Posts by Recovery

278

Jwfacts-- More Lies But This Time About The Great Crowd

by Recovery in

jwfacts has an article that explains why the great crowd must be in heaven.

i am also aware that many of these are the same arguments that stemmed from the 'awakenings at bethel' so my statements are not simply attacks of jwfact's character (since these arguments are probably not original) but rather his copy and paste of what others have said instead of verifying it as 'fact' for himself.. so here are jwfacts arguments:.

1. he shows that russell and rutherford (at some point) believed that the great crowd were in heaven.. 2. each term that describes the great crowd of revelation 7 is else used to described the anointed by the wt.

Recovery

Can anyone answer these questions:

How can the anointed, immortal anointed ones who are not subject to the physical realm and its effects experience these things in a FUTURE SENSE.

How can those who are immortal be guided to the fountains of waters of life?

How will they 'no longer hunger or thirst or experience the heat from the sun' anymore when they have HEAVENLY, SPIRITUAL, IMMORTAL BODIES?

How WILL God wipe out every tear from their eyes when they are already in heaven with incorruptible, immortal spiritual bodies?

This is directed to all those who hold the view that the great crowd is in heaven and not on earth.

278

Jwfacts-- More Lies But This Time About The Great Crowd

by Recovery in

jwfacts has an article that explains why the great crowd must be in heaven.

i am also aware that many of these are the same arguments that stemmed from the 'awakenings at bethel' so my statements are not simply attacks of jwfact's character (since these arguments are probably not original) but rather his copy and paste of what others have said instead of verifying it as 'fact' for himself.. so here are jwfacts arguments:.

1. he shows that russell and rutherford (at some point) believed that the great crowd were in heaven.. 2. each term that describes the great crowd of revelation 7 is else used to described the anointed by the wt.

Recovery

Yes, jwfacts claims to present the facts about Jehovah's Witnesses, so therefore everything on the website must be factual. On this forum we are encouraged to examine/scrutizine every little statement/picture in the WT publications, so I am simply holding the author to the same standards the members of this board hold the WT.

As I said, discussing this website is very time efficient, as it contains most ex JW arguments from many sources consolidated into one.

35

Dear Recovery...

by OneDayillBeFree in

it is 3am here and i just finished reading your last post and even though i have to be up at 6am tomorrow morning (technically later), i felt obligated to login to jwn and write to you.

i thought about saying many things.

hurtful things.

Recovery

I do not think that is fair ChristAlone. How would you know my attitude behind what I am saying? Especially if i'm not using derogatory and extremely insulting language that is often employed on this forum. It is not my viewpoint that the WT is 100% correct on everything and that everything that is in opposition to the WT must be false and is of no validation. If I thought that, do you really think I would have ever read jwfacts website. Or Towerwatch. Or jeffro's blog. Or Don Cameron's book. Or (as im the current process) of reading Ray Franz's books. Or watching AllTimeJeff's Youtube videos. Or reading all the stories on SilentLambs and also Barbara Anderson's website.

It has everything to do with my OWN research. I am not your average JW who just reads the WT Publications and concludes that everything is 100% right. Because of my own doubts in the past I research and still am in the process of researching EVERYTHING. From the original greek texts to the references used in support of doctrine.

I do not think that is a fair assessment of who I am, how I think, or how I act. Anymore than it is fair for me to call all apostates liars, mentally diseased, and so forth because that is not the case for many ex JW's.

278

Jwfacts-- More Lies But This Time About The Great Crowd

by Recovery in

jwfacts has an article that explains why the great crowd must be in heaven.

i am also aware that many of these are the same arguments that stemmed from the 'awakenings at bethel' so my statements are not simply attacks of jwfact's character (since these arguments are probably not original) but rather his copy and paste of what others have said instead of verifying it as 'fact' for himself.. so here are jwfacts arguments:.

1. he shows that russell and rutherford (at some point) believed that the great crowd were in heaven.. 2. each term that describes the great crowd of revelation 7 is else used to described the anointed by the wt.

