemnation of Mafiest Destiny - one the most racist and filththy ideological doctrines to ever be delveoped by certaian American politiicians
I won't argue about Manifest Destiny, except that I think slavery was a more abominable concept. The Mexican-American War was needless, except for the opportunity to grab land from a weak neighbor and the settlement of the Texas issue (as Santa Anna still claimed Texas as part of Mexico). Some historians feel that the Gadsden Purchase was a half-hearted attempt to make amends and give Mexico money for territory taken during the war. I've never read anything written at the time that backs that up, but it is an interesting thought.
So what do you think about Mexico's (by way of Spain's) treatment of local indegenious people who inhabited what is now Mexico? Surely if you object to the U.S.nation waging war on the Mexican nation you should be even more outraged at how the local tribes were brutally treated, murdered in cold blood, wealth stolen, etc.?
Just because ours is one that does, doesn't make it right.
Well said Lisa.
I was in the Yucatan last year and I went to the capital city of Merida. The downtown buildings and streets are made of limestone. Where did they get the limestone? Well the Spaniards enslaved the people and they tore down pyramids to build the city and churches. There is a museum near the town square and it has an exhibit of art and treasures detailing the wars with Spain and it's eventual merger with Mexico. It's a bloody history. One particular war lasted 50 years.
Not all groups of people. Only certain cultures have this 'take over' mentality. Many other cultures don't. Just because ours is one that does, doesn't make it right.
I was in no way trying to say that it was right. I honestly do hope humans evolve to the point where this is worked out of the mix. But few cultures through history have NOT had this mentality. Saxons, Normans, Gauls, Mongols, Iraqis, Babylonians, Indian tribes here in America...........you name it.
After all the bushes have been shaken.
Me believes Dorttacular has said it well, "Mexicans, if you wanna come here, feel free! Just fill out the proper paperwork and wait your turn like the millions of legal immigrants who live in our country.
Me has had a mexican (legal) that has works for me for the past, say 25 years, and that is exactly what he says.
Me liked what BurnTheShips said also, "I quit and started school". The best thing anyone can do if he/she wants to make anything of themselves.
About two (2) years after Ishmael came to work for me me offered to pay for his college. He declined.
He does OK for himself, but he could have done better.
He is a wonderful person.
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Me believe all would have to agree that all people that are in the USA are immigrants from somewhere including the so called native americans.
LOL, thanks for the comic relief. This is hilarious.
"Canada angry at the inlux of Canadians into Canada"
I'm rolling on the floor.
I was in no way trying to say that it was right. I honestly do hope humans evolve to the point where this is worked out of the mix. But few cultures through history have NOT had this mentality. Saxons, Normans, Gauls, Mongols, Iraqis, Babylonians, Indian tribes here in America...........you name it.
Some Native American cultures were, some were not.
The other's you have mentioned did have this mentality of course...that is how and why they became big, powerful cultures...because they valued becoming big and powerful. The non-imperialistic cultures are not so famous or well known to us and don't spring to mind...we would pretty much have to look it up to find those cultures. And that makes sense, because they are not valued or important to our culture that values 'big' and 'powerful.' But these cultures did, and a few still do, exist.
I'm wandering off topic of this post...but I sort of feel that humans are evolving the wrong way... I agree very much with this post:
http://www.eurotrib.com/comments/2007/3/5/103210/4159/37
In order to evolve out of 'imperialism' we would have to stop putting our value on 'power' and 'wealth' and 'BIG' and 'property' and "ME and MINE" and instead value other things like "generosity" or "reciprocity"...radical thoughts!
Ok...sorry to go so far off on a tangent!
are immigrants from somewhere including the so called native americans
Probably not in the strict meaning of the word "immigrant", which is to settle into another "country" (political entity). It does seem likely that the Native Americans migrated to this land from another place, but that presents a rather different context than the present one.
All of these passage are from Carlos Fuentes', The Old Gringo.
",,,as she could make them understand that those words meant nothing, "save Mexico for democracy,that what mattered was to live with Mexico in spite of progrees and denocracy, that
each of us carries his Mexico and hid United States within him, a dark nd bloody frontier we dare to cross ony at night." - 187
"Two two gringos who had come to Mexico, he consciously, she unintentionally to confront the next frontier of American consciousness, the most difficult of all...the most difficult fronteir of all, the stragest, because it was the closest and therefore the most forgotten, most ignored, and most feard whe it strirred from its long lethagy." -186
"They did, said Colelnel Garcia, yes tehe gringos did. They spent lives crossing fronteirs, their and those that belonged to others...'''And tte fontier in here ? The North American had asked, tapping her forhead. "and the frontier in here? General Arroto had responed ed
Carlos Fuentes', The Old Gringo
Reconquista revisionist history with seriously divisive racial overtones.
I hve often wondered why people like Fuentes and others seem bent on the failure of "hating Whitey" as if reverse bigotry and prejudice would do anything to further the cause.
