MeanMrMustard

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Posts by MeanMrMustard

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  52

  Probability of Earth and life being how it is

  by ballistic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there are some things we don't know about existence and whether the earth is a simulation or even a creation.

  but we can do some statistical analysis on it.. the probability of a planet like earth existing in the goldilocks zone and having a moon that perfectly eclipses the sun is extremely low, but it's not impossible.

  the habitable zone (or goldilocks zone) around a star is the region where a planet could potentially support liquid water on its surface.

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  MeanMrMustard

  Guys we've been over this : there is no spoon.
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  65

  The unending and fruitless argument on Trinity

  by Longlivetherenegades in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  those who say they are christians or follow christianity needs .

  1. father .

  2. jesus .

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  MeanMrMustard

  Sorry for the late response here. I've been busy lately.

  In the interest of keeping things concise: you are saved. In the experience of being saved, somehow the intellectual exercise regarding the nature of God becomes really important. The other side of the argument also has experienced something. Now, whether or not those experiences are grounded in anything objective is a different topic. But both sides point the finger at the other and claim to invalidate the experience of the other because of the conclusions reached during the intellectual exercise regarding the nature of God.

  I think both sides are "open". But both sides just disagree. That disagreement is wrapped up in technical definitions, histories, language, etc. It's all intellectual.
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  25

  Judge Arrested for Immigration Related Criminality

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  breaking: fbi director kash patel has announced the arrest of milwaukee judge hannah dugan for obstructing ice during the arrest of an illegal alien.

  patel: "we believe judge dugan intentionally misdirected federal agents away from the subject to be arrested in her courthouse, eduardo flores ruiz, allowing the subject — an illegal alien — to evade arrest.".

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  MeanMrMustard

  I can feel safer now knowing that another min. wage worker is on his home. Now I finally get that fast food job that i have been dreaming about since childhood.

  When you turn off the right wing right wing algorithm, illegal immigrants are statistically more unlikely to commit crimes than native born Americans.

  BS

  I live in a town that received bus loads of "overflow migrants" from NYC after they declared a state of emergency. It's all fun and games being a "sanctuary city" until you actually have to take in "migrants". Then, sheer reality hits. NYC had to close city borders (oh the irony) and evict the oh-so-peaceful "migrants" into the rural countryside .

  As they were bussed into our town, they took up residence in all of the town's hotels. The hotel owners received enough money from somewhere (still not sure) so that they didn't complain too much. That would change as time went by. We watched as our local low-income citizens were evicted from one of the hotels, acting as a mid-term shelter. I still don't know where some of these families went.

  Soon after they emerged from their rooms - keeping in mind that they have nothing to do in this town. Local restaurants closed to the local population because they were being used to provide daily meals to the hotels, as the "migrants" just sat around on their phones (yes the migrants all seemed to have phones from somewhere).

  They didn't speak the language. They couldn't work. They didn't want to work. What they liked to do is "peacefully" assemble in groups of 20 and 30 and literally go house-to-house "asking" for furniture, bicycles, and appliances. Then, they would drag it all back to the hotel where it was all disassembled and used for parts (to God knows what). The empty husks of whatever they took apart was left in a huge trash pile in the hotel parking lot. A day didn't go by that the "peaceful" "migrants", evicted from a "sactuary" city, didn't have cops at the hotel. Cars were getting broken into at night, some stolen. People purchased cameras and guess who was found looting through the neighborhoods at night? That's right - all the white people. J/k - but if you had your way with this BS propoganda, I guess one might think that was "more likely".

  They were here for about 8 months total. I don't even want to go into the sheer havoc let loose on our school system while we attempted to give these poor "migrant" children some level of education. Two of the hotels were left is such poor condition that they were just demolished (empty lots now).

  In other words, you can say all the BS you want. But when people see and experience the reality of it, it doesn't mean a damn thing.
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  65

  The unending and fruitless argument on Trinity

  by Longlivetherenegades in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  those who say they are christians or follow christianity needs .

  1. father .

  2. jesus .

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  MeanMrMustard

  @aqwsed12345:

  My wife and I, in general, don't really like organized religion. So, we raised our kids outside of an environment with Biblical stories. They didn't get any of the standard cultural mythologies either - Santa, tooth fiery, easter, etc.They never got pulled into "church on Sunday" experience, and especially not the JW meetings. They have grown up, aware of religion, but never steeped in the details of theologies, never practicing how to belive things that, on their surface seem incredible.

