Posts by Focus

45

God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy

by Focus in

jw
friends

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

" - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ?

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

Focus

IslandWoman scribbled:

The Watchtower always uses its older literature surely you must know this. The congregations are regularly instucted to purge themselves of the old literature by placing it in the field.

I will briefly deal with the appropriateness of your analogy between using up paper copies of old literature and continuing to place, without disclaimer and with a highly-misleading date, old material on the website, later on in this refutation.

First, some history lessons for other readers.

(1) Sure, the WTBTS hates losing profit. Selling books or using pamphlets, even if they contain "Old Light" for which the R&F could be DF'd for promulgation, until stocks run out is a Watchtower speciality. For example, in "God's Kingdom of a Thousand Years Has Approached" (1969), the Watchtower, distancing itself from its sixty years of hinting or claiming that Charles Russell was the FDS, claimed on pages 347/356:
"Creature worship .. This view was prominently featured in the book published in July of 1917 by the People's Pulpit Association of Brooklyn, New York. This book was called 'The Finished Mystery' and furnished a commentary of the Bible books of Revelation and Ezekiel and The Songs of Solomon. On its Publishers page the book was called the 'Posthumous Works of Pastor Russell.' Such a book and religious attitude tended to establish a religious sect centered around a man .. in the year 1927 any remaining stocks of the six volumes of Studies in the Scriptures by Russell and of 'The Finished Mystery' were disposed of among the public. It was the published and accepted thought down till 1927 that he was 'that servant' of Matthew 24:45"
But this claim is fraudulent. The Watch Tower and Herald of Christ's Presence of March 15, 1928 - after 1927 - on page 126 specifically instructed brothers to distribute these books to the public (though they had been already classified as "old light".
And The Watch Tower and Herald of Christ's Presence of November 1, 1929 - after 1927 - on page 322 stated:
""The Society has decided to designate the week beginning November 10 as a special drive week for the sale of Studies in the Scriptures"
And in the December 1, 1932 - after 1927 - copy of the Bulletin appeared:
"1,646,316 bound books .. placed in the hands of the public .. during 1931 over 100,000 Studies in the Scriptures were included in the total"
And in the Watchtower Cost List, Volumes III, IV and VI of "Studies in the Scriptures" continued to be listed into the 1960s - after 1927.
Indeed, SiS Volume IV ("Battle of Armageddon"; till 1910, "The Day of Vengeance") showed up in "Kingdom Ministry" (as it was then called) until 1966 - after 1927 - after which it appeared as "out of stock"
So for many decades after reversing/dropping its teachings (SiS IV contains hundreds of teachings abandoned by the WTS prior to the 1960s), the Watchtower continued to distribute "Old Light" and get more money in. One thing having books available in the libraries - another distributing them to publishers and public alike, all without attached disclaimers! What utter recklessness on the part of the self-claimed "discreet" slave!
Or simply yet more evidence that "THEY" KNEW it was all BALONEY at the time they were spewing it forth.
Either way, they are not at all what they claim to be. Mutton-headed Morons or Thieves, Cheats and Liars.
Also the "People's Pulpit Association" mentioned (probably in order to suggest the work was not quite exactly a work of the WTBTS) is none other than the WTBTS itself - as admitted somewhere else "Such a corporation came into legal existence February 23, 1909, and was named People's Pulpit Association. Thirty years later, in 1939, the name was changed to its present one, Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, Inc." ("Qualified to be Ministers" (1967), page 309).
So getting the dollars in counts, not getting the (present) truth out!

(2) Sure, the WTBTS hates having to bother changing text. For example:
"The Scriptural proof is that the period of his presence and the day of God's preparation is a period from 1874 A.D. forward. The second coming of the Lord, therefore, began in 1874; and that date and the years 1914 and 1918 are specially marked dates with reference to his coming." This material is found on page 289 in the 1927 edition and page 310 of the 1939 edition of the book "Creation". But the dogma that the second coming/presence was in 1874 (held for 55 years by the Society) was abandoned immediately after the 1929 edition of "Prophecy" (page 65-6 contains its last restatement in a new work) - for example, Light I (1930) and Vindication I (1931) had commenced the weasel-wording to pretend the WTBTS had really been talking about 1914 (rather than 1874). So why, a whole decade after the old teaching became in nature "apostatical", reprint a book without excising the "Old Light" inside it?

So, IslandWoman, as you are well aware, the Watchtower has a long history of such absurdity and/or greed. Thanks for providing me an opportunity to remind others of this.

