Posts by Monsieur

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

And?

and?! please see your comment below.

Thus saying "God is love" is connecting two imperceptible concepts together, but neither one is perceptible, and hence neither can be described as a symbol for the other.

yet the PICTURE (which represents comedy and tragedy) of the mask IS symbolizing THEATER (another imperceptible).

in other words, one symbol IS reprenting another symbol, (otherwise know as layering) perfectly possible by virtue of what a SYMBOL is.

your next post then neatly falls into place

To anyone who didn't yet know of the meaning associated with the symbol (in ALL of it's various permutations), it carries no meaning: they wouldn't KNOW that it's a symbol for the theater since it has to be TAUGHT. It is a LEARNED association, and one accepted and used as a convention.

totally agree with this.

You cannot now claim that the two masks actually represent, say, the used cars sales profession, and expect anyone else to honor that re-definition of it's meaning. Yet that's precisely what you are attempting to do by "moving the goalposts" and changing the definition of God into something else than what is commonly associated with the word.

here, however, you contradict your previous comment, or at least your are limiting the individual who wishes to comprehend a symbol's deeper meaning by stating to him that his first understanding upon seeing the symbol is the ONLY acceptable understanding.

this is not 'changing the goalposts', it is progressive understanding.

you MUST agree that the 'conventional' idea of God is a failed idea.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

Symbols are not exclusive: there can be MANY meanings associated with symbols.

adam

lol, what have i been saying all this time!?

let me also correct you. you are seeing a PICTURE of a mask, not the masks themselves.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

Monsieur, you seemingly don't grasp that a 'symbol' is perceptible, and is thus helpful to represents an imperceptible (eg a rose is said to be a symbol of love).

adam,

let's settle this 'definition of what a symbol is' issue now, lol.

they symbol above, what does it stand for?

it stands or represents comedy and tragedy. (both of which or NOT perceptible according to you, only the manifestations of comedy and tragedy are perceptible. )

YET, this symbol also represents, THEATER (another imperceptible concept!) In fact, the play for which this symbol is used might not even have humor in it! But the symbol applies nonetheless! When you look at it, ALL these things come to mind at once in your mind, and thus the symbol has done its job.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

caedes,

I see you have changed your position. The second statement just sounds to me like 'I want to define my god in such a way that the idea is so nebulous that it is beyond critical review' Which is fine because it means that your god is completely and utterly ephemeral.

there are two obstacles that are currently preventing you from understanding what i am stating.

you believe that i am being complicted and two, you are still seeing 'God' as a literal person in the heavens somewhere ready to dispatch angels of death to inflict punishment on the next sinner.

i am not being complex, i simply stated that 'God' is a SYMBOL. a symbol represents MANY things. that is not complex! therefore, God CAN be love, loyalty, wisdom, power, intelect, insight, why? Because these are all GOOD things, and God is also defined as good.

When we read that God is perfect and infalliable, it cannot possibly be an old man in heaven, because you and i know that he doesnt exist due to lack of proof. Obviously then, 'God' must be something else. what? what is perfect and infalliable, indefinetely trustworthy? i argue that in this case, it is science and math, AND your mother's love (or MY mother's love).

This is possible because 'God' is a SYMBOL, representing many things. Remeber, the name attributed to God is Jehovah Yahweh, and it is suppose to mean 'I will be WHATEVER i need to be'.

Are you prepared to admit you were completely and utterly wrong about Gallileo?

sure, i used Galileo in an improper comparison. but with a very specific reason. that the current line of thought is always open to questioning and reinterpretation, as i am doing in this thread.

After all when we talk about power, justice, wisdom and love we are talking about our (humans) power, justice, wisdom and love since those concepts were defined long before the bible was written.

here i will differ with you. can we REALLY prove that the concept of 'God' came along well after the these listed attributes? if we can't, then we should not assume it as fact. I am open to the idea that both of these concepts originate in the mind of man at about the same time.

Well now are back to stating god is love and changing the definition of words, you really should make up your mind. By the way how is the definition of god, loyalty? The whole first half of the bible has god vacillating between loving people and killing them. Would you like some examples from the bible showing god displaying a lack of wisdom, and generally being a murderous twat?

here is where you make the second mistake. you KNOW 'God' is not a literal bearded man somewhere in heaven, yet your reaction toward these accounts would indicate otherwise. You react to a SYMBOL as you would react to a literal person. Man has a tendency to do this, watching a fictitious movie can arise strong emotions in us for example.

what you are reading Caedes, are also symbols, NOT actual accounts of literal occurrences. If you don't believe me, show me proof that they actually happened.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

Whatever reasons 'God' has had for never intervening to prevent evil in the past are the same reasons he will never intervene in the future. Hell, if he won't do anything to stop an atomic bomb being dropped on hundreds of thousands of innocent women and children and he won't lift a finger to stop the systematic torture and extermination of millions of his former old covenant people the Jews, why would we expect him to ever intervene in the future?

