What's your take on "faith healing" ...

by Frequent_Fader_Miles 30 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Snoozy

  I just read a very interesting article in Reader's Digest about the 'Power of the Mind".

  Faith healers...no, don't believe in them other than if YOU believe in them they might work.

  The mind is a powerful thing and it CAN heal your own body. Meditating (Certain ways)was a big example. Excercise....releases stress which can aid in healing.

  They are even close to finding a way for the body to grow new limbs..

  Snoozy...who believes our minds are a powerful thing..it can even make us sick if we think about it enough..so I guess we should dwell on feeling well...
• 

  Sad emo

  I've been reading through the varied replies here and thinking hard about the question...

  My current conclusion is YES I do believe in faith healing - but not necessarily in faithhealers.

  My reasoning is based on whose faith brings about the healing - is it that of the healer, or the person who is healed? Then I thought how many times Jesus said to people he healed "Your faith has made you well"

  Although I've approached it from a Biblical viewpoint because that's what I know, as Warlock said - what does it matter where you believe the healing comes from as long as the healing happens?! If it's faith in a higher power, fine. if it's positive thoughts, fine!

  We have a vigil thread here each week where some people offer prayers to their God, others practice Reiki and send vibes, others send positive thoughts. I doubt if any of the ill and struggling people read the thread and think to themselves "I'm not going to accept so-and-so's message because they pray to God and I don't believe in him!" It's the overall collective positive thoughts which they see and then they know that someone's on their side and hopefully they are given more willpower to fight on no matter what. Some may be healed physically, some may not - but they may be holistically healed - coming to a place of peace within themselves where they can accept the unpleasant things life has dealt them and live with them.
• 

  LtCmd.Lore

  If you want an amputee to get healed so it can be proved that it was real, then you're only really wanting it as a test. To test God. Jesus didn't test God when Satan tried to tempt him.

  Try proposing a cure for cancer and then expecting people to pay for it... but not being allowed to test it. Directions: Take one pill daily with a glass of water. Warning: Contains substances known to the state of California to cause death in lab mice if pumped at high rates through the rectum. Attention: This drug has never been tested, there is no scientific evidence that it does anything at all, and there never will be because it magically stops working if the subject is being studied... Results not garuanteed at all. But we know it works.

  Also... are you tring to tell me that there has NEVER been a faithfull amputee who simply wanted to walk again? It never works on them because they are ALL sceptics?

  Lastly, I will take a moment to point out how awesome the human race really: Long ago it was thought that lightning was caused by the gods, now we mere mortals make our own lightning. Gods would supposedly give people visions of mutant animals, I've never had such a vision, but HUMANS have created computer generated battles of literally galactic proportions, monsters FAR more amazing then some lion with wings, and play them daily on TV. People believe that god can cure any problem but he'll NEVER restore a limb because "they don't have enough faith" But humans HAVE restored limbs and are always getting better at curing diseases. God kills evil doers, men reform and treat them. God floods the world and gets praised, Humans save the flood victims and people insult them because it took too long.

  Everything that the gods promised to do, they haven't. But humans are doing it all on their own anyways.

  And the worst part is: When a doctor spends hours removing a tumor and saving a mans life, after hundreds of years and millions of dollars in research and equiptment: The man wakes up... and thanks god for all the things these humans did for him...

  So if you tell me I should thank god for all he's done for me... I laugh! God is weak, dumb and lazy. Man is smart, strong and does all the work.
• 

  r.a.m.

  LtCmd.Lore
  
  How do you know that there has never been an amputee who has been healed?
  
  I never said that there has never been a faithful amputee who wanted to walk again. I'm sure there has been, and they've prayed to be healed. And, you know what? Maybe they were healed. If I were healed from something huge I would praise God and the people around me would know, but I'd never go on tv because you don't through pearls before swine. So maybe an amputee was healed and we just don't know about it.
• 

  HappyDad

  I have always been a skeptic about faith healing and the charlatans like Peter Popov and Benny Hinn, just to name two,who bilk gullible people out of a lot of money. They should all be thrown in jail.

  But here is my story that happened this year.

