thanks for your letter and the thoughts contained.
others had commented on the latest shift of the interpretation of this generation.
as you recognize this allows for an unending extension of time and likely stems from an awareness of the approach of the year 2014 marking 100 years since the date of 1914.. .
Hi Gayle
I agree with your comments. I am in no position to judge Ray or anyone else for that matter. It was the gushing tone of some of the comments that caught my attention that is all. I certainly respect the fact that Ray has spent so much energy and time making the secret workings known.
thanks for your letter and the thoughts contained.
others had commented on the latest shift of the interpretation of this generation.
as you recognize this allows for an unending extension of time and likely stems from an awareness of the approach of the year 2014 marking 100 years since the date of 1914.. .
I was tempted not to make the following comment however I seem to be reading a lot about how great Ray is (I don't know the guy so I don't mean this comment to sound personal): Whilst I am sympathetic to Ray and found Crisis of Conscience very interesting, it took him a long time to raise serious objections as far as I can see and his major objections became public after he has been disfellowshipped. Whilst I would not seek to undermine Ray's work which has doubtless helped very many, it ought perhaps to be weighed against the years he spent at the highest levels within the WTS supporting and directing an organisation which has caused many to suffer. The most we can do in situations like this is to work to correct the harm we have caused or been a party to however some of the gushing comments I see seem, under the circumstances, over to the top to me.
It is good to see so many leaving the organisation from positions of seniority. It is great that they are prepared to speak so clearly and honestly however surely they also have a greater degree of culpability in the harm caused?
i have a family jw friend spending two nights a week at my place, because of school... last night we had a discussion regarding my fading and i should come back, talk.
we covered many topics.
but i need to get him on that the holy spirit is not only in the jw just because they preach allot.. can anyone help.
Have you considered an exorcist?
thursday, feb 11 2010 daily mail uk.
the knock at the door that turned my parents into brainwashed fanatics - and nearly cost my life.
read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1250078/the-knock-door-turned-parents-brainwashed-fanatics--nearly-cost-life.html#ixzz0feux4vdf.
It wasn't nicknamed the Daily Heil for nothing.
i'm writiing a thesis on jws and am wondering if people with any connection with jws - underground jws, former jws / 'apostates', inactive jws etc would be willing to give me some feedback on these questions.
no need for any personal details, but if you want to add some information about your experiences with jws that would be appreciated.
if am interested in your answers to these questions:.
Aren't most people on here ex-JW (at least in terms of their beliefs even if they still practise it)?
christianity looniness:.
does god have a son who is god himself separate and the same?.
how many angels can have a party on the head of a pin?.
I suspect most Christian have no idea how the Trinity is supposed to work and simply accept it on the basis of faith.
i enjoyed reading these points.
in the second list of "real reasons", it was points #2 and #3 that first struck me, after leaving the jws.. .
why do people abandon the christian faith?.
More like a Spiritual Young Offender Detention Centre.
christianity looniness:.
does god have a son who is god himself separate and the same?.
how many angels can have a party on the head of a pin?.
I think we will have to agree to differ on that. I don't think it is fair to ascribe one motivation to such large and diverse groups of people.
christianity looniness:.
does god have a son who is god himself separate and the same?.
how many angels can have a party on the head of a pin?.
In answer to your original question:4 and He is like a shamrock: small green and split 3 ways.
I think it is a bit unfair to accuse those having the Trinity-v-Notrinity debate as being small-minded. It seems to me they are trying to explain why they believe what they believe. I suspect though that had the doctrine of the Trinity not been defined by some committee of Christians under the direction of the Roman Emperor 300 years after the main event was supposed to have happened, then nobody would have dreamt it up.
It is actually reminiscent of much earlier ideas when gods often appeared to hang around in 3s (Set Isis and Osiris as one example). I know Trinitarians will say it isn't the same thing at all and they are entitled to their opinion however for some of us with no axe to grind it it looks like another attempt to include concepts from pre-Christian non-hebrew religions to make the state religion more palatable.
i enjoyed reading these points.
in the second list of "real reasons", it was points #2 and #3 that first struck me, after leaving the jws.. .
why do people abandon the christian faith?.
In some ways, the WTS did me a big favour. Before I became a JW back in 1982, my upbringing was pretty a-religious. My folks were non-practising Catholics and I became more committed to Catholicism when I went to University in 1981. I didn't really think much about the issues and it didn't have much impact on my daily life. Becoming a JW meant I had to evaluate my religious beliefs and because I hadn't done much research, didn't know how to and wasn't very switched on, it wasn't difficult to turn me away. It was however extremely damaging to my education, family life; friends and career. The WTS did a pretty good job of trashing other organised religions so when I finally got booted out in 1986/87 I think..I was a whole lot better informed and in some ways innoculated against organised religion. I knew what to ask and where to look.
I think it must be very difficult for those brought up as witnesses and programmed from birth to turn away.Thankfully many do although I sometimes wonder how many stay and suffer in silence or blank out their doubts. Maintaining two frameworks could be very damaging psychologically I would think
Following my velocitous extramuralisation (for Blackadder fans) the process of evaulating the WTS began (because at that time I thought it was "The Truth") and I have to say I learned a great deal over many years, not just about the WTS but about other belief systems.
I suspect the reasons people leave the faith of their youth are the same for many organised religions. Most look pretty similar to me. They are simply not relevant to the followers who leave them or there is some other kind of disconnect which occurs in the persons life; a bereavement; poor treatment; a lingering doubt that grows; questions that cannot be answered; a decay of certainty etc. Either the adherent never believed in the first place or there is insufficient foundation inherent in the belief system to resist critical examination and a need to rely on "faith" when the answers run out.