The fact that they did not change some "old light" in the brochure does not indicate some sinister plot to fool people.. Imo, you exaggerated this thing to the point where it was misleading to many here.. Focus importunes in his post that this "article" may be something more than what it really is. In reality it is just a reprint of an old brochure. He insinuates that this "article" may signal a going back and forth in the understanding of the "generation" teaching. I dislike disinformation.. If Focus had only posted that the Watchtower stupidly has on its site an old publication that still has the old 1914 generation teaching, I would have agreed. What I disagreed with is the attempt to say that this whole thing is somehow a Watchtower plot.. sloppy and unprofessional work .. but not imo more than that, which I feel Focus was implying.. I just don't think there is enough evidence in this instance to call this some attempt at a slight of hand or a sinister plot on the part of the Watchtower.

But WHERE PRECISELY did I state or imply it was a "sinister plot" or "slight of hand" (sic - you mean "sleight"), you PRIZE DOOFUS IslandWoman? Can't you read? Or did something change before your eyes, you villain?

The title of the thread is: "God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy", right? Not WT "weaseling", right? Doh! Or has the flickering light of your Spiritual Mommy made you so dizzy you see Focus doing the same?

In the very first post of the thread, I wrote: "So then why, six years later, was the Watchtower still teaching 'some people who were alive in 1914 will still be alive when this system comes to its end.' - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ? What confusion!". What part of the word "confusion" do you not understand? Doh!! Does "confusion" mean "plot" on your island, woman?

Check on the meaning of "reprint" while you are about it. The article and brochure is a NEW, REARRANGED 2001 EDITION, as the (c) notice says. No "1993" attribution thereon. And again the strict 1914 dogma.

YOU HAVE FALSELY ACCUSED YOUR BROTHER, AND SMEARED HIM AND HIS ASS, YOU SHAMEFUL LITTLE TROLL! WHERE IS YOUR APOLOGY?

If I wish to insinuate and imply things, I'd do it in a manner that even put those wicked monsters in the Writing Department to shame. But it lies beneath my dignity to so do, ten minute flashbacks excepted.

I don't care whose name is attached to a post,

(continuing) but if it is from IslandWoman, it probably contains all variety of nonsense, WT-apologia, idiocy, false attribution, misquoting, misrepresentation, sundry stupidity, illustrations of the author's poor reading comprehension and so on.

The Watchtower taught us well!!

Yes, and you continue to do its bidding. Do not think encomiums from AlanF, whom I view as at times bordering on WTS-apologia himself, cuts the mustard with me, IW.

I find myself in this peculiar place of seemingly defending the Watchtower

You should be quite at home in that place, then, for I catch you there all the time, IW.

but what I am really trying to do is speak for "common sense."

Acquire it first, methinks.

AlanF wrote:

Sure, I agree that there is no major, nefarious plot hatched by the GB to deceive people in the case Focus is talking about here.

Yep.

For the record, I never said there was neither. I don't make accusations I can't prove, at least on the balance of probabilities.

For any with poor reading comprehension, and before IW attempts to make some defense for her misconduct based thereon, my words in the first post in the thread "And check: http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm for yourself, before there is yet another deceitful change." do not imply that any changes so far that are specifically there (or thereabouts) were deceitful. But there is a proven record of the WTS deceitfully changing things ELSEWHERE and not admitting it has done so (remember the completion of the work in the twentieth century that did not seem to make it into the bound volume?). So it is prudent to check something that too is bound to be changed, before it is transformed or deleted. Sure, I want to highlight this web material so, when the WTS change it (as they must, as I have said earlier in the thread), we can all see whether they openly admit they have made a(nother) mistake - or just slip the change in quietly, which would then constitute "yet another deceitful change". Understood?

Any bets as to which happens?

As I said, check the URL and keep checking, before there is yet another deceitful change by the Watchtower.

//snip AF's correct reasoning// Thus I can only conclude that they left it in deliberately.

As I concluded too, on the balance of likelihood.
So back now to the dribblings of the Daughter-Harlot Class.

Re WT-apologist status of IslandWoman

there is really no way for you to know for sure is there? (Sorry, just thought I'd throw that in to fuel Focus' paranoia.)

When you misleadingly present arguments or material in support of the WTS dozens of times, there is no paranoia in branding you for what you are, IW. You are an apologist for the Great Whore. If you do not realize it, that is your further folly.

You IslandWoman attempt to derail (rather than refocus) many a thread that tears the WTS apart for its stupidity and/or deceit and/or hypocrisy, by bringing in strawmen and contrived asides. I predicted I would find you infesting "my" one. And here you are, trying to make out I was stating or implying there was a "sinister plot" etc., when I have not. Of course, better to attack the strawman...

I object! Simon does this count as a personal attack?!