Recovery

Time is at Hand, 1916 edition. Opening forward:

"Our mistake was evidently not in respect to the ending of the Times of the Gentiles; we drew a FALSE conclusion, however, not authorized by the Word of the Lord."

9-1-83 wt
"Although the Bible Students had elders and deacons (ministerial servants), FALSE religious ideasstill prevailed in some respects. Thus right into the 20th century elders were chosen by the congregations through a democratic voting process, indicated by a show of hands."

The WT has admitted to reaching false conclusions and promoting false religious ideas. I am just waiting on jwfacts to admit the same. THAT'S the difference between the two.

35

Dear Recovery...

by OneDayillBeFree in

it is 3am here and i just finished reading your last post and even though i have to be up at 6am tomorrow morning (technically later), i felt obligated to login to jwn and write to you.

i thought about saying many things.

hurtful things.

Recovery

For the same reason you continually dismiss people's personal experiences as fictitious when they don't paint the picture of spiritual paradise you want to believe exists among the JWs. You just can't help yourself.

Who/what are you referring to? Candace Conti?

6

Recovery - Here is the 'Earthly Hope" in the bible

by EndofMysteries in

i personally am inconclusive about the great crowd, but i have found many scriptures that address the earthly part and they do not at all agree with what the wt teaches about it.

i want your thoughts on this.

first look up rev 20:7-9. this is after the thousand years have ended and satan is released.

Recovery

Your interpretation is interesting. I will have to back through and reread a few of these chapters to give an honest response.

35

Dear Recovery...

by OneDayillBeFree in

it is 3am here and i just finished reading your last post and even though i have to be up at 6am tomorrow morning (technically later), i felt obligated to login to jwn and write to you.

i thought about saying many things.

hurtful things.

Recovery

Point noted ChristAlone. I will refrain from the use of the word apostate. I will simply use the term ex JW. Is that fair?

278

Jwfacts-- More Lies But This Time About The Great Crowd

by Recovery in

jwfacts has an article that explains why the great crowd must be in heaven.

i am also aware that many of these are the same arguments that stemmed from the 'awakenings at bethel' so my statements are not simply attacks of jwfact's character (since these arguments are probably not original) but rather his copy and paste of what others have said instead of verifying it as 'fact' for himself.. so here are jwfacts arguments:.

1. he shows that russell and rutherford (at some point) believed that the great crowd were in heaven.. 2. each term that describes the great crowd of revelation 7 is else used to described the anointed by the wt.

Recovery

Leolaia I would like for you to address post 167 when you are able.

35

Dear Recovery...

by OneDayillBeFree in

it is 3am here and i just finished reading your last post and even though i have to be up at 6am tomorrow morning (technically later), i felt obligated to login to jwn and write to you.

i thought about saying many things.

hurtful things.

Recovery

I do not understand why people continue to say I use insults and ad hominem attacks when I do nothing of the sort. Yes, I use sarcasm but it is not in angry or condescending or any other derogatory, gross manner. It is simply my way of having fun and exposing flaws in thinking and why people shouldn't take every single word I type in such extreme seriousness. Maybe sarcasm does not come across well, without a human voice behind the words.

I will refrain from sarcasm whenever possible, as it is constantly misinterpreted/thought to be some sort of arrogance or ad hominem attack.

Thanks for the letter, points noted. In my short time here, I have already received several emails from struggling JW's who were lurking that told me that my posts helped them. If I helped one JW free themselves of the lies spread on the internet, then all my efforts were certainly worth it.

The point of my name is that I was once a borderline apostate. It is absolutely debilitating and crushing to your spirituality from that point forward. I am recovering day by day and this is my way of doing so. Wish you the best as well.

20

Recovery - does your yes mean yes or not?

by tootired2care in

recovery, .

here http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/238054/4/the-bible-full-of-errors-and-inconsistencies#4493307 you stated:.

"i will start a thread addressing each allegation of actual substance.

Recovery

I was researching jwfacts long before I started the thread the Bible inconsistency thread. That thread was started as a basis for FUTURE research, while jwfacts/the great crowd was an aspect of my present research. Yes, there is a difference.