Post WTBTS Life

by Angst 11 Replies latest jw experiences

  • Angst
    Angst

    I have been inactive for about three and a half years now and just recently after making some big changes in my life have I made a commitment not to return to the "organization". For quite awhile now I've just felt like I was apathetic towards religion. Now I'm disgusted by religion, religious dogma, and fanaticism.

    One thing that I've noticed in those I deal with that are ex-witnesses is that many tend to swing the exact opposite direction once they leave. Many start celebrating holidays, do drugs, live immoral life styles, etc. etc. etc. Now I'm not wanting to appear high and mighty but I personally still have somewhat of a conscience and am trying to maintain a medium in my life. I don't feel a need to follow the world or the Witnesses. I'm striving to maintain a unique individuality.

    Does anyone here feel like me?

  • Stacey
    Stacey

    Angst,

    Everyone needs to make their own decisions in life. As a JW most of us did not have any choices. There was one way, or Satan's way.

    Not every ex-jw who leaves becomes "immoral". In fact, most of them that I know live similar lives as they did before, they just are no longer JWs. I dont know where you get the idea that most people go crazy with sex, drugs, and "bad" things when they leave. Just because you might still think celebrating holidays is "wrong" does not mean it's true. Many ex-JWs are no longer religious and "celebrate" the holidays for family purposes. Everyone must do what they feel is right for themselves. Just because someone doesn't do it the way you do it, doesn't mean it's wrong.

    Getting past the judgementalism is the hardest part. If the JWs did anything for me it was to make me very accepting of people in their place in life. It's called tollerance and acceptance.

    Good luck in figuring things out.

    Stacey

  • individuals wife
    individuals wife

    Angst - First of a big welcome to the board - I hope that you enjoy your time here and find it useful, comforting, stimulating, educational, whatever you want it to be or need it to be.

    I congratulate you on your determination never to go back to the organisation - it can be quite daunting to step out from the org. and reclaim your life. I sincerely hope that things are going well for you and that you are managing to move on in your life.

    You make an interesting point about people swinging the opposite way when they leave the organisation - I think what you are observing is peoples reaction to freedom - the organisation, as you are certainly aware, is very lethal to the individuality of a person, his freedom of expression and his 'spirit'. When people are constantly told not to do this, or not to do that, it is only human nature to go against this when the opportunity arises. When the chains of the organisation are broken a person is able to become the person they want to be instead of the person the Society wants them to be.

    For those that maybe leave and immediately get a tattoo or a piercing I can understand that this maybe serves as a sign to others that they are free to live life as they wish. I imagine it must be quite a liberating experience although I have no desire to do either myself!

    I am no psychiatrist but I believe that the drug issue may be an expression of freedom also, and perhaps a way to forget the pain of their experiences... again I have no desire to get involved with this either!

    As for immoral lifestyles, I am not convinced that being an exJW tends to make you immoral - far from it in fact. You will find a lot of people on this board who are more than content with their partners and would not dream of looking elsewhere - me for starters! To get away from the organisations rules and regulations about how you should conduct your sex life is very refreshing - it no longer feels as though you have to analyse everything. Immorality amongst unmarried people is another matter entirely and whether you agree with sex before marriage is quite up to you, in a perfect world - yes, it would be nice, but it is not practical and could lead to problems of incompatibility if not explored prior to marriage.

    Holidays? I dont know of anyone who celebrates Christmas purely because to them it signifies the birth of Christ. I am sure you would agree with me that today the festival has lost much of its meaning.
    To most people it is merely a time for families to get together, have a good meal, exchange gifts and generally relax and watch the women do all the work... The religion has almost been removed from Christmas now, and Easter too. What child associates Easter with Christ? More like chocolate eggs and the Easter bunny. As for birthdays, when I saw how lame the JW argument was for not celebrating them I realised that there is nothing wrong in congratulating my kids on reaching little milestones in their lives, making them feel extra special for one day of the year, giving them something to look forward to - seeing their little faces light up because they know they are the centre of attention... Is God really that jealous that he cant bear to see this delight in children?
    And when a person reaches his 100th birthday is it so wrong to make a fuss and say 'well done - what an achievement - have a happy day!'

    I, like you, maintain a good conscience and try to follow my heart, not the world or the JWs. I never have been one to follow the crowd. My main aim is to keep my family happy and stable and to try and give as much of my time and energy as possible to help other people. And what other people do with their freedom - I leave up to them, some of them have been in chains so long - they deserve to stretch their legs a little....