I guess this post does too, then, you Monstrous Misrepresenter of my words!
Is it deceit or merely stupidity, IW, or something else altogether? If your agenda is improving my focus, which help would be commendable and gratefully and most humbly accepted, the responses you have had do not indicate that any consider that you have the competence or wherewithal to so do. If your agenda is defending the WTS against just attack, why would you create a strawman?

Perhaps you know that the colorful but correct attacks that I launch on the Old Whore are effective, and hence focus your attention on to derailing them. This will inspire me to provide more of the same.

//no sinister plot// My one and only point in this thread! Thank you!

If that was your "one and only point", and since I never stated or implied it was a sinister plot, what are you doing here at all? Please turn to Deut. 28:20 and oblige. The donkey has already correctly reproved ye, IW of the Eph. 5:11 Class - as at 2 Pet. 2:16 you were "rebuked for [your] iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet."

it was called cleaning out the old literature.

A website may be changed "for free" - no wastage of paper involved in "discarding" old stuff. Your quasi-apologetic analogy, IW, is ludicrous! Sure, if the result of a mindset, it but illustrates the SHEER IDIOCY of the said mindset.

Do you think the GB and the others at Bethel are being accurately portrayed on this site?

If they are been protrayed as the Gibbering Baboon Class, then yes. If some of their number - and most of their entourage - are portrayed as a filthy collection of SPIRITUAL PIMPS, then yes. Next question?

I fully realize men know men

But "it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret"?

I do recognize that ..AF.. may know how to deal with the Watchtower men better than I do.

When dealing with the SWINE Class (see "The Finished Mystery" for the definition), the LASH works best. LEGAL ACTION, and WIDESPREAD PUBLICITY EXPOSING THE FILTHY MISDEEDS PERPETRATED BY THEM AND THEIR "SPIRITUAL" AND LEGAL PREDECESSORS.

No Woman Is An Island, So: WHACK! for misrepresenting my "clear as crystal" words! We should afford you the "benefit of the doubt" just as much as we afford the Watchtower the same. Wake up, IW, and take due note of the lovingly-proffered olive branch in this my post.

--
Focus
(Eph. 4:27 and the Writing Staff Class)

Edited by - Focus on 28 December 2002 5:20:48

67

History doomed to repeat itself...

by Reborn2002 in

jw
friends

another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.

is this not "terror" in itself?

at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?

Focus

NeonMadman wrote:

I'm not going to continue the discussion any further.

But, you just did!

Clearly

LOL!

he is just going to become more angry

I promise you, with my hand duly placed on the ass, that nothing that you have written has angered me, and that I have never responded when angry or in anger. Anger clouds judgment and seldom assists in the search for truth.

{Snipped Neon's anger, suggesting as it did that I am suffering from cognitive dissonance just like a JW in denial: all this at my exposure of his egregious errors of fact and logic}

Focus is a master of propaganda

That may, or may not, be true.
If true, this gift was not being demonstrated here.

he ignores substantive arguments that refute his position

The "substantive argument" being that it is OK, even desirable, to seriously and unjustly "piss off" (Six's words) hordes of people, make friends or neutrals into bitter enemies, but thereby miraculously reduce the risk of inciting more people into terrorist acts of hatred or perceived revenge...

Such arguments require no rebuttal. They self-rebut.

he quotes out of context, he deceptively imputes to his opponent ideas and attitudes that have not been expressed

How could I? Your words are right there, next to mine, for anyone interested to check.

I'm no spring chicken. Contrary to your assertion that I'm "too young to remember Kent State," I was old enough at the time it happened to be enrolled at Kent State, had that been my chosen course.

Well, bully for you! Actually, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, being willing to attribute your demonstrated ignorance and excessive and dangerous jingoism to the follies of youth. Alas, responsibility for these sins must be laid instead at the door of the follies of age.

I concede that you have done a good job of presenting the "argument" for the other side. Alas, there is no possible good argument there. Acting with circumspection is called for.

The U.S. can stand for so many fine and wonderful things. Its present residents in large number have done much, accomplished great things, shown mercy and compassion, individually demonstrated great charity to neighbors and to foreigners. Inflammatory words and precipitate action, either manifestly unjust or seen to be unjust by those who believe they are targeted, serves to erase the good parts of U.S. heritage and culture and aids, makes the country the butt of ridicule and contempt abroad, and assists enemy terrorist recruiters.

Neon, why don't you listen to the donkey!

btw: the one who kicked Old Farmer Green on Thanksgiving - right in his particules - was a donkey - detain all donkeys.

--
Focus
(Undetained feline Class)

45

God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy

by Focus in

jw
friends

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

" - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ?