  So, one day my daughter (10 years old) gets invited to a church "ballet dance fun fair". All free, of course, and so my wife and I, not being gullible, understood this was a recruiting tactic, and somewhat of a bait-and-switch. This is one of those Trinitarian Baptist churches that have a full gym adjoining the meeting hall. They do potlucks and other get-togethers there. Nevertheless, my daughter wanted to go because she loves dance, and wanted to be with friends. I went along to keep the wolves at bay. Sure enough, after all the "activities" (which all had side references to something religious), there was a kids "session" in the "sactuary" - fancy words for a sermon. The kids gathered, and it was very interactive with questions about Jesus and salvation and sacrifice. Most of the kids were into it, answering and accepting. My daughter, however, had the strangest look on her face. She was attempting to process, not only the details of the story, but the rationale behind the story. The need for forgiveness, and the necessity of human / God sacrifice in order to attain it. The look is basically a "wtf" face. What's this about a "ransom"? Jesus paid it, to whom? God? If God wished to forgive, why does that necessitate a sacrifice? Why not just forgive, like my parents do when I do something wrong? It was utter nonsense to her. Yet, the other children were not only OK with it, but acting quite matter-of-fact about it. Those kids seemed to be understanding something... or at least they thought they did. For them, the words they were using had a different meaning, even though these words my daughter had heard and defined before. There was a different meaning to them. It occured to me then that the amount of groundwork needed to even begin to accept and believe is emense.

  The idea, then, that someone would have to come from a ground zero to a full blown trinitarian just to be saved is ridiculous. Look at the other threads you are participating in - throwing around terms like "essence" and "being" vs "nature". Not to mention "hypostatic union".

  If a normal, average person, reads the Bible, that person may, in all sincerity believe in a unitarian God. Or perhaps a modal view. As they read, and believe, and have hope, they understand that this is the way God has revealed Himself through scripture - just as you do. And yet to be saved, really saved, as an objective standard, one must come to believe concepts that may require them to study for years. Perhaps even learn a little bit of dead languages. How many common meek men have been excluded from salvation because it requires, not only faith, but a theological degree as well? Is a man with an IQ of 75 savable?

  I don't fault you too much. The unitarian belivers say the same thing of you, just with different details.

  Now I somewhat sensed that you heading toward the idea that true salvation would mean connection and communion with God - and that would inform the true believer. Although I don't think you stated that explicitly. This is what you were implying when you referred to being "infused by grace". Knowing the truth... the real truth is a gift from God, when He acts to save. If that's the case, that just proves my point even further.
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  65

  The unending and fruitless argument on Trinity

  by Longlivetherenegades in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  those who say they are christians or follow christianity needs .

  1. father .

  2. jesus .

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  MeanMrMustard

  @aqwsed12345:

  You said:

  Let’s begin with the principle: Veritas fidei est de necessariis ad salutem — “The truth of faith is necessary for salvation.” Now, not every truth must be explicitly believed by every individual in order to be saved (e.g., the identity of Melchizedek), but some truths are essential because they touch the very nature of the one in whom we believe — namely, God Himself.

  That's a long, fancy, round-about way of saying that belief in the Trinity is essential. Why? Because it touches on "the very nature" of God. This just proves my point. You elevate this issue, without cause, to the most essential level for salvation. There is no direct command to do this, so you sneak it in there through faith. Your first statement / principle is that your faith better be built on truth (a sentiment that both sides of the debate share), but you use it to sneak in the idea that nobody can sincerely believe and have faith unless they interpret the ambigiousness of the scriptures the same way you do. That's not the purpose of that principle.

  More proof? Ok. Next paragraph... queue the word salad.

  Faith, is not mere trust or sincerity. It is a supernatural habit infused by grace,....

  Faith is a "habit"? Word salad. Habit as in works? A "habit" that is "infused" by "grace". Again, all buzzword terms that mean something different to everyone. Terrible, if you want to clarity. Wonderful if you discussions to be "unending" and "fruitless".

  ...by which we assent to divinely revealed truths because God, ...

  So ... performing the "infused habit" causes an "assent" into "divinely revealed truths"... more word salad.

  ...who is Truth itself, has revealed them. Therefore, the object of saving faith is not merely the idea of “God in general,” nor even “Jesus as Savior” in an undefined sense — but the real God as He has revealed Himself to us. The more essential the truth is to God's identity, the more closely it pertains to the virtue of faith.

