How much time does the WTBT$$ have left?

by TallTexan 24 Replies latest jw friends

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  TallTexan

  Obviously, there is no answer to this, I just think it's an interesting ??. My personal opinion is that within 10 years, the WTS will be a shell of it's current (and especially former) self. It may not even take that long.

  We know that growth in the 'advanced' nations is either negative or at a standstill. How long until the REAL information about the WT gets to the developing countries? The fact is that most of the $$ to support the growth has always come from the developed nations. As that starts to dry up, it doesn't really matter how many converts they make in 3rd world countries, without that heavy financial support from the 'big boys', they won't be able to afford to do business.

  In the past, in developed nations, many of the 'newly baptized' have been children who have been raised in the truth. Now that those kids spend so much time on the internet, how long until that is no longer a source of membership? I think the Internet, the UN, sex abuse scandals - all of the last few years, have already taken a heavy toll. Given another decade, how much more severe will the damage be?

  Anyone have any thoughts on this?
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  JustTickledPink

  Personally I know there is a whole generation of believers that are die-hards, people like my mother who have lived their entire lives believing they will be the people to walk through the "great tribulation" on into the paradise. They will not give up hope, they are in their 50's and 60's and will continue to believe until the day they die.

  The younger generations that follow their parents due to social pressure, whatever will be the generation to eventually let the WTS go. I don't know if that will take 10 years or 40 years... but it will happen. Kids today are taught more and more in school, are more informed, are more connected and are more smart. You can't just blindly teach inaccurate truths. Plus the Watchtower refuses to evolve into a friendly organization that welcomes people of all kinds. There are more and more religions that are more community and socially based with activities for kids and programs. So, with no new growth it's just a matter of time before the big donors die off and the younger generations walk away.
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  wombat

  I'm hoping that it's less than 10 years. My darling 88 yo mother wants to see it go in her time. But I've made her promise to hang on until 2014.

  Good point about the lack of income from 3rd world countries. Inheriting a mud hut in the back blocks of Africa can't help the Society from having to sack a heap of aged Bethelites.

  As previous posters have expounded so well, the WTS did not (and could not) have seen the internet coming. It is the death of them.
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  Honesty

  How much time does the WTBT$$ have left?

  Who really knows except God. One month more will be over 100 years too long for the WT demon cult..
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  jeanniebeanz

  Plus the Watchtower refuses to evolve into a friendly organization that welcomes people of all kinds. There are more and more religions that are more community and socially based with activities for kids and programs

  We have to keep in mind though that there are new converts, even though they are a small number. These people often come into the religion during very mixed up times mentally, emotionally, financially and so on. They can be just as diehard as the older generation, especially if circumstances turn around for them shortly after joining the witnesses.

  They chalk it up to 'gods spirit' and then they're hooked.

  Another group of people are the younger witnesses who get off on feeling superior to everyone else. They thrive on the possibility of actually seeing the rotting corpses of people they know and work with everyday who have 'rejected the message'. There will always be sickos, I suppose.

  Then there is a generation left where even after the parents die off, they will face a situation where some siblings and even children will shun them if they walk away. So, some will stay for that reason.

  My hope is that with each successive generation, more will wake up to the lie and leave. But, even with massive lawsuits and financial decay of the org, an idea is a very persistant thing and very hard to kill. Even the very bad ideas. Kind of like a drug resistant virus.

  Jean
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  joelbear

  they are an incredibly well organized and well funded bureaucracy. they will be around after most of us have been long gone.
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  david_10

  Good question. As far as I'm concerned, the sooner the better, but I think it's a little premature to start predicting their ultimate demise. In 10 years, they'll still be here, alive & well, and you can count on it. A little worse for wear, for sure, but they'll be here. I expect numbers will drop to well under 6 million, and perhaps even fall to around 5 million.

  But the Society has proven that it has tremendous staying power and that it can take a punch------------------anything the world can throw, the WTBS can take. Except the Internet. God bless the Internet. But it's going to take longer than 10 years. I give it at least 20, and probably closer to 30 years.

  But here's the big problem: the Society is extremely wealthy, and, even with diminishing contributions, it's still a force to be reckoned with. And money, of course, is the key to survival. So with careful planning and another well-laid-out Armageddon prediction------------------------who knows, even in 30 years they might still be going strong.

  However, even if the publishing/real estate empire falls apart, the religion itself will still be here. Just like there's still a few Second Adventists and even a few Russellites, there will always be a few JW's out there beating the bushes.

