Posts by ShadesofGrey

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

What Name did Jesus Christ call on to be saved from death by resurrection before he died?

Jehovah.

Scripture?

178

1 John 4:2

by N.drew in

(the previous verse warns there will be false prophets).

by this you will know that the spirit is of god because the whole spirit is in agreement with jesus christ that among flesh (mankind) has come out of god is.. i think it means not was but what is.

it means we can believe christ is among us to do the will of god through us.

ShadesofGrey

some people say "let go, let God"

But that is assuming God works without, not within.

Wrong. When I said that it is because I apply these scriptures to you, to SA, to every believer. I trust that I don't need to overly concern myself with correcting others. I simply disagree, plant a seed and trust in God at work in your life in her life... I can even trust God to work in the lives of unbelievers. I don't need to continue debating until you see my point. I can let go and trust that He is in control of all things.

Colossians 1:27 And this is the secret: Christ lives in you.

1 John 2:27 But you have received the Holy Spirit, and he lives within you, so you don't need anyone to teach you what is true. For the Spirit teaches you everything you need to know, and what he teaches is true--it is not a lie. So just as he has taught you, remain in fellowship with Christ. 1 Corinthians 3:6 I planted the seed in your hearts, and Apollos watered it, but it was God who made it grow.

I am sure to believe God can work the will of God through my measley flesh it's not much of a jump

I agree. This applies to all who are being led by God's Spirit. When I left the JW organization it was a result of admitting I was wrong in everything and I had to trust Christ to lead me. As my one and only mediator. In fact I said, "I will never listen to those men again, Lord, only you." I allow His spirit to lead my in everything. I can do all things through Christ who gives me strength. Do not lean on your own understanding but in ALL your ways take notice of Him. He leads me to the scriptures I need. He leads me in my understanding of them. He shows me when people agree with Him, when their council is coming from the Spirit, and when it isn't. He teaches me how to show my love, how to be a parent, how to be a friend, how to get through days of pain and sickness with grace. I am nothing without Him. I am everything because of Him.

178

1 John 4:2

by N.drew in

(the previous verse warns there will be false prophets).

by this you will know that the spirit is of god because the whole spirit is in agreement with jesus christ that among flesh (mankind) has come out of god is.. i think it means not was but what is.

it means we can believe christ is among us to do the will of god through us.

ShadesofGrey

You are wrong about everything concerning me and my motives. My husband and I are one in the Spirit. I rely on the Spirit more than anything in my life. He leads me.

178

1 John 4:2

by N.drew in

(the previous verse warns there will be false prophets).

by this you will know that the spirit is of god because the whole spirit is in agreement with jesus christ that among flesh (mankind) has come out of god is.. i think it means not was but what is.

it means we can believe christ is among us to do the will of god through us.

ShadesofGrey

I don't hate Shelby at all and I am very offended that anyone said such a thing, and especially without PMs to clear it up.

Why is it that Shelby can admonish others but others are expected not to admonish her? Is it not, both coming from and going to Shelby, out of love?

Why is it that Shelby, Tammy and N. Drew never seem to admonish or even disagree with eachother, good grief, I disagree with my husband, and my mentors!

178

1 John 4:2

by N.drew in

(the previous verse warns there will be false prophets).

by this you will know that the spirit is of god because the whole spirit is in agreement with jesus christ that among flesh (mankind) has come out of god is.. i think it means not was but what is.

it means we can believe christ is among us to do the will of god through us.

ShadesofGrey

If there are different gifts, SA, why do you seem to put down anyone who does not have the same gift as you?

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

I have no idea what designs is talking about.

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

Yes, those were very good points Psac. I do not know why I thought this was a new thread. I went back to see who bumped it, and I guess it was me. hmmm... I do think it will help a friend of mine though, so it is all good. :)

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

Geneisis 18:2 When he raised his eyes, then he looked and there three men were standing some distance from him. When he caught sight of them he began running to meet them from the entrance of the tent and proceeded to bow down to the earth. 3 Then he said: “Jehovah, if, now, I have found favor in your eyes, please do not pass by your servant. 4 Let a little water be taken, please, and YOU must have YOUR feet washed. Then recline under the tree. 5 And let me get a piece of bread, and refresh YOUR hearts. Following that, YOU can pass on, because that is why YOU have passed this way to YOUR servant.” At this they said: “All right. You may do just as you have spoken.”

Genesis 19:1 Now the two angels arrived at Sod´om by evening, 10 So the men thrust out their hands and brought Lot in to them, into the house, and they shut the door. 11 But they struck with blindness the men who were at the entrance of the house, from the least to the greatest, so that they were wearing themselves out trying to find the entrance. 12 Then the men said to Lot: “Do you have anyone else here? Son-in-law and your sons and your daughters and all who are yours in the city, bring out of the place! 17 as soon as they had brought them forth to the outskirts, he began to say: “Escape for your soul! Do not look behind you and do not stand still in all the District! Escape to the mountainous region for fear you may be swept away!”

