The Circuit Overseer Visit

by garyneal 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • garyneal
    garyneal

    Last week, the circuit overseer came to visit my wife’s congregation and as usual their patterns change somewhat during this week. From my perspective, the meetings are held on Tuesday and Thursday instead of the normal Wednesday night during this week and they are more eager to go out in field service. Sunday came and my wife wanted us to attend the meeting. Normally, I do not bother attending meetings because I do not support their beliefs and practices. While I think they are sincere people who only try to worship God in the only way they know how their prohibitions on all holidays and birthdays and their murderous blood doctrine prevents me from ever considering joining this religion even if I could overlook all their other faults. In truth, it is their murderous blood doctrine alone that prevents me from considering joining this religion even if I were willing to give up the holidays and birthdays. I would never in good conscious allow a person to die due to a dietary restriction found in the Old Testament.

    That said, since this was a ‘special occasion’ and since it was important to her that we all attend as a family I went with her to the meeting that day and did I get a gem from the CO. The circuit overseer gave a talk about the last days and what events in the world tie in with Bible prophecy. I thought, “Oh great, the usual apocalyptic clap trap that I used to hear at my old Independent Fundamental Baptist church.” One thing I notice about tying current events with Bible prophecy is that somehow the events that tie to specific prophetic claims in the Bible tend to change as time moves on and Jesus has not yet returned. In fact, I pointed out this to my wife when I told her later that while I am first to say ‘Jesus take the wheel’ in regards to His coming religions do a disservice by constantly instilling fear by always insisting that His coming in imminent. The signs of the end have been around for centuries going all the way back to Jesus’ time and Christians should take heed to Christ’s warnings regarding how it is not for us to know the date or the time of the end. I got enough of that crap from the IFBs and have since decided that I will just live my life as best as I can with as much honesty and integrity as I am able and if I am to be damned, let me be damned for who I really am.

    But the gem I got from the circuit overseer that day came when he discussed the harlot and the wild beast found in the book of Revelations. The harlot was of course the churches of Christendom, “no surprise there,” I thought as it never fails that it would not be a JW meeting without at least one mention of those awful churches of Christendom. I was expecting that the wild beast would be either the world’s governments or the European Union as this is what I used to hear in my IFB churches. Close, it was the United Nations. The circuit overseer gave a brief history lesson of them and tied them into the wild beast. I wrote in my notepad and showed to my wife that, “The Watchtower Society used to be an NGO member of the United Nations.” I later confirmed this by doing a Google search and finding both a Wikipedia article on the subject and a page on jwfacts.com. Plus, the statement from the UN that I found on their website clenched it. From 1992 to 2001, the Watchtower Society was indeed an NGO member of the UN even though they had for years railed against them calling them the wild beast in Revelations. Learning what I learned about their association with the UN, I am surprised that the CO would make such a comment in his talk. Evidently, he never got the memo.

    So are people like my wife hypocrites for adhering to a religion that preaches against the churches of Christendom saying not to associate with them while at the same time joining the YMCA and attending college at a Christian university? Would it be hypocritical for a witness to attend an office holiday or go with their spouse to a holiday function when they are told not to have any part of these events? How about the witness who attends a church wedding or funeral for their non-witness relative? Well, far be it for me to tell an individual to violate his or her own conscious but I find it very hypocritical on the part of the Watchtower to tell their witnesses these things when they themselves went against their conscious and signed on to become an NGO member of the wild beast for 9 years only to disassociate when they were caught doing so.

  • cultBgone
    cultBgone

    But 99.999% of jdubs don't know about the NGO "wt scandal"...and if you told them, the pat answer would surely be, "Oh, but they stopped when they realized it was wrong, just like they stopped celebrating christmas."

    Their minds are so warped and washed and wadded up...the poor dears have lost all ability to T H I N K. Don't expect them to R E A S O N too.

    That's why it's like a miracle when anyone leaves....and why we continue to try to reach them.

    It's nice that you can openly share ttatt with your wife...is it helping?

  • garyneal
    garyneal

    It's nice that you can openly share ttatt with your wife...is it helping?

    Nope, those pat answers were her answers as well. Nevermind the fact that they KNOWINGLY went into their relationship with the UN knowing that they were the wild beast. Somehow, they went in thinking something was right and left when they discovered it was wrong. Unreachable...

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    Somehow, they went in thinking something was right and left when they discovered it was wrong.

    Gary, that's an acceptable excuse for you or me or your wife since we are all directed and motivated by our imperfecting thinking. The bigger issue is that the WTS claims to have JEHOVAH's direction via His Holy Spirit. You see, your statement above should say "when it was discovered THEY were wrong".