  David
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  garybuss

  The Watch Tower may stay in business but the question I ask myself is how much do they influence the Witness people? The theme for the past series of conventions is obedience. The theme of the recent elder's training program is obey the Society. The Watchtower magazine study articles focus on obey the organization and obey the elders, and appreciate the Governing Body's food.
  
  It's all telling me, the Witness people don't obey the elders, the elders don't obey the Society and none of them appreciate the Governing Body's orders. I think the Society has lost it's credibility with the Witness people. The elders have lost the respect of the Witness people (because they aren't respectable).
  
  The Society is laboring here under a delusion. The Society thinks people associate with the Witness people because of the Society produced literature and because of the Society produced sermons. The fact is, people associate with the Witness people because of the Witness people.
  
  Most new recruits don't like what they hear but they do like WHAT THEY SEE. Much of the information required for acceptance by Witnesses is not even exposed to the new recruits until they are under contract. This is not by accident. The Society knows their information is really not acceptable and it needs to be hidden, things like shunning your parents and children and not attending weddings and funerals.
  
  Questions for new recruits don't cover how long you shun your parents or why you can't attend your daughter's wedding. There's a reason for that.
  
  Witnesses are Witnesses IN SPITE OF THE LITERATURE, not because of it. The Witness people are not obeying the Society guidelines because the Society's rules are stupid rules. Brooklyn, read this . . . The Witness people work this hard for you as screwed up as you are now, think what they would do if you got your act together and gave them something good and rewarding to do.
  
  
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  Virgogirl

  Gary, that was an incredibly eye opening insight! That answers my question of why my elderly parents, who are not stupid, blind people, keep going to the Hall! It isn't for the Sunday talk, or the bookstudy, it's to visit with their friends, lifelong ones, who are good people and dear to them. They daydream through the bla-bla-bla drone of the talk, and then have a nice time socializing!
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  Axelspeed

  I agree with you Gary. The problem is there is no one with the combination of charisma/cajones to put their neck one the line to propose anything radical enough to turn the ship around. They have already made an example of a few to instill the needed fear. Here are a few changes that I believe would begin to turn it around. Take note WT:

  1. Get rid of the mandatory DF/ DA policy. Make it voluntary and based on individual conscience. Most people don’t choose to associate with unsavory individuals anyway, much less invite them into there homes. Shunning family is just cruel and unnatural.

  1. Get rid of the Service Meeting and combine it with the TMS, and put the emphasis on the bible, not pushing literature. A lot of people like the TMS and the idea of giving talks and being involved. The TMS was probably one of the good things that JWs come away with that helps in real life (public speaking). The Service Meeting is showing itself to be nothing more than a sales meeting on how to push books and magazines. While you’re at it, get rid of the Book Study too.

  1. Get away from the book publishing business. It’s dead- in the way you have benefited from it. The internet is here, and while the printed text will always be here, the way the WT does it is becoming antiquated and dated- and it shows. This is becoming increasingly evident, even to dubs. Find something else- like real estate ; )

  1. Cut back drastically on the door to door work, maybe to once a month (voluntarily), because let’s face it, the dubs look just plain weird out there now every week. Dubs like to have the distinction of witnessing, but not every freakin week. Diversify into alternate forms of service and volunteer work. Take advantage of the idealism of kids and promote more volunteer work.

  1. Allow more freeness of thought. Go back to the mentality of the Bible Students- always searching for a truer truth, but never being dogmatic enough to claim possession of an absolute truth.

  1. Totally revamp/remove the blood policy- a very tough but necessary change. This will be the biggie. Cut your losses and move on. There will be big losses, but coupled with the following, they would bounce back eventually.

  1. Realize that JWs are JWs not so much because of the theology anymore, but more for the social. It is already becoming a social club. Most dubs couldn’t defend their theology, even with the literature now. But people do want to be around others like them that they can generally trust. And JWs are basically decent and good people. Some people need this. In fact, there will always be people who need this. Spend money to make money (i.e. build a more satisfying subculture).

  1. Stop denigrating higher education. The rationale is just not flying anymore, even with diehard dubs. They missed out, and want more for there kids. You should too- more education= greater satisfaction. Don’t worry about the contributions, they will come. I’ve seen people give money to far more ridiculous things.

  1. Get away from the OT and concentrate more on the gospel accounts. I think you would be amazed at the result.

  1. Stop trying to invent stuff just to be different. Not celebrating Mother’s Day, Father’s Day, birthdays, or Thanksgiving? Come on, give us a break! These are rules where they are not needed or appreciated, and a stretch to justify. Let them have something.

  My fingers are tired now, but that should get you started. But you should hurry, because the hemorrhaging is increasing.

  Axel