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

Focus

Siddhashunyata:

Perhaps I am wrong here

No, no - you are not at all wrong, Siddhashunyata! You have grasped exactly what IslandWoman, a notorious apologist troll (whose congregational experience somehow contradicts that of virtually every other jW/ex-jW poster on the DB) for the disgusting Watchtower abomination, with typical "thoroughness" and/or "HONESTY" and/or "intelligence" conveniently "missed". The Watchtower substantially reformatted the article, popped a "2001" date on it and have it on their website - free of any disclaimers that there had been New Light on the matter. 2001 is - as I said - SIX years after the official dropping of the policy in the Watchtower magazine.

So, why does the filthy whore do this?

Easy. To ensnare more recruits to their hideous cult of shunning and mind control! They are aware that they MAXIMIZE THE BAPTISM RATE IF ARMAGEDDON IS PRESENTED AS "ABSOLUTELY IMMINENT". Just look at the recruitment statistics for the years prior to 1975, once the 1975 teaching was first made seven years earlier!

And saying that Armageddon must come before the "generation of 1914" dies away, and even taking the most beneficial non-ludicrous definition thereof, places a latest possible date for Armageddon at about 2030 ("according to Jesus" and current records for longevity) and probably much earlier.

Why "probably much earlier"? You see, no one but the father knows the exact time, right (Mark 13:32 et seq.)? And if it had not come by, say 2029, then one would know it was to be in 2030, which would contradict the scripture as it would, by elimination, have permitted pinpointing. (The Watchtower will fall over itself to repudiate its earlier and utterly idiotic teaching that that scripture should be interpreted as meaning a specific day or time, rather than a longer period of time - context clearly shows that the Bible was referring to being unable to predict such a time at all accurately). Think about it. Do not underestimate Watchtower cunning and deceit.

But they learned from 1975 that they have also to be more circumspect (not that they lost anything like as many as they gained - they did not: people hate admitting they were conned, and will con themselves into believing they were not). So by this cheating (having the old magazine say one thing and the current website say another - with the website what many will encounter first) they can better promulgate their finely-tuned Perpetual Har-Magedon-Round-the-Cornerism doctrine (as I explained it to AlanF).

Of course the Watchtower needs to send out Unclean Creatures into the world to "explain" away, when caught in their deception, the very apparent contradiction between what they say out each side of their shameful mouth. Which question of such creatures, whose line here must be "We are changing and improving and refining our teaching! We make small errors! We never said we did not! Do not expect Rome to be built in a day! Still does not mean we do not have 'the truth!'", naturally brings me to the matter of what that IslandWoman wrote:

They simply reprinted the brochure there

No, the Watchtower did not. They reformatted it substantially. How can that be a "reprint"? Are you blind? Did you not see my last post above, which listed a handful of the many formatting changes on this page alone, giving some pictures too?

If they did this, it is clearly not being presented for historical reasons. So why is this "false" teaching there, eh? Without any disclaimer? Eh?

What matter that hopes of hundreds of thousands, millions perhaps, are so toyed with? EHH?

By supporting and apologizing for the liar, fraud and proven false prophet, knowing its falsity, you become part of it. And at 1 John 4:1-3 the Bible says: 'Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.' And so you are identified, IslandWoman!

WHACK!!

--
Focus
(Anti-Unclean Spirits Class)

45

God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy

by Focus in

jw
friends

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

" - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ?

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

Focus

donkey:

For skeptics:

Check the picture on the left of the page http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/index.htm?article=article_07.htm bearing the caption "God's perfect heavenly Kingdom will be mankind's only rulership in the new world". It is at /images/pr/kingdom.jpg

But in the original at http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm , it was at /images/pr/00003232.jpg (still there), but was NOT presented in a blue box and was on the right of the page.

And also see the monochrome picture at /images/pr/preaching.jpg that appears on the right of the current page:

But in the original article, the picture was on the left and was located at /images/pr/00003235.jpg . Still there too - and see, it is a bit different:

And the picture:

in the original (and still at /images/pr/toc.gif) is missing in the moved version of the page.

There are other trivial differences too.

So why take the pains to make changes and not take the opportunity to edit out the offending text re the strict rendition of the "generation of 1914" doctrine?

Sure, there is conflict and confusion within the Gawd-directed Borg. But the optimal time for the switch is not yet at hand.

--
Focus
(Progressive Revelation Class)

Edited by - Focus on 26 December 2002 17:14:31

45

God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy

by Focus in

jw
friends

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

" - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ?