    Anyway, like I said, a big welcome - looking forward to hearing more from you!

  • outnfree
    outnfree

    Hi, Angst (great name, btw -- I read your other thread),

    I left the Witnesses in March of this year. So far the only thing I have done that I would NOT have done as a witness was to swear, rent some R-rated movies (actually, I used to do that when I was a witness, but very, very selectively) that I had always wanted to see, celebrate holidays and associate with the apostates on this board!!!! LOL
    (I never thought the WT belonged in my bedroom -- especially as I became a witness AFTER 11 years of marriage.)

    Am I now a horrible person? I don't think so. My husband is/was an unbeliever, so the kids always had Christmas (and Easter candy) as well as dinner at the restaurant of their choice for their birthdays and gifts for which he shopped. So the only change on that score, is that I, too, shopped, and I don't sit around with a sour expression on my face any longer.

    I don't think there are many ex-JWs that IMMEDIATELY turn to what JW's would term an 'immoral lifestyle', but then, I'm older and perhaps you're right about the 20-somethings... I think, rather, that ALL ex-JWs go through a self-examination period and begin shedding restrictions that never made sense to them in the first place (many are unscriptural anyway) and then pick and choose what seems right to them. Something like what you described when you said:

    I don't feel a need to follow the world or the Witnesses. I'm striving to maintain a unique individuality.

    Maintaining "a unique individuality" is precisely what one was NOT supposed to do as a witness. "Unity" meant "cookie-cutter dub" more often than not.

    Welcome to the world of freedom. Not just freedom FROM the Borg, but freedom TO become ... whoever you are, Angst.

    I look forward to reading more of your posts.

    outnfree

    Par dessus toutes choses, soyez bons. La bonte est ce qui ressemble le plus a Dieu et ce qui desarme le plus les hommes -- Lacordaire

  • Angst
    Angst

    outnfree... I especially like the following comment that you made because it is precisely how I feel they wanted me to be:

    Maintaining "a unique individuality" is precisely what one was NOT supposed to do as a witness. "Unity" meant "cookie-cutter dub" more often than not.

    I tried, during my high school years to dress in a unique style and my parents hated it. I never understood why they felt that it was worldly to try to be unique. They would always tell me to focus on spiritual things. I also was quoted Proverbs 18:1 more times than I care to remember because my mind was so screwed up that I resorted to isolation because association with the world was so dangerous.

    I no longer have that way of thinking...thank goodnews I'm not ruined for life!

  • peacepipe
    peacepipe

    Angst,
    Hi and welcome to the board. I'm new here as well but I just wanted to comment, as one who did not spend my growing up years in the organization, that any person who has grown up with harsh restrictions is a candidate for some kind of rebellion. When your growing into the person your going to become you can't be locked in a box with no room for personal growth. Once out you want to experience everything. I've seen it happen to quite a few friends who I grew up with. Their parents forced strict christian values on them (not JW though) and when they got the chance to escape, well, they were hellions on wheels but they needed that time to let the cork out and find who they were.

    Remember, happy days are always ahead.
    Peace

  • Tina
    Tina

    Hi Angst,Welcome aboard.
    I personally havent seen or experienced these 'immoral lifestyles' that you mentioned.
    Most of the ex-Jw's I know actually have a higher consciousness and more open and global worldview. And quite ethical,even more so than when they were in. One thing long time ex's have learned is losing the judgemental mindset about what constitutes immoral. There are diverse lifestyles out there.Putting a moral overtone on such diversity is rigid and narrow.
    People rebel all the time from all sorts of groups.Ex -Jw's shouldnt be singled out in this respect.
    Just my thoughts,again welcome aboard.

    Carl Sagan on balancing openness to new ideas with skeptical scrutiny..."if you are open to the point of gullibility and have not an ounce of skeptical sense-you cannot distinguish useful ideas from worthless ones."

  • Teirce
    Teirce

    It was the last face-slapping insult that I allowed my father to make when he implied that when I left the organization, I was going to descend to drugs, crime, sexually transmitted deseases, et al. Never again will I allow that man to speak that way. He does not carry a parent's respect or authority over me, after that.

    I don't smoke. I've pondered the utility of smoking with a view to appetite-suppressant, but, it's cost-prohibitive.

