Book that alleges to have come through some galactic spirit medium. 2000 pages long, covers everything.
peacefulpete
JoinedPosts by peacefulpete
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How to reason with friends
by peacefulpete inwe have long time friends who are seriously involved with the urantia book.
they have regular meetings with others and seem to have become convinced of its alien inspiration.
it seems mostly harmless but weirds out anyone who talks to them.. do any of you have experience with this or have suggestions about how to debunk the book?.
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How to reason with friends
by peacefulpete inwe have long time friends who are seriously involved with the urantia book.
they have regular meetings with others and seem to have become convinced of its alien inspiration.
it seems mostly harmless but weirds out anyone who talks to them.. do any of you have experience with this or have suggestions about how to debunk the book?.
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peacefulpete
We have long time friends who are seriously involved with the Urantia book. They have regular meetings with others and seem to have become convinced of its alien inspiration. It seems mostly harmless but weirds out anyone who talks to them.
Do any of you have experience with this or have suggestions about how to debunk the book?
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Front row seats watching the collapse of watchtower
by Indoubtbigtime ini’m a pimo ministerial servant and i won’t fade because i want to keep my front row seats watching what happens next few years.. my predictions are that this current governing body will slowly die off and the current younger helpers will be the next gb.
they will eventually have new light that they were wrong about 1914 and the overlapping generations.. the new light will be something on the lines of the last days are now because of king of north king of south pushing each other etc etc.
they will do their very best to burry old literature and try to change the past trying to make it sound like they were right all along just as they have done for 150 years now.
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peacefulpete
I suspect newly 'awakened' folks are imagining their own emotional break from the church somehow predicts the same for many others. The church has survived and grown through a century of contradictions, scandals, power struggles, and financial challenges. In my estimation, they have gotten much better at the game and the next decade of electronic media will likely be a golden age for them.
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The UN, was the WTS given special knowledge?
by peacefulpete inthe league of nations and the united nations in prophetic speculation
how is it that so many individuals through the centuries have found such a pleasure in playing the role of prophet, despite the fact that their prophecies so seldom come true?
regularly their predictions fail, yet they go on with prophesying.
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peacefulpete
Did The Witnesses Predict the United Nations in Advance?
I linked the above thread as it details what was actually taught and when.
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Front row seats watching the collapse of watchtower
by Indoubtbigtime ini’m a pimo ministerial servant and i won’t fade because i want to keep my front row seats watching what happens next few years.. my predictions are that this current governing body will slowly die off and the current younger helpers will be the next gb.
they will eventually have new light that they were wrong about 1914 and the overlapping generations.. the new light will be something on the lines of the last days are now because of king of north king of south pushing each other etc etc.
they will do their very best to burry old literature and try to change the past trying to make it sound like they were right all along just as they have done for 150 years now.
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peacefulpete
Indoubtbigtime.....Never Forget the Importance of Being Earnest.
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Hell, what is it
by Anony Mous inso perhaps we all heard the jw story about jesus talking to gehenna and he was referring to a place outside the city where there was a dump burning refuse and everyone knew what it meant.. according to jw.org: tradition relates that the valley of hinnom thereafter became a place for the disposal of garbage.
and the bible provides confirmation for this.
at jeremiah 31:40, for example, the valley of hinnom is evidently called the “low plain of the carcasses and of the fatty ashes.” there was also the “gate of the ash-heaps,” a gate that seems to have opened out onto the eastern extremity of the valley of hinnom at its juncture with the kidron valley.—nehemiah 3:13, 14.. i think i heard that in the study of the greatest teacher book first.
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peacefulpete
You have a nice manner and voice.
I think you have read into the shrewd manager story. The characters are explained to be "people of this world" not God and his worshipers. The parallel of those characters in the story to Christians was simply to stress using your riches to gain favor with God like the shrewd manager in a 'worldly' way gained favor with potential employers. The shrewd way he went about it was respected by his 'worldly' master because that's the unethical characterization of "people of this world" being made. He has depicted people of this world as selfish but wisely considering the future.
As far as the Rich man parable, if you are right and the writer of Luke wanted readers to grasp that it was all a clever twist of the prevailing beliefs of the afterlife, then he was just too clever.
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Hell, what is it
by Anony Mous inso perhaps we all heard the jw story about jesus talking to gehenna and he was referring to a place outside the city where there was a dump burning refuse and everyone knew what it meant.. according to jw.org: tradition relates that the valley of hinnom thereafter became a place for the disposal of garbage.
and the bible provides confirmation for this.
at jeremiah 31:40, for example, the valley of hinnom is evidently called the “low plain of the carcasses and of the fatty ashes.” there was also the “gate of the ash-heaps,” a gate that seems to have opened out onto the eastern extremity of the valley of hinnom at its juncture with the kidron valley.—nehemiah 3:13, 14.. i think i heard that in the study of the greatest teacher book first.
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peacefulpete
Vanderhoven.... First, writing a book has always been an ambition of mine but life had always gotten in the way, so good on you for accomplishing that. My earlier comment was prefaced by saying, "Jewish notions of death were hardly uniform", and perhaps I should have expanded upon that.
