I suppose it is possible that a person could be an elder for many years and not hear of a case of abuse. In my own case, I was only a Ministerial Servant in my early 20s when I learned of a pedophile in my congregation in NYC some three decades ago. Given that the WTB&TS has long had the policy of covering over such gross badness, I can believe that some elders would know things that other elders in the same congregation would not know, but there is a big difference between "don't know" and "didn't happen."
paedophiles, what a jw told me
by MUNKAFATS 20 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse
-
-
greendawn
Strangely enough it seems to be that way, with the two witness rule all a pedophile has to do is ensure that there is no one around to witness anything, the victimised child without any witnesses doesn't have a chance of being believed in the JW world. His/her only course is for the parents to ignore the JW rules and go straight to the authorities.
In a nutshell this soft policy at least indirectly encourages pedophiles. The only deterrant is for some tough no non sense parents to be over the child.
-
candidlynuts
that frist it was handled by the org and then was sent to the proper authorities
FIRST they go thru the org, that means if the org's lawyers advise they shut up about it, then it will not be reported.
it also shows the motivation is not the best interest of the child but in protecting the organization.
this has been the problem all along , especially before laws were in place in some states that require the authorities to be notified.
if a child, or its parents , reported improper behavior of a brother to the elders, if there weren't two witnesses to the offense the brothers used to just let it go , and the parents were told to drop it and not talk about it to other parents in the all. (that has happened many many times in the past)
hopefully though with new laws in place and the society eager to protect it's assets , more offenses are being reported to the authorities.
-
MUNKAFATS
candidlynuts ill have to ask them next time they call about this , thanks
-
candidlynuts
your welcome
just remember too, the changes that have happened, didnt come from the watchtowers concern over children, they only changed when laws were put in place that would hold them financially liable if children were molested and the "clergy" didn't report it to the authorities.
again, that isn't even the law in every state last time i checked.
there are threads here with letters to elders or letters that were read to elders stating the procedure is to call brooklyn FIRST, talk to the legal department and the legal department will tell them if the laws in their state requires they notify the authorities.
-
flipper
Munkafats- Mr. Flipper here. I'm afraid your elder friend who takes pride in his 17 years of elderdom is misleading you. I would like to share this with you, and you can see this is from an associated press news flash of May 10th. Here is the website to check for yourself that the molestation coverup is true. This information really happened. the site is: http://dwb.sacbee.com/24hour/nation/v-print/story/3617263p-12918091c.html. Please do yourself a favor . Don't believe what these witnesses tell you. There are reasons they want this information kept from you, and none of the reasons are good or acceptable. True, other organizations have pedophiles, but they have come out, admitted it, and don't try to conceal or cover it up from their own members, that's the difference here. Don't be gullible, educate yourself on this so you may protect yourself and others you know. Sincerely, Mr. Flipper Peace to you.
-
MUNKAFATS
will do that now flipper, thanks
-
MUNKAFATS
flipper its not there anymore
-
DannyHaszard
They are the ones that set the two witness rule which basically gives total cover to the pedophile, they surely know that it's not possible for thousands of children to lie about being abused.
That's it compelling
Moreover the elder oversight arrangement in some cong is often a 'good ole boys club' with one elder presiding overseer acting as godfatherif he is disposed to act on or supress an issue the other elders follow suit and act as his 'rubber stamps'.
The TWO WITNESS RULE requiring TWO WITNESSES to every sin big and small is the Watchtower way and is an over extension of 2 corn.13:1 I will elaborate,,,there are LOOPHOLES if the local elder political powers that be want to do something or cover it up they have the "two witness" subterfuge to fall back on.
Example:Family wealthy and popular has a daughter seen smoking cigarettes.
Need two witnesses
Example:Family poor and not influential has a daughter seen smoking cigarettes.
Disfellowshipped on ONE witness (to keep the congregation clean and to instill fear in others)
I have seen this played out over and over -
choosing life
Munkfats,
I am sure there are many organizations with problems with pedophiles. That does not excuse the cover-up that jws engage in. They are the ones who set the ridiculous rule that 2 people have to witness the abuse. When is that going to happen? Who do they care more about protecting, the innocent child or the pedophile (and thus their own reputation as a clean organization)?
Why do they not release the secret database listing pedophiles to the authorities so they can investigate and pursue the ones who are truly guilty of molesting children? Can you think of anything much lower on the scale of disgusting than molesting innocent children?
I think I remember that you have children of your own. If not, then just use your imagination. Your 5 year old little girl tells you that brother jones keeps touching her where he shouldn't. You don't want it to be true, but when your wife examines your little girl, she sees obvious signs of molestation. You are livid. You approach brother jones and then the elders about it. He denies it and the elders tell you to keep it totally quiet because there are not 2 witnesses. You are told not to go to the authorities or you will be disfellowshipped.
What do you do? Keep your child away from brother jones and hope she forgets about it? What about the countless others that brother jones will molest or has already molested? Are you not turning a blind eye to wickedness? If you do report it to the authorities, everything is denied by the elders and you are made out to be the wicked one.
This scenario has played out thousands of times and if the otganization did not cover it up with the 2 witness rule, things would be different, but they very much do. As a jw, I only knew of 1 incident of child molestation personally at a convention, but I saw directly how they immediately covered it up.
How would you feel if it was your little girl or boy?