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

Focus

donkey:

Sure! Read:

Edited by - Focus on 26 December 2002 15:59:30
donkey .. Dec 26, 2002 15:59

Please recognize "prophecy"; some may know what is coming next. Seriously, though, the material/links concerned are in flux; keep monitoring over the next few months.

Elsewhere:

Have they returned to the more strict 1914 generation doctrine?

The article redirected to is substantially reformatted, but still contains the key text. But at times that page has vanished, and a second redirection link has appeared. Times they are a'changing.

Not that I will be disappointed if the "God's only visible Organization" changes its mind and hangs on to the "before all the 1914-ers die" nonsense online for a while longer. It will discredit the WTS all the more in the long run.

--
Focus
(Ten Minutes Class)

45

God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized: WT idiocy

by Focus in

jw
friends

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

" - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ?

http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm.

Focus

The Watchtower website for many years contained the following article:

"God's Purpose Soon to Be Realized
Although God has permitted imperfection and suffering for a long time from the human viewpoint .. The Bible tells us that God has a specific time period for allowing these things to happen.. God will accomplish this cleansing of the earth .. Humans will never again have the option of trying to rule .. How Close Are We? How close are we to the end of this unsatisfactory system of things and the beginning of God's new world? Bible prophecy clearly gives us the answer.. Have those things that Jesus and Paul foretold taken place in our time? Yes, they certainly have.. Truly, we have been in the last days since 1914 and are nearing the culmination of Bible prophecies involving our time. How long a time period would these last days prove to be? Jesus said regarding the era that would experience the "beginning of pangs of distress" from 1914 onward: "This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur." (Matthew 24:8, 34-36) Thus, all the features of the last days must take place within the lifetime of one generation, the generation of 1914. So some people who were alive in 1914 will still be alive when this system comes to its end. That generation of people is now very advanced in years, indicating that there is not much time left before God brings this present system of things to an end.. God's purpose will soon be realized."

This was to be found at:
http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm
as recently as summer 2002.

Now this "generation of 1914" teaching has been changed many times by the WTS as time passed and Armageddon did not happen. The "generation" teaching, while first interpreted by Brooklyn in the normal sense of the word "generation" (which would mean Armageddon would have to have been in the 1930s or 1940s), was - as time passed - twisted and changed to instead mean that some of those old enough to experience, observe and properly understand the events of 1914 would survive to see Armageddon. But as time ticked on, and Armageddon still did not happen, the desparate Watchtower extended the generation to include even babies born in that year. Indeed, an elastic generation!

Then, in 1995, realizing that their false prophesy would soon be exposed as the generation died out, the Watchtower quietly dropped the generation teaching entirely - shamelessly blaming it on the rank and file "Jehovah's people":
"Eager to see the end of this evil system, Jehovah's people have at times speculated about the time when the 'great tribulation' would break out, even tying this to calculations of what is the lifetime of a generation since 1914. However, we bring a heart of wisdom in,' not by speculating about how many years or days makeup a generation, but by thinking about how we 'count our days' in bringing joyful praise to Jehovah. (Psalm 90:12) Rather than provide a rule for measuring time, the term 'generation' as used by Jesus refers principally to contemporary people of a certain historical period, with their identifying characteristics." - November 1 1995 Watchtower, page 16.

So then why, six years later, was the Watchtower still teaching "some people who were alive in 1914 will still be alive when this system comes to its end." - http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm ? What confusion!

Now, the Watchtower's legal representative, and future President, Frederick Franz, had in 1940 and 1943 declared on oath in Court that Jehovah God was the editor of the Watchtower:

LAWYER: Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main editor of the 'Watch Tower' magazine?
F.FRANZ: In 1931, October 15th, as I recall, the 'Watch Tower' discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.
THE COURT: He asked you who became the editor.
F.FRANZ: And it said..
THE COURT: Who became the editor?
LAWYER: Who became the editor when this was discontinued?
F.FRANZ: Jehovah God.

That was in 1940; and now again in 1943:

LAWYER: At any rate, Jehovah God is now the editor of the paper, is that right?
F.FRANZ: He is today the editor of the paper.
LAWYER: How long has he been editor of the paper?
F.FRANZ: Since its inception he has been guiding it.
LAWYER: Even before 1931?
F.FRANZ: Yes, sir..

These were from the action for Libel: Olin R. Moyle v. F.W.Franz, et al, 05 10 - 05 27 1943, New York Supreme Court, Appellate Division, sections 2596-7, 4420-1 (Moyle v. Rutherford et al., 261 App. Div. 968; 26 N.Y.S. 2d 860; Moyle v. Franz et al., 267 App. Div. 423; 46 N.Y.S. 2d 607; Moyle v. Franz et al., 47 N.Y.S. 484), first listed Kings County Clerk's Index No. 15845, 1940 Vol 2 p795.

