Posts by Aroq

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

So what you are telling me is that you do not believe there is ANY inspired word of God. Got it. Then what are you even arguing about if you believe none of it?

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

So what you are telling me designs, is that you do not believe in Jesus. I get that loud and clear. You think I am dogging your question, but the reality of it is your question is illogical. I suppose your next question would be "can God make a rock so big that even He cannot lift it?" designs, I see that we are not going to have a very productive discussion as you keep insisting that I have not answered your question. I have, you just do not like the answer because it does not pin me against any of your preconcieved rebuttles. Look, I can only tell you what I know, you can choose to ignore it or argue. I'm not into playing the what if game, especially when I have the answer in the Bible.

Give me your proof that Jesus was giving commands that were already in place. I see none of it in God's inspired word.

23

The Circuit Overseer Visit

by garyneal in

last week, the circuit overseer came to visit my wifes congregation and as usual their patterns change somewhat during this week.

from my perspective, the meetings are held on tuesday and thursday instead of the normal wednesday night during this week and they are more eager to go out in field service.

sunday came and my wife wanted us to attend the meeting.

Aroq

Since we are talking about hypocrisy and you mentioned blood:

if JW's are allowed to accept fractions of blood, who donated the blood to gather the fractions from?

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

"You could have easily drawn on Bible only examples of times when God granted humans and angels his powers to do many things ie Resurrections, miracle cures, controlling weather etc."

designs, you have answered your own question with an answer you wanted to hear.

"Aroq- Can you see that people making Jesus into God was superfluous just by the Bible's examples alone."

People do not make Jesus who He is. Think about this for a moment. Who is Jesus to add to YHWH's commandments? Is this not superseeding YHWH?

examples:

John 13:34 " 34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. "

Matthew 5: 21 “You have heard that the ancients were told, ‘ You shall not commit murder ’ and ‘Whoever commits murder shall be liable to the court.’ 22 But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

I dodged nothing designs. I spoke to your evidence and told you why I do not accept it as scripture.

The lack of authority on your evidence makes it commentary, and commentary is the perspective of the one who writes it.

My answer was "God can and does according to His will, as described in the Bible." Does this limit God to just what is written in the Bible? No, it is just that is what we have to go by.

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

You have referenced a non-Biblical text, 11Q13 is written in Hebrew however not considered a Biblical manuscript. This puts it in the catagory of comentary for me. While it may contain names or figures that are found in the Bible, it is not considered part of the Hebrew Bible by the Rabbi's and scholars.

In other words, it does not sway me away from the Bible and what the Bible speaks of. God can and does according to His will, as described in the Bible. I'm not trying to be blunt about it, but I believe that the Bible is the only inspired word of God and that is what I must rely upon.

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

designs,

some of it, but the Dead Sea Scrolls are a two part group. One of that being Biblical and one not. While there are plenty of religious material out there, it is the Bible that is the inspired word of God, the rest is comentary.

The Qumran Caves Scrolls contain significant religious literature. They consist of two types: “biblical” manuscripts—books found in today’s Hebrew Bible, and “non-biblical” manuscripts—other religious writings circulating during the Second Temple era, often related to the texts now in the Hebrew Bible. Of this second category, some are considered “sectarian” in nature, since they appear to describe the religious beliefs and practices of a specific religious community. http://www.deadseascrolls.org.il/learn-about-the-scrolls/introduction

Israel's God was the God of gods, meaning no equal as to being the supreme. Some of the writings state that these "gods" worshiped the God of Israel, this can be the limited understanding of "angels" at the time. While YHWH is called God, no other "god" of these terms were called YHWH.

My statement still stands based upon my knowledge of the Dead Sea Scrolls. If you have further proof to dispute my statement, please provide so that I can read up and understand where you are comming from.

52

Colossians 1:15-16 and the word "other"

by yogosans14 in

"he is the image of the invisible god, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities.

all [other] things have been created through him and for him.

" (col. 1:15-17, for context.

Aroq

The reason why a "lessor god" theory is important is because God is one, and if you add a "lessor god" who is also worshiped, then you have polytheism. Polytheism is against God's word. Worship has and is being given to Jesus, if He is not God then you have a problem.

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