  For about 5-6 years, I noticed that my left knee was not acting normal. From time to time it would crack (like cracking your knuckles.) And it would ache at times also. I've forgotten how many years it's been since I have been able to even kneel to do certain work tasks. About two years ago it started getting worse. There seemed to be more pain even though it was a little sporadic. And I was developing a slight limp.

  It was time to buy a knee brace to try to ease some of the pain. Once in a while my knee would give out a little and I was afraid to carry anything heavy down steps for fear my knee might give out and I'd collapse with whatever I was carrying. I faced up to the fact that this was just something I had to live with since I wasn't getting any younger.

  About a year ago, it started getting worse. Here comes the second but much better and more expensive knee brace. A cane also seemed like a good idea but I didn't get one. I could barely bend my knee and the pain almost made me cry at times. I could limp around during the day while I was working, but at night the throbbing pain would wake me up in tears. I lost count of how many times I went up and down the steps in my house like a toddler. It was a step at a time.....ON MY BUTT! Frustration was eating at me. My thoughts were, "Is this (and worse) what I have to look forward to as I get older?"

  Thoughts of getting an operation were going through my head. The first week of January I had my annual check up with my Dr. She sent me for an x-ray on the knee and said that an MRI would follow. (I need to get off the track here a little and say that I am finding another primary care physician. There have been too many glitches in my care at this office. Some if not most of it I will blame on her staff. The lack of follow up contact after blood tests, etc.) I was never called to let me know about the x-ray or follow-up MRI.

  I'm going to do this in three posts so it doesn't all seem sooooooooooo long.
• 

  HappyDad

  I was attending the Assembly of God church since the end of November and during the service many go up front to the altar during praise and worship (great music) and prayer ministry. I started doing this also. Some would kneel as the Pastor spoke and prayed from his heart for those wanting the Lord to do things in their lives. Several times I would limp up there and stand next to one of my friends who also attends this church. (At last count, I have 9 close friends who attend this church...and they are the ones who first invited me there) It was very painful for me to just stand there praying and in a short time, I had to retreat to my seat to sit down. I would pray and give thanks for all that was in my life. Deep down I wanted to kneel like some of the others were doing, but knew that it wasn't possible.

  Here comes a strange part and I'm not sure what many of you believe at this point. As I said before, because of over 30 years of JW indoctrination, I was a skeptic about quite a lot of things. I am very close to my good friend Greg (who is an ordained minister..but does not serve as a pastor) and his wife Peg. Their ministry is running a recovery halfway house for women and a recovery club that is open to all. They both are what I would call model Christians and Peg sometimes has a gift of good things that will happen. I believe this because I have been witness to some of the things she said way before they happen.

  It was about the second week of January and one day at the coffee shop she related a dream she had about me. We all broke out laughing because it was so funny. A few nights before she started laughing like crazy in her sleep and it woke Greg up. This laughter continued on for a little while when Greg asked her what was so funny. She became fully awake and related her dream to Greg. She said the dream was about me and that we were all in church standing and singing and praying at the altar. Then all of a sudden I started hootin' and hollerin' and dancing around like Michael Jackson and then started break-dancing and praising the Lord.

  It was VERY funny the way she told it to all of us who were at the coffee shop. And we all agreed that it was funny in the fact that here I was......limping and in a lot of pain. Her dream was funny although I knew in my mind that it could not come true.
• 

  HappyDad

  Ok.........now to Feb. 15. The dream had been forgotten by everyone I suppose. As usual the music started and Pastor Pat invited us to come up to the altar. And as usual, I did my limp to the front and we were singing the song Amazing Love. My whole heart and mind were focused on the words......my entire being was clothed in warmth. Then the second song started. I don't remember which one that was, but then I realized something. I WAS KNEELING there with my arms raised in praise. It hit me so much..I WAS KNEELING.......THERE IS NO MORE PAIN.

  I jumped up and start yelling very loud....PRAISE GOD, PRAISE GOD..I CAN KNEEL, I CAN KNEEL........THE PAIN IS GONE. No...there was no break-dancing, but I was jumping around and kicking my leg around to show that it was ok. I don't know how long I did that, when I looked at some of the people there, I saw Peg with her hands to her face and crying. Then I remembered her dream. I went to her and hugged her, at the same time crying like a baby. I told her "You had this dream."