Clearly, Jehovah, while the Editor of the Watchtower magazine (according to the WTS), was not trusted to be, or declined to be, the Editor of the Watchtower website!

But this story has yet another twist. Just a few months ago, the Watchtower website was in part "reorganized", and if you tried to suef to a bookmarked http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm you got the message:
This page has been moved to http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/article_07.htm

This page should be monitored regularly. It will soon be changed. And then those poor souls who bookmarked the original link, hoping that they would never die (the site containing as it did the clear and unambiguous Watchtower prophecy that Armageddon would come before all those alive in 1914 died), who later went back for reassurance will be told something different.

That is how the Watchtower rewards its followers. It tells them, in essence, that they were nuts to have believed the WT. It blames them for looking forward to Armageddon (despite having screamed that message for over a hundred years) and scolds them for their lives not having a purpose.

So the Watchtower:
a) Claims it speaks for God, even that its publication is edited by God.
b) Repeatedly and forcefully promulgates various false prophesies.
c) When forced to retract its false prophesies and renege on its false promises, cheats and deceives in order to hide what it has done from its own followers.
d) Hypocritically blames or ridicules its own followers for following it.
e) Notwithstanding the above, vigorously denies it meets the scriptural definition of a false prophet "If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him." at Deuteronomy 18:22, false claiming that the Watchtower has not been prophesying (it has), that being a "prophet" or prophet-like is quite different (it isn't), that it has not claimed to speak in God's name (it did), that it did not claim inspiration (it stated that God-breathed words were put into its mouth, which is exactly that) - or just using the excuse that it had good intentions (while hypocritically denying the same excuse to all others its criticizes, slanders and attacks).

Now let us turn to page 353 of the 1972 WT publication "Paradise Restored to Mankind - By Theocracy":
"Religious Hypocrisy Exposed .. Jehovah, the God of the true prophets, will put all false prophets to shame either by not fulfilling the false prediction of such self-assuming prophets or by having His own prophecies fulfilled in a way opposite to that predicted by the false prophets. False prophets will try to hide their reason for feeling shame by denying who they really are. They will try to avoid being killed or being pronounced spiritually dead by Jehovah's worshipers. He foretold this.."

Now, in the light of the above, who was the Watchtower talking about there? Eh??

And check:
http://www.watchtower.org/library/pr/soon_realized.htm
for yourself, before there is yet another deceitful change.

The Watchtower Society and the Jehovah's Witnesses Cult is an embodiment of SPIRITUAL PORNOGRAPHY, a WOLFISH TRICK, a MOST FILTHY LIE, a CHEAT, a SCAM, a DISGUSTING ABOMINATION, a BLASPHEMOUS INSULT, a WICKED FRAUD, a DISGRACE, a SCANDAL, a PEDOPHILE PARADISE - and a DAMNED OUTRAGE from start to finish.

--
Focus
( http://www.freeminds.org/history/part1.htm Class)

Edited by - Focus on 26 December 2002 15:59:30

67

History doomed to repeat itself...

by Reborn2002 in

jw
friends

another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.

is this not "terror" in itself?

at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?

Focus

NeonMadman wrote:

This is why I rarely get involved with political threads on this forum.

I agree. By so doing, you are shown in public to be an ignoramus (Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs"....) and either a very stubborn person or a genuine bigot (readers may not be able to tell which, even though I keep trying to interpret what you eructate in a way most flattering to you).

Indeed, a good reason for you not to participate... and your immaturity and ignorance makes you hard to debate with. The gap is a chasm. You should read and study more, think a very great deal more, and leave off the writing until the first tasks are accomplished to the satisfaction of your betters.

Striving to see things from the point of view of the "other side" may aid you in your path to wisdom, Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs"!

We aren't facing off against the whole Arab world here

But after loudmouthed, ignorants bigots have done with slandering whole races, ethnic groups, the collective 'membership' of "mainstream" religions, and inciting acts targeted against them, that may well change...

the groups we are talking about hate us, and that isn't going to change because we start using politically correct speech.

I am not talking about P.C. speech. I am talking about getting things at least approximately right, rather than drawing conclusions from idiotically incorrect "facts".

Can you imagine what might have occurred if something similar to the 9/11 attacks had been carried out against China

So? I prefer to have the moral high ground over totalitarian regime responsible for murdering their own student protesters like at Tiananmen Square.
And of course, you are too young to remember Kent State. Summer '70.

Sorry, friend, but if anybody has a right to be angry, it's us. We were the ones attacked, we were primarily the ones whose countrymen have been killed.