Just face your existential crisis and deal with it!

yada yada,

you are expecting a 'god' that has never intervened to start intervening now?

this should be another clue as to what 'God' cannot be.

we've often heard the phrase 'If you were god, would you stop all the evil in th world?' And we respond (hopefully) 'Yes!'

i don't concur with the idea that we should just deal with our existense as it is. we have a lot of power to change the status quo. the day that ALL of mankind decides to put this thought to action, evil will be considerably less prevalent. When man decides to Love more, and hate less, you will see the ultimate representation of the symbol of God as love.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

adam, now you are unnecessarily complicating the definition of SYMBOL-

When you say the word 'God' out loud, the sound waves travel thru the air and enter the listener's ears, but that is NOT interacting with God: they're hearing you say the word, and that triggers a mental image of their concept of God to be constructed in their brain. But they're not having an interaction with God, for if they did, they wouldn't need something to represent God, since he would represent Himself! You are not a symbol for yourself: you ARE yourself.

after a symbol is looked at (using sense of sight), why does it matter wether you 'interact' with it or not?? i can look at a red octagon, think of 'stop' and completely keep going. the symbol still did its job, it conveyed an idea in my head. lol

So when you say, "God is love", you're now trying to link TWO imperceptible mental constructs together (emotions like 'love' are not directly perceptible, just their manifestations, which we may perceive in say, eg the facial expressions of others). But then you're claiming that the emotion is perceptible by labelling the imperceptible part (God) as a symbol FOR love?

actually, the BIBLE says God is Love (it's in there.)

is it only a coincidence that two 'imperceptible' constructs are one and the same?

by now the point should be clear, the symbol of God exists to help us comprehend complicated and profound truths. Love and wisdom may require a lot of words to thoroughly explain its meaning and definition (as you attempt to do above).

the SYMBOL of God is meant to conjure up all these words into a simple and succinct 'concept' in our minds and hearts, hence the Biblical phrase 'God is Love'. It really is as simple as that.

164

Did Cedars manipulate Lee into having a thread closed?

by cedars in

i will happily answer this question if there can be some guarantees this thread won't be deleted..

Monsieur

hey?!

doesn't this prove the whole 'god allows evil to exist because...'

lol

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

God is an idea, a concept, a hypothesis. God is not visible or tangible, so NOT a symbol (which is visible, and stands for something else).

A symbol is an object that represents, stands for, or suggests an idea, visual image, belief, action, or material entity. Symbols take the form of words, sounds, gestures, or visual images and are used to convey ideas and beliefs. For example, a red octagon may be a symbol for "STOP". On a map, a picture of a tent might represent a campsite. Numerals are symbols for numbers. Personal names are symbols representing individuals. A red rose symbolizes love and compassion. - from wikipedia

states here that symbols take form of 'words, sounds, gestures', none of which are visible or tangible.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

caedes

Intellectual dishonesty is leaving out facts and observations that do not fit with your hypothesis.

i did not do this either. however, adamah believed i did. hence the example.

Putting the cart before the horse if you can't define what god is. Why would you accept answers from the bible?

actually, i've been defining God, as a Symbol. of what? well, of love for example.

You are separating The comment from Adamah works perfectly well without the phrase 'commonly accepted'. If you have redefined god to be those particular words then have you started replacing the word love with god, when you get home to your significant other do you say "I god you"? If you don't then clearly you accept Adamah's assertion that those words are already defined.

by using the phrase 'commmonly accepted' adamah confirmed that terms have their pre-conditioned definition.

but please remember that i am stating that God is a SYMBOL, a symbol representing many things and possible open to various interpretations. A symbol can be a synonym, which is what you allude to when using the example of 'i god you'.

but when the Bible states that God is Love, it is conveying the idea of love, just like a symbol conveys an idea or a concept, not necessarily a literal synonym.

Non-existant

except, Love does in fact exist. as well as wisdom, good and wholesomeness, loyalty.

100

cantleave had a valid opinion. Is God like a pencil-pointless?

by KateWild in

i don't know?

what do you think?.

kate xx.

Monsieur

I stated that God is a SYMBOL.

That's flat-out wrong.

adamah,

so if god is NOT a symbol, what the heck is he???

lol, see, this is why people like kate are confused.