Yes what we seem to know about the Sadducee movement was a denial of a meaningful afterlife (or resurrection), while apparently still accepting the idea of shades existing in Sheol/Hades. That's quite natural as they did not recognize works like Daniel and Enoch.
The Pharisee movement seemed to be more in line with the larger Jewish world in accepting the intertestamental doctrine of resurrection. The Essenes likewise believed in immortal soul that would be rewarded.
The Gospels depict Jesus as pretty much quoting works of this late period, like Enoch and Daniel, in comments about the resurrection, in his rich man parable as well as his Gehenna warning. Jude directly quotes Enoch. Revelation carries this same concept quite clearly. A straightforward reading of the NT leads to the conclusion that Christians had fully embraced the concept of an afterlife reward or punishment in darkness and fire. The immediacy of that outcome seems to have varied in specifics, but the overall concept was pretty consistent.
In this more progressive age this doctrine has become a bit of an albatross and as a result it's become more popular to argue for it not being a Biblical idea. To do that usually they draw from OT texts written by earlier writers before the doctrine of resurrection was (possibly) adopted from the Zoroastrians, as if this proves later Jews did not believe it.
Next, they have to dismiss passages in the NT that clearly express this thought, usually by labeling them as metaphor or symbolism, or in the case of the rich man parable, declare since it was a parable it wasn't a reflection of beliefs. As if that somehow makes sense.
I respect anyone who rejects the concept as barbaric and vengeful but am perplexed by those who dismiss the doctrine while clinging to the writings that teach it.
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Is or was JEHOVAH GOD partial , and still is ?
by smiddy3 ini mean for the fact that he only dealt with and chose one body of people ?.
whatabout all of the other bodies of people all around the earth at that time ?.
apparently he didn`t care much for them !.
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peacefulpete
In much of the ancient world gods were regional patrons of the local people. The writers of the OT make this clear, Yahweh was their god whereas Chemosh,, for example, determined the possession of land for the Ammonites and Moabites.
Do you not possess what aChemosh your god gives you to possess? So whatever the Yahweh our God has driven out before us, we will possess it.
The failure to bless the local patron deity with gifts and worship was understood to result in loss and hardship. Amazingly when peoples traveled to other lands they routinely gave gifts and prayers to the local deities to ensure passage and prosperity while in that land. The Egyptians even set up small shrines to local deities throughout Palestine which actually place the Egyptian Hathor in a subservient position to the local gods. The deities of the Levant were even honored back home in Egypt for the purpose of protecting Egyptian interests and family living there. Similarly, an industry of producing amulets or blessing totems for Yahweh for those passing through Israel/Judah existed as in many other places.
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Hell, what is it
by Anony Mous inso perhaps we all heard the jw story about jesus talking to gehenna and he was referring to a place outside the city where there was a dump burning refuse and everyone knew what it meant.. according to jw.org: tradition relates that the valley of hinnom thereafter became a place for the disposal of garbage.
and the bible provides confirmation for this.
at jeremiah 31:40, for example, the valley of hinnom is evidently called the “low plain of the carcasses and of the fatty ashes.” there was also the “gate of the ash-heaps,” a gate that seems to have opened out onto the eastern extremity of the valley of hinnom at its juncture with the kidron valley.—nehemiah 3:13, 14.. i think i heard that in the study of the greatest teacher book first.
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peacefulpete
Vanderhoven....The earliest Christian conception of death is a continuation of the intertestamental ideas. Death of the body left the soul in a state of sleep or semiconsciousness until resurrected where their fates were divided. The WT take on this is too literal. They suggest death is a complete cessation of existence and resurrection therefore necessarily means a duplicate clone is created. If you want to get a very good review of this topic try:
Stories like the witch of Endor is pretty definitive about the belief that the dead were in some state of stasis but can be brought back to interact with the living. The fact that inquiring of the dead was a common practice and gifts of food on the graves also shows this. The appearance of Moses and Elijah with Jesus is pretty clear as well. The rich man and Lazarus story agrees with the idea that was popular that the souls awaited resurrection in different chambers of the heavens with different conditions. Nothing in the NT radically departs from the 'scriptures' of the intertestamental period.
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Hell, what is it
by Anony Mous inso perhaps we all heard the jw story about jesus talking to gehenna and he was referring to a place outside the city where there was a dump burning refuse and everyone knew what it meant.. according to jw.org: tradition relates that the valley of hinnom thereafter became a place for the disposal of garbage.
and the bible provides confirmation for this.
at jeremiah 31:40, for example, the valley of hinnom is evidently called the “low plain of the carcasses and of the fatty ashes.” there was also the “gate of the ash-heaps,” a gate that seems to have opened out onto the eastern extremity of the valley of hinnom at its juncture with the kidron valley.—nehemiah 3:13, 14.. i think i heard that in the study of the greatest teacher book first.
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peacefulpete
The Jewish notions of death were hardly uniform, however the ancient conception of the dead existing as 'shades' in a quasi-alive, mostly powerless state seemed to continue in some form till the age of Christianity. There were many very explicit writings that anticipated a future judgement of the souls in-waiting in sheol (or lower level in heaven). They were to be resurrected, those who were righteous would receive some blissful reward while those who were evil suffered, body and soul, in a terrible place of fire.
Leolaia compiled some good material on this topic:
Gehenna.