Any idea how many people have been murdered by terrorists trained by, financed by and directly supported by the States? By your logic, about twenty countries (most of which had never used or supported anti-U.S. violence) have the right to start bombing the U.S. right now.

Assuming you don't actually believe in colossal double standards, you really, really should better educate yourself about what your Government has perpetrated abroad "in your name".

It should be these terrorist groups and the governments and interests who sponsor them who should be very afraid indeed to make us any more angry than we already are - not the other way around.

You are a fool. Dangerous bluster like breeds hatred and breeds enemies among many who would otherwise have been neutral or friendly.

I read in your comments a certain sympathy with the terrorists

Only shows you can't read with discernment, Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs".

The world simply isn't the way you think it is.

you feel that they are justified in their attacks by actions the USA has taken on the world scene.

Idiot...... I feel no such thing. Your inability to distinguish "explained" and "justified" is noted. I hope you are very young, and your hot-headedness can be ascribed to inexperience, immaturity and childish folly and arrogance, rather than to wickedness, malice or stupidity.

No, not that I can read the heart of every citizen of Baghdad

Oh, that's so gracious of you to concede that!
But you are happy to have them killed anyway, "just in case"? And then wonder why that suitcase nuke goes off rather closer to home?

it would not surprise me

From one whose level of knowledge was shown by his bold assertion, despite warning shots, that "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs", I don't think any of the more discerning readers will give a rat's ass about what may or may not surprise you.

a lot of people who live there - especially those involved with the enemy government and other terror-sponsoring interests - think quite a bit like you do.

LOL! Your impotent anger is noted. When your sheer idiocy and ignorance is exposed to all, Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs", you continue to bluff, bluster and slander. Fools like you, permitted a platform, breed terrorists.

As far as objectivity, I never claimed it. Everything I post here is my own opinion.

Attention! Opinions can be objective.

I'm every bit as objective in my views as you are.

Fool. Your views are bred from, and in, ignorance, Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs". It is therefore not possible for you to be objective. Mine, in this area, are the result of a careful and considered study of history.

maturity? Well, I don't claim a lot of that, either, but I'll leave it to those who know me to decide.

The readers already have, fool. Haven't you read this thread? LOL!

you are a [..] moron

Those who view me as being a moron reveal far more about themselves than they do about me.

why does a word commonly used by Farkel pop into my mind at this point?

I would not dream of speculating about what dangerous fantasies pop into your head. Perhaps you should ask Farkel to comment on this thread, and he may be able to answer your question.

I wasn't aware that (anti-Semitic, Neo-Nazi, Holocaust-denying material written by 'good white folk' in the U.S./Canada) was being used as propaganda in the Arab world, but it makes a lot of sense that it would be. If so, it's a shame

1. Another massive bit of ignorance on your part. Propaganda plays a major part in almost all conflicts, and it is obvious that this type of propaganda is exactly the sort which serves anti-American hate "needs" in lands that are close to Israel.

2. "it's a shame" is the best you can do? Why don't you want to round up the authors of such hateful material close to home, rather than picking on defenseless ones from abroad? If I simply had to choose between one or other course of action, I would choose the first.

It is vocal ignoramuses such as yourself, Mr "the vast majority of Muslims are Arabs", who are God's gifts to terrorist recruiters. They too preach "My Nation, Right or Wrong". And you smear those who expose your nonsense for what it is as being sympathetic to, or sharing the views of, terrorists. Your ad hominem shows you are truly confused.

In the spirit of your bluster, I could suggest that you should consider being on Osama's payroll - at least that way you get paid for what your 'world view' may ultimately accomplish. But I will not.

--
Focus
(Suffering ungladly Class)

Edited by - Focus on 26 December 2002 13:12:13

121

The Ways Of A Weasel

by Yadirf in

jw
friends

i've taken note that the person that goes by the name "outlaw" continues to post daily.

yet, he hasn't entered the thread whose title bears his very own name.

yes, conveniently, outlaw skips past a thread that calls him to account for the lie he spoke about yadirf.

Focus

I defend Yadirf*! So I place myself on the List of those who defend obvious liars.