18 Then Lot said to them: “Not that, please, Jehovah! 19 Please, now, your servant has found favor in your eyes so that you are magnifying your loving-kindness, which you have exercised with me to preserve my soul alive, but I—I am not able to escape to the mountainous region for fear calamity may keep close to me and I certainly die. 20 Please, now, this city is nearby to flee there and it is a small thing. May I, please, escape there—is it not a small thing?—and my soul will live on.” 21 So he (Jehovah) said to him: “Here I do show you consideration to this extent also, by my not overthrowing the city of which you have spoken. 22 Hurry! Escape there, because I am not able to do a thing until your arriving there!” That is why he called the name of the city Zo´ar.

23 The sun had gone forth over the land when Lot arrived at Zo´ar. 24 Then Jehovah made it rain sulphur and fire from Jehovah, from the heavens, upon Sod´om and upon Go·mor´rah.

What is my point with all of this? Jesus is God (John 20:28, Hebrews 1 and 2). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4). The Father is God (Ephesians 4:6).

In the OT, Jehovah is the name of God.

In the NT, Jesus makes his Father's name known without ever using it. How does Jesus do this? Look at his name. The name Jesus in Greek = Yehoshuah in Hebrew = YHWH + Salvation

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

1 Peter 3:14 But even if YOU should suffer for the sake of righteousness, YOU are happy. However, the object of their fear do not YOU fear, neither become agitated. 15 But sanctify the Christ as Lord in YOUR hearts,

(sanctify= set apart as holy)

Isaiah 8: 12 and the object of their fear YOU men must not fear, nor must YOU tremble at it. 13 Jehovah of armies—he is the One whom YOU should treat as holy, and he should be the object of YOUR fear, and he should be the One causing YOU to tremble.”

1 Peter 2 4 As you come to him, the living Stone—rejected by men but chosen by God and precious to him— 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 For in Scripture it says:

“See, I lay a stone in Zion,

a chosen and precious cornerstone,

and the one who trusts in him

will never be put to shame.” a

7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe,

“The stone the builders rejected

has become the capstone, b ” c

8 and,

“A stone that causes men to stumble

and a rock that makes them fall.” d

Who is the stone over which to stumble?

1 Corinthians 10:4 The Rock was Christ

Who is the Rock?

Isaiah 8:13 Jehovah of armies—he is the One whom YOU should treat as holy, and he should be the object of YOUR fear, and he should be the One causing YOU to tremble.” 14 And he must become as a sacred place; but as a stone to strike against and as a rock over which to stumble to both the houses of Israel, as a trap and as a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Isaiah 44: 6 “This is what Jehovah has said, the King of Israel and the Repurchaser of him, Jehovah of armies, ‘I am the first and I am the last, and besides me there is no God. 7 And who is there like me? Let him call out, that he may tell it and present it to me. From when I appointed the people of long ago, both the things coming and the things that will enter in let them tell on their part. 8 Do not be in dread, YOU people, and do not become stupefied. Have I not from that time on caused you individually to hear and told [it] out? And YOU are my witnesses. Does there exist a God besides me? No, there is no Rock. I have recognized none.’”

Moreover, in the Trinity, Jesus is not Jehovah. (PSALM 110:1)

hmmmm.... it looks to me like Jesus is Jehovah.

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

ShadesofGrey

The reason JWs give for replacing 'Lord' with 'Jehovah' is because it's a quote from the OT (Joel 2:32 in this case) which has YHWH in it.

OK. Let's have a look at some more quotes from the OT.

Isaiah 45: 21 Is it not I, Jehovah, besides whom there is no other God; a righteous God and a Savior, there being none excepting me?

22 “Turn to me and be saved, all YOU [at the] ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no one else. 23 By my own self I have sworn—out of my own mouth in righteousness the word has gone forth, so that it will not return—that to me every knee will bend down, every tongue will swear,"

Philippians 2:10 so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord,"

Lord is translated from the word kupios

Revelation 1:8 “I am the Al´pha and the O·me´ga,” says Jehovah God, “the One who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty.”

Jehovah God is translated from the Greek kupios.

So in Philippians 2:10 why isn't the word kupios translated into Jehovah in Philippians 2:7? Isn't that what they did at Revelation 1:8? And does not the scripture directly line up with Jehovah in the OT at Isaiah 45:21?

Revelation 22:13 I am the Al´pha and the O·me´ga, the first and the last, the beginning and the end. 16 “‘I, Jesus, sent my angel to bear witness to YOU people of these things for the congregations."

And here the Alpha and the Omega is Jesus, so why does the NWT put the name Jehovah in Revelation 1:8?