    How on earth or why on earth did GOD direct them to participate in the UN if it is the Image of the Wild Beast (as mentioned in Revelation)? How the THEY get it wrong if THEY are led along by God's Holy Spirit?

    So one must ask: Are they really being directed by JEHOVAH? This is where the congnitive dissonance kicks in. It's a question that cannot be answered, therefore in JWLand it's a question that CANNOT BE ASKED.

    Doc

  • Oubliette
    Oubliette

    It was the UN/NGO controversy that got me to wake up to TTATT.

    If the average JW went to a YMCA to use the swimming pool, they would likely be disfellowshipped for apostasy. Yet the WTBTS was a card-carrying member of the UN for nearly a decade.

    Watchtower, January 1st, 1979, Questions From Readers:

    In joining the YMCA as a member a person accepts or endorses the general objectives and principles of the organization. He is not simply paying for something he receives, such as when buying things being sold to the public at a store. (Compare 1 Corinthians 8:10; 10:25.) Nor is his membership merely an entry pass, as when a person buys a theater ticket. Membership means that one has become an integral part of this organization founded with definite religious objectives, including the promotion of interfaith. Hence, for one of Jehovah's Witnesses to become a member of such a so-called "Christian" association would amount to apostasy.Emphasis added

    There are no words to describe the hypocrisy of this religion and its leaders. They cruelly destroy many lives because of their draconian policies yet hypocritically disregard their own legalistic rules with impunity.

  • tornapart
    tornapart

    The NGO thing is untenable. They went into it KNOWING it was wrong. They knew they had to publicize the UN, as an NGO, which they did in the Awake mag. Then they only left it once they got caught with their hand in the cookie jar and outed in the Guardian paper.

  • AndDontCallMeShirley
    AndDontCallMeShirley

    But 99.999% of jdubs don't know about the NGO "wt scandal"...and if you told them, the pat answer would surely be, "Oh, but they stopped when they realized it was wrong

    My response to this would be: if WT realized it was wrong and corrected their ways, why did they immediately join the OSCE as an NGO? The OSCE is the European sister organization of the UN, and their goals are so similar to the UN's they are viewed as one and the same. The OSCE is a self-described "political-military organization".

    WT is still an NGO with the OSCE.

    --

    http://www.osce.org/who

    Who we are

    With 56 States from Europe, Central Asia and North America, the OSCE is the world's largest regional security organization. It offers a forum for political negotiations and decision-making in the fields of early warning, conflict prevention, crisis management and post-conflict rehabilitation, and puts the political will of its participating States into practice through its unique network of field missions.

    The OSCE has a comprehensive approach to security that encompasses politico-military, economic and environmental, and human aspects. It therefore addresses a wide range of security-related concerns, including arms control, confidence- and security-building measures, human rights, national minorities, democratization, policing strategies, counter-terrorism and economic and environmental activities.

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    In truth, it is only wrong relative to their doctrinal interpretation of Revelation. Of course, that interpretation is bunk and the United Nations is not the Scarlet-colored Wild Beast.

    Sometimes I do wonder if the people who run this show know that too...and what else are they secretly involved in? How deep does the rabbit hole go? Are they now more discreet in the information age using front organization? For instance, do they lobby lawmakers?

  • AndDontCallMeShirley
    AndDontCallMeShirley

    garyneal: Learning what I learned about their association with the UN, I am surprised that the CO would make such a comment in his talk. Evidently, he never got the memo

    Gary- historically WT has a long and established record of condemning other religions for doing the very same thing WT is doing or will eventually be doing as time goes on.

    The difference is, when other religions do these things it's a sin, "apostasy"; when WT does it, they they come up with 1,001 rationalizations why it's acceptable.

    At the very same time WT was condemning the Catholic Church for having no less than 24 NGO positions with the UN, WT was also an NGO.

    It is the height of hypocrisy.

  • ProfCNJ
    ProfCNJ

    How on earth or why on earth did GOD direct them to participate in the UN if it is the Image of the Wild Beast (as mentioned in Revelation)? How the THEY get it wrong if THEY are led along by God's Holy Spirit?

    This post from Desirousofchange really caught my attention. If UN is the wild beast, an organization that is against God and has received severe criticisms from the WT over more than a decade, then who would even expect to see the WT becoming an NGO member of the UN?

    Take the case of a highly reputable police officer who is very popular in a city because of his campaign against criminal syndicates and dangerous secret organizations. What would happen if you would discover that police officer himself is a secret member of one of the notorious syndicates, though not active in supporting its criminal activities? Would you not call it INSANE, SHOCKING, and UNBELIEVABLE?

    Another example would be a man who is an officer and staunch supporter of an organization which protects women's rights against violence e.g. physical abuse particularly by erring husbands. What would be your reaction if you discovered that his wife is a battered one?

    Let our readers exercise discernment.

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