  I guess I disrupted things for a few minutes but the entire church was clapping and giving God praise. Aferward, I found out that several others in the church knew about Peg's dream, including Pastor Pat's wife who is a very good friend of Peg.

  The knee braces are history. I have absolutely no pain. I am walking normal, even trying a little jogging. The steps are not a problem anymore. That week, I was a little apprehensive. Was this real? Here at home..... I knelt down several times just to see if I could. I COULD and STILL CAN.

  The following week at Sunday School (Feb. 18) Paster Pat asked me if I would take a minute to relate what happened the Sunday previous. I did!

  Needless to say, I'm not a skeptic anymore. I have knelt many Sunday's since. The song "AMAZING LOVE" has new meaning for me.

  Was this a REAL healing? Is it just mind over matter? I won't question it at all. All I know is that I was......a limping....in bad pain.......aging man. Now I know what I am........still aging but able to walk normal....even giving it "double time" if I so choose. I'll give all the credit to my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. Will it last or will something eventually happen again to the knee? Who knows? Anything could happen.....a wrong move.....an injury.......or whatever, and I could be limping again. But that would be a new situation. The OLD situation is no longer a burden.

  What do the days, weeks, months, and years ahead bring? I don't have a clue.

  Thanks for letting me post this. I appologise if I have rambled on or made anyone bored.

  I'm just..............

  HappyDad
• 

  Snoozy

  Wow Happy dad...that's amazing. I too have had knee problems from a fall a few years ago. I had one operated on and it was great..same outcome as you. now the other one is starting to act up..I too would like to kneel on it but..since I have no healing place to go I guess I will have to rely on the Doc again..

  Miracles are great!...and cheaper..

  Snoozy...
• 

  Abaddon

  In view of the past failure of those who believe in it to ever demonstrate it in a manner that a science journal or court of law would aoccept as satisfactory proof

  In view of the failure of those who believe in it to set up a simple double-blind test that woul determine whether it had any beneficial effect

  In view of the proven fact people are able to feel better or worse according to how they think they should feel, even down to the level of measurable physiological responses

  ... I "take it" as wishful thinking, that despite being 100% moonshine actually seems to work for some people sometimes because they believe it will.

  I'm quite happy for those who believe in it to believe in it, but won't patronise them by lying to them that I do too. I hope I get afforded the same latitude.
• 

  funkyderek

  r.a.m.:

  If you want an amputee to get healed so it can be proved that it was real, then you're only really wanting it as a test. To test God. Jesus didn't test God when Satan tried to tempt him.

  Personally, I genuinely want amputees to be healed because I am a compassionate person. Also, the fact that it would provide proof for claims that are being made should be welcomed by those who make the claims. You see, what we want to do is not test God, but test those who claim to speak for him. Anybody can say they are God's anointed prophet and can heal people. But how do you know who's telling the truth? Well, you can believe them all (which means you will almost certainly be taken in by a hoaxer), believe none of them (in which case you may be rejecting God's true prophet) or you can test their claims (in which case you will only believe those who can actually do what they claim).

  Because of the placebo effect and occasional spontaneous remission of terminal diseases, the best way to determine whether a particular person/place/practice etc. can miraculously heal someone is to test it on amputees. A limb growing back would be an absolute undeniable bona fide miracle.

  I never said that there has never been a faithful amputee who wanted to walk again. I'm sure there has been, and they've prayed to be healed. And, you know what? Maybe they were healed. If I were healed from something huge I would praise God and the people around me would know, but I'd never go on tv because you don't through pearls before swine. So maybe an amputee was healed and we just don't know about it.

  So you'd hide your light under a bushel? If you were the recipient of the greatest recorded miracle in 2,000 years you wouldn't tell anybody? And what if someone asked how your legs had grown back? Would you just lie and say you had a leg transplant? Considering the amount of people who claim they have been miraculously healed of all sorts of (mostly imaginary) complaints, it's quite telling that there is not a single record of an amputee being healed.