List of those who defend obvious liars
#1 COMF
#2 Francois
#3 Animal
#4 Valis
#5 xenawarrior
#6 maximumflash
#7 expatbrit
#8 DannyBear
#9 outofthe org
#10 Focus

***************************************************************************
The Watchtower Society and the Jehovah's Witnesses Cult is an embodiment of
SPIRITUAL PORNOGRAPHY, a WOLFISH TRICK, a MOST FILTHY LIE, a CHEAT, a SCAM,
a DISGUSTING ABOMINATION, a BLASPHEMOUS INSULT, a WICKED FRAUD, a DISGRACE,
a SCANDAL, a PEDOPHILE PARADISE- and a DAMNED OUTRAGE from start to finish.
***************************************************************************
--
Focus
(Well, Yadirf's right to speak, actually: that right which he and his Foul Spiritual Mamma would deny to us so readily... Class)

83

Judge Bans Shunning

by Farkel in

today i spoke with a former jw i've been in touch with for several years and discovered what i think could be a major bombshell for the wts.

as we all know, shunning is the most powerful weapon the wt cult has over its members and for decades the wts has been able to get away with practicing it at their whim.

the us and other courts have permitted them to to use it, even though it destroys families and has ruined countless lives.

Focus

Heaven:

Focus,
Unfortionatly, I have to agree.
Hey, we can still dream though, cant we?

And dreams may become reality, through the one tool that works against the Borg - legal action.

In my opinion, judicial opinion tends to cycle, to swing like a very slow pendulum. Absolute "rights to religious belief" as espoused by the judiciary have been interpreted repeatedly by courts as, in effect, allowing the leaders of religions to swindle, manipulate, control and spoil the lives of individuals, free from any consequences of their deceit and callousness.

But.... times they are a changing.

Here - especially for those spawn of Satan who run and manage the WTS:

Come gather round people wherever you roam
And admit that the waters around you have grown
And accept it that soon you'll be drenched to the bone
If your time to you is worth saving
Then you'd better start swimming or you'll sink like a stone
For the times, they are a changing

Come writers and critics who prophesize with your pens
And keep your eyes open, the chance won't come again
And don't speak too soon, the wheel's still in spin
And there's no telling who that it's naming
Oh the loser will be later to win
For the times, they are a changing

Come senators, congressmen, please head the call
Don't stand in the doorway, don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt will be her that has stalled
The battle outside raging will soon shake your windows
And rattle your hall
For the times, they are a changing

Come mothers and fathers all over this land
And don't criticize what you can't understand
Your sons and your daughter are beyond your command
Your old role is rapidly aging
Please get out of the new one if you can't lend a hand
For the times they are a changing

The line, it is drawn, the curse, it is cast
The slow one will later be fast
And the present now will soon be the past
The order is rapidly fading
The first one now will later be last
For the times, they are a changing

With thanks to Bob Dylan (and Warner Bros.,Inc.). By coincidence this user of the Bible also penned All Along the Watchtower:

"There must be some way out of here," said the joker to the thief
"There's too much confusion, I can't get no relief.
Businessmen, they drink my wine, plowmen dig my earth,
None of them along the line know what any of it is worth."

"No reason to get excited," the thief, he kindly spoke,
"There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke.
But you and I, we've been through that, and this is not our fate,
So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late."

All along the Watchtower, princes kept the view
While all the women came and went, barefoot servants, too.
Outside in the distance, a wildcat did growl,
Two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl.

While I have no reason to believe Dylan had the WTS specifically in mind, the applicability of much of this is obvious to many. And may the wicked ones reap the coming whirlwind.

--
Focus
(Approaching Strider... Class)

67

History doomed to repeat itself...

by Reborn2002 in

jw
friends

another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.

is this not "terror" in itself?

at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?

Focus

Quoth LDH:

I'm leaning toward's Focus' .. point of view.

Quoth SixofNine:

And yes, what a great terrorist recruitment tactic. Piss off people who are familiar with living and working in and amongst Americans. Good thinking, Georgie.

Quoth pettygrudger:

I couldn't agree more with you Focus that it is our "foreign" and domestic policies that gets us into so much hot water. ... I am talking about enlightening Americans. ... With all the wealth of knowledge available to us, with all the examples in recent history, with all the knowledge of recent history - we still seemed to have not learned a thing.

Quoth Robdar:

You had better start praying that you are not a member of the next identified group.

Quoth outoftheorg:

I enjoyed your reply Focus. It was well thought and delivered. I agree with much of it. ... of the whats wrong with us class

Quoth back2dafront:

Would have to agree with Focus actually.

Thanks, folks. But You Know I prefer some dissension. We ain't no steeenking Borg!

I'm 'bout done with good Bro' Neon, as he has me laughing so much I'll get a stitch. And that would not do in time. Save us all, would it, now, Six o' Nine? Please do not be harsh with him, Neon means well though is rather confused on this matter.

Merry Pagan Celebration, one and all. May good cheer be with you.

--
Focus
(You better watch out, you better not cry, you better not pout, I'm telling you why: Satan Claws is coming to town! Class)