    I don't sleep around. There's enough positions, technique, magic and sentiment to persue with one person. Besides that, women take a good long while to even think of understanding (ug). I'll take one and try to deal with that, thanks.

    My girlfriend has suggested her approval of pot. I listen to her argument, that it's not as bad as the government says it is. I listen to her persuasion that pot is actually a valuable diversion, but that its legalization would put the tobacco industry at risk, since whereas you can't grow tobacco yourself, and are dependant on the supplier, marijuana is easy to grow. The economic principles she described not only made sense with me, they struck a huge gong in my head regarding the Witnesses' teaching as a psychologic-narcotics addiction. Boy, it feels good to grow your own psychologic joy. But I still haven't tried pot; it's currently illegal.

    The only crime that I'm aware of committing is my crime of not bowing to the consumerist machine. Although, I do have no real sense of guilt stealing animal crackers from the jar in the other isle at work. It's a big jar..

    As for holidays - it's a real challenge to try to enjoy the season as 'worldly-born' people do. I wish I could have that magic. What I do have is the occasional haunting tingling in the back of the throat that I used to get as a Witness kid, when I would hear Christmas songs at the malls, or when I would stare out the window on our way to the meeting, and see Christmas lights glowing colorfully across the snow. There is a reason that such sights and sounds are haunting, and you do yourself a huge favor to try to recapture a bit of the chilling, spiritual, magical joy at such moments. My girlfriend gave me a most wonderful birthday experience last year, my first true birthday, and I felt more special and necessary to my friends than I had ever felt as a Witness. I've grown more true friends online than I could have counted as a Witness. Forsooth, I never actually, truly was a Witness, because I never completely believed all their teachings. But I was born into it, and got married in it, and smarted up and faced the years-old music that I knew was right. There is no straddling the fence; you will go mad.

    At first, I tried to maintain my regular high sense of vocabulary, not at all, by fuck, because I had a moral objection to profanity. No indeed, I always felt that profanity should be reserved unto the day of wrath, when a quiet soul's utterance could Mean something and make heads snap. Back as a Witness, my brothers and their freinds were regular users of profanity, getting hauled to Elders often, but it was never tempting, because it wasn't a challenging enough use of speech. But, by fuck, work has in the last months brought my sanity to the brink, so, I have to swear to stay sane. I hope it returns to normal.

    R-rated movies have more genuine acting and fewer childish sentiments. Had enough childish sentiments where I came from. The porn I've tried is categorically boring next to the real thing.

    Respectfully,

  • larc
    larc

    Angst,

    I especially appreciated your post, and I was very impressed with the many thoughtful comments that others made here.

    I think your last statements are the key. You have a conscience and a set of values. You can pick and choose what is right and wrong for you in "the world." There are good people here and there are good people in your community.

    The hardest part for me when I left was being able to determine the good people out there at first. Of course, I was programmed as a JW, to believe that most people were bad. I was pleasantly surprised to discover that there are lots of good folks out there. I would say that applies to this board as well.

    I am glad you are with us.

  • siegswife
    siegswife

    Angst, Hi, I'm glad to hear that you have decided to sever your ties with the WTBTS. Regarding your comment about the reaction of ex JW's I can only speak from my own perspective. When I left them (because I realized from the Bible that they were making some serious doctrinal errors) I reverted back to my immoral lifestyle for a time. It wasn't a reaction to freedom, it was a reaction to being shattered. I was so glad when I had given up the drugs and sexual immorality when I became a witness and I never intended to go back to it. When I was spiritually shattered by realizing they were wrong, I guess I started medicating myself again. I got reinvolved with a bad man that I had known previously. I think I was seeking comfort in that which I was familiar. Thanks to Christ, Yahweh took pity on my state and put me back together again. It took awhile though. Even after I stopped doing the drugs again and left the bad man, I still drank too much and had sex with my boyfriend(s). I didn't doubt that what the Spirit had shown me was true, I doubted my assessment of it. That was MY problem anyway. He has shown me the way though, and directed my course. I'm now well on my way to recovery and don't feel the SELF doubt that I felt for so long after leaving them. I'm married to a man who loves me and who supports and appreciates my spirituality. I've learned alot from this experience and now know that He loves EVERYONE who seeks him in Spirit and Truth. Most JW's seek Him in an earthly organization. Hopefully those that are sincere will get out safely.

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