  I always figured the object of "saving faith" (as opposed to faith that is unsaving) is to bring about ... the salvation of people.

  But here you weave it back into the way "God has revealed Himself" and therefore back into proving my point. Yay.

  This is why the Trinity matters. God has revealed Himself not merely as a solitary monad, nor merely as acting through Jesus, but as one God in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

  And the other side is saying the exact opposite, with all sincerity. All because the words you use, and the terms they have known, mean different things to different people. Also, people have good reasons, sincere, reasons to think their definitions of things like "life", "death", "nature", "essence", "person", etc. are the right ones.
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  65

  The unending and fruitless argument on Trinity

  by Longlivetherenegades in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  those who say they are christians or follow christianity needs .

  1. father .

  2. jesus .

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  MeanMrMustard

  @Halcon:

  Not that it's wrong to try... but yeah.

  But this argument persists because it's somehow viewed as a fundamental condition (either to believe or not, depending on the group) of Christianity.

  In other words, this argument is "unending" and "fruitless" because, win or lose, there's no fruit to be claimed at victory.

  Also, nobody defines terms. I'm not talking about defining the Trinity itself. Rather, define "person", "essence", "death", what it means to be "fully" anything, what it means to be "the son of" anything, etc.

  Those terms should be talked about first. Both sides quote the same scripture at each other, using these terms, and then mic dropping each time. The other side reads the arguments in the context of their definitions, and simply concludes they the people making the arguments are stupid.

  On and on and on..... weeeeeeeeeee
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  11

  First Time Ever..

  by blondie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i received a phone call from a jw inviting me to the "special talk.

  " in 25 years out, never happened, don't know them, phone # nowhere near me and it was like she was reading from a script.

  i hung up... any one else?.

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  MeanMrMustard

  I get a lot of Medicare scams. I usually answer and see how far I can get. I have a fake name, birthdate, Medicare card number (dead give away when they ask for this - or the heavy Indian accent). I've had a few cable service scams, and those guys are a bit more entertaining when you play with them (give them fake confirm numbers, etc).
  
  But, I'm looking for new caller types... If JWs are cold calling, it's not a scam in the same way as Medicare or cable, but there has to be a way to play around with them a bit... I feel like if they are calling my phone, it's fair game.
  
  You could always scare them by saying they are violating federal law by calling a number on the do-not-call list, and then state you have their number and will be informing the authorities... see what that does.
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  24

  I was going to write a new topic ... but now I just can't be bothered

  by no-zombie in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was going to write a new topic but now i just can't be bothered ... and i'll tell you why.. on my facebook feed a few days ago, i saw an interview of a couple of onlyfans girls, who said that they were active christians that attended church weekly.

  and while i was going to spend some time writing about the virtues of our faith's strict moral standards ... i now understand that i'd only be flamed as a watchtower apologist.. that being said, out of the approximately 4 million onlyfan girls out there ... it obvious, that none are jehovah's witnesses..

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  MeanMrMustard

  Sorry to tell you this, but I know several Jehovah's Witnesses girls under the age of 25 who are OnlyFans girls.

  And the rest of them are on OnlyFeet.
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  13

  Is jehovahs-witness.com legitimately and reliably independent of WTB&TS and peripheral, aligned entities?

  by great-trivialization in

  1. forum
  2. links

  i am new to this forum and uncertain that this is legitimately and entirely independent of conniving jw controllers or the wtb&ts and its related entities.

  markers like the use of jw.org in the forum description and the policies seem controlled/controlling vs other xjw forums.

  this is not an accusation, it is an attempt to know enough to be comfortable with motives of the ownership and controllers of the forum.

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  MeanMrMustard

  @great-trivalization:

  If you are concerned, then do not post or give (even through private chat) any PII (personally identifyable info).

  Just keep your anon username, and interact through it alone.
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  21

  What's with the attack (counsel) on husbands with no corresponding article for wives?

  by Rattigan350 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  what's with the attack (counsel) on husbands with no corresponding article for wives on the jan 2025 w that is being studied today?.

  is there a point to that?.

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  MeanMrMustard

  The elders will get their instruction when they review the Shephard the Flock book, as a group. The margins are wide, and they can be told what to cite and how to interpret all the "guidance". It won't show up in any official literature - only the hand written notes of each elders individual copy, given verbally.