Posts by bluecanary

we are absolutely both on the same page.. it is interesting [and on another level disturbing] that 'status' plays so heavily in the minds of jw's and their relationships.

as many others have related, my wife sometimes is engaged in conversations with jw's she meets in public, while all those same jw's will totally 'shun' me - sometimes in the same moment.

bluecanary

Is it me, or does this seem to be happening a lot lately? I wonder if they're having a big push for the members to really get rid of any "bad" influences.

OTOH, I'm new at this, so this sort of thing might just go on all the time.

39

You Have No Witness "Friends"

by metatron in

jw
friends

i apologize for this point, as if beating it to death, but folks, you don't have any witness friends!

there is no such thing.. does that sound extreme?

too radical?

bluecanary

Conditional love is not.

I strongly disagree. Have you ever seen a woman whose been badly beaten by her husband, defend him? Were you impressed by her uncondintional love or did you think she was mentally lacking?

I do not have children yet, so I cannot speak about parental love, which may be an exception. Other kinds of love are always conditional. The conditions differ from person to person. If your best friend joined the KKK and started lynching jews or blacks and telling you he hated your guts would you still love him? You qualify your love by placing conditions on it. You love the person you knew him to be in the past. You love the person you wish he would become. You may try to believe that a physical or mental problem is causing him to act in a way that he does not truly intend, another qualification. But you do not love the person who is acting in an evil way.

We all have conditions. You may think that someone else's conditions are lame or wrong, but then you're free to not associate with those people. You can choose to associate only with people who honor the same conditions that you do,.

44

Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue?

by frankiespeakin in

jesus god or not?

is this a salvation issue?.

what is all this commotion about?

bluecanary

DeputyDog said: I think you need to ask, how does "a sincere Christian" get into the wrong group?

By being confused or deceived. I was a sincere Christian as a JW in the sense that I fully believed I was following Christ the way he wanted. Obviously I was wrong. But I believed wholeheartedly that I was right. The moment I stopped believing it was right, I left. But it took 20 years for that to happen.

Joseph, thank you for your response. Mistakes made by the early Christians were indeed corrected, although not always immediately or all at once. And I think it evident that Jesus would not overlook the false beliefs of any who are aware they are false and purposefully teaching others falsehood.

What I am wondering about is individuals, rather than entire groups. If an individual is associated with a group that teaches falsehood, but have been fooled into believing it is truth, and does not become aware of that deception before they die, does God hold that against them in judgment? This question is relevant, not just for Christians, but for people in other faiths who have been taught that their particular god or prophet is the true one.

Stephen said: So what is your interest with the Unitarians? What do you see Jesus as?

My only impressions of Jesus, as yet, have come from reading the new world translation. I have a lengthy reading list with many topics; it is my intention to read some books about the historicity of Jesus and, as usual, I would like to consider different conclusions on the matter.

My feeling right now is that Jesus was very similar to Siddhartha Gotama (the original Buddha). He was a man with no claim to divinity, who tried to influence people to develop compassion-based wisdom in order to lead more fulfilling lives. I think the trappings of organization and religious doctrine group up around him without his intent.

39

You Have No Witness "Friends"

by metatron in

jw
friends

i apologize for this point, as if beating it to death, but folks, you don't have any witness friends!

there is no such thing.. does that sound extreme?

too radical?

bluecanary

Because JWs often prey on the uneducated and and "less intelligent" (sorry for the truth here) they don't have the capacity to truly "think" for themselves.

I feel like I have to correct this every time I see it. Jehovah's Witnesses are no less intelligent than anyone else. They are victims of mind control. Do some research on the methods cults use to indoctrinate people. Smart people fall for them all the time. They do not think for themselves, not because they lack the capacity, but becuase they have been trained not to.

I don't understand why people who have been part of the b0rg seem so surprised about lack of sustained friendships upon leaving. I thought the witnesses were very up front about this. They are friends only with other witnesses. It's in the charter. It's only surprising when a witness does maintain a friendship with someone who fades (my brother has a few good jw friends like this).

8

drama dc 2009

by inbetween in

jw
friends

the drama was really ridicolous, man, but i noticed, in some of the jw objected to it as well,.

first of all my wife, she said it doesnt feel right, and she strongly disliked the music (she has no idea of my being at this forum btw).

then some friends, who also complained about it, but just to us, because they know, we do not judge them for their questions and almost doubts on some things.... i m sure there were more, but they just dont think out loud, and keep it to themselves.... anybody similar experiences ?.

bluecanary

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6VbE7j2y24

9

was just contacted by a newly df'd person from our old hall

by troubled mind in

jw
friends

recently a young man from our former hall was d'fd .

i have known him for most of his life and sent him a word of encouragement when i heard of the announcement .

last night he text and asked if he could stop by our home .

bluecanary

Doesn't this show how ineffective shunning is? When disfellowshipped people can't speak to anyone in the congregation, they will turn to worldly people or other disfellowshipped ones. If someone is hanging around other "bad" association, how are they ever supposed to be "good" again? They honestly expect people to have no personal relationships with anyone for 6-12 months? If a "strong" witness couldn't handle that, why expect a weak one to?

It's so obvious that this has nothing to do with what is good for the individual.

44

Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue?

by frankiespeakin in

jesus god or not?

is this a salvation issue?.

what is all this commotion about?

bluecanary

Stephen, I agree about the Witnesses. We were told that Jesus was supposed to be our friend, but I never understood this. I can like and respect someone that I never talk to, but I can't be friends with them.

But that wasn't what I meant by my question. I was speaking of a trinitarian Christian vs. a unitarian Christian. Does one of them not have a real relationship with Christ? If they've come to different conclusions from reading the Scriptures, does that mean that only one group is being spoken to through holy spirit? Is a sincere Christian from the incorrect group doing something wrong? Will Jesus/God overlook their error?

44

Is the NWT the best...

by Narkissos in

wt publication ever?.

or the worst?.

: in nwt i include the "study editions" with cross-references and footnotes, and the kit..

bluecanary

Stephen, I love your jehovah wagon metaphor.