Posts by thirdwitness

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

One of the requirements of any organization wishing to be a DPI NGO and have access to the DPI's vast resources, is that the organization makes full use of them. They must be at least using the facilities for a purpose in harmony with the DPI itself — to educate the public on the role and activities of the UN. To prove the organization is doing so, they must send copies of the organization's journal to the DPI as proof.

There is nothing wrong with this — it proves the Society was indeed making use of the resources, and not abusing them by promoting values contrary to that of the UN charter, such as Nazism, racism, or any such ideas. It is a sensible precaution on behalf of the DPI and completely appropriate.

The conspiracy theorists, however, see the Awake! articles published in the 1990's as part of the great conspiracy to promote the UN as a world government. Of course, any regular reader of the Awake! will laugh at these accusations, but is there any truth to them? NO, absolutely not.

The question now needs to be asked: Do these articles promote the UN or God’s Kingdom as the hope for mankind? They all, without exception, are showing how God’s Kingdom will succeed in remedying the problems of mankind where the UN and all human governments have failed. They hold a respectful attitude towards the UN and all governments while recognizing their sincerity and desire to improve the world. They tactfully declare the message of God's Kingdom so as not to turn people off when reading it.

If you want to read more go here:

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/awaketopropaganda.html

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

Yes, most certainly the WT is promoting the UN. They are promoting them as a failed organization thus far to bring solutions to earth's problems. They are promoting God's kingdom as the lasting solution that will solve all problems of mankind.

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

If you want to cut and paste the whole article be my guest. It is an article, like all WT articles, about how political leaders and organizations have failed to bring a solution and how only God's kingdom can bring that solution. It shows how the UN and other organizations have tried to bring solutions and the progress that they may have made as well as the problems they continue to face. Why would I care if the whole article is posted? There is nothing to hide. That would be great if you want to do that. I will just quote a little bit from it to show that the article is not pointing to the UN as the lasting solution for the problem. Instead as I show above, the article points to God's kingdom as the only lasting solution. Here are some quotes:

Satisfactory solutions to these problems seem to elude political leaders.

Donated money is used to educate the child or to provide life's necessities. If desired, pictures and letters can even be exchanged to strengthen the relationship. Though helpful, this arrangement falls short of being the ideal solution.

Try as they may, humans cannot provide the ideal solution to the problems of children. But they will be solved! Yes, and possibly sooner than you may expect. But how?

And then it closes with my earlier post above.

Maybe you are trying to make the claim that because the title of the article: The Problems of Children

THE SOLUTION AT LAST!, appears on at the top of each page including the page that lists the UN Declaration on the rights of children that the WTS is saying that the problems of chilren will be at last solved by the UN. This is not the case and is a misreading of the article. Is that what you are trying to point out?

You are grasping at straws. The WT publications continuously point to God's kingdom as the only solution to man's problems, not the UN.

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

Steve, that article at the WT site that you provided, notice how it finishes up.

A Divine Government to Provide the Complete Solution

Under God's Kingdom humans will be enabled to rear children in a balanced way. ( Job 33:24-26 ) Young folks will be raised in the spirit of peace and universal brotherhood, the ideal set forth in the UN Declaration of the Rights of the Child. ( Psalm 46:8, 9 ) Never again will there be the need for an International Year of the Child or for a Convention on the Rights of the Child.

Restoring perfect health to parents and to disabled children will be a simple task for Christ Jesus, the King of this heavenly government. The miracles of healing that he performed while he was on the earth are a guarantee. ( Luke 6:17-19 ; John 5:3-9 ; 9:1-7 ) Even resurrecting dead children and dead parents will not be beyond his power to accomplish!— Matthew 9:18-25 .

What a joy to know that the time for God to act in behalf of earth's children is near!

1380

The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible

by thirdwitness in

think about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.

why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?

as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.

thirdwitness

[Edited]

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

Repost for Cabasilas about what ideals of the UN were to be shared.

And as respects sharing the 'ideals of the UN' you are overlooking one little thing.

Even the 1996 resolution by the ECOSOC concerning an ECOSOC NGO’s support of the UN makes the following statement about that type of NGO (remember, the Society was not an ECOSOC NGO):

“3. The organization shall undertake to support the work of the United Nations and to promote knowledge of its principles and activities, in accordance with its own aims and purposes and the nature and scope of its competence and activities.”

Note that even an ECOSOC NGO, which is in a consultative relationship with the UN, isn't even obligated to support all the work of the UN. It says its support must be “in accordance with its own aims and purposes”. This means that the particular ECOSOC NGO would not support all the aims of the UN, but only those “aims and purposes” in the “scope of its competence and activities.”

In the case of Jehovah's Witnesses, those ‘aims and purposes’ would be in the field of religious freedom and human rights. That is the “scope of its competence and activities.” There is certainly nothing wrong with supporting that type of work and using whatever avenues are available for assistance. Further, if this qualified definition of “support” applied to the consultative-status ECOSOC NGO's, how much more qualified the definition of “support” must be to the DPI NGOs which enjoy no such status.

Of course, one of the main interests of the UN is human rights. If the UN wants to come to the aid of brothers being persecuted for their religious beliefs, should we not support that? The UN has not yet attacked God's people and proved itself to be an enemy of God. Did not Paul appeal to Rome when he was being persecuted? Yes — did he not use the legal system of a government which later proved to be the foretold “disgusting thing”, to advance true worship?

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

When it is pointed out that the NGO's with the DPI, according to the UN's own words, do not become members of the UN, auldsoul said: I said they were members of the UN/DPI, not registrants.

Then he tries to make it appear that the WTS is trying to cover up that they were members of the DPI and says: The Society outrightly lies when they mischaracterize the nature of the relationship as one of registrant to registrar.

What did the WTS really say? Did they deny that they ever had a membership to the DPI as Auldsoul contends?

Two quotes from letters sent out by the WTS disproves what Auldsoul is saying:

Quote #1: “Moreover, NGOs are informed by the United Nations that "association of NGOs with the DPI does not constitute their incorporation into the United Nations system, nor does it entitle associated organizations or their staff to any kind of privileges, immunities or special status."

Reasoning on the matter: If the WT was claiming that they were never associated with the DPI why would they quote information form the UN showing that "association of NGOs with the DPI does not constitute their incorporation into the United Nations?

Quote # 2: “After learning of the situation, our membership as NGO was withdrawn and the ID card of the writer was returned.”

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

Done4good: Secondly, the lack of an explanation to the R&F, (and threatening of df'ing for even ASKING about it), does not put the WT in a good light. Again, any honest person can see this. Why don't you try to take an honest look at yourself for once.

You exaggerate greatly. There is no threatening of df'ing for even ASKING about it. And I doubt that more than 1 out of 10,000 witnesses even know about it. Why would the WT publish some big long explanation about it. Anyone who wishes to inquire gets the explanation and are not threatened with DFing for asking about it.

I doubt that anyone has ever been DFed for only thinking that the WT did wrong in becoming associated with the DPI. Or for that matter for only disagreeing with 1914. Because once a person heads down that road they disagree with many things and want to tell their friends about it as well.

Why don't you try to take an honest look at yourself for once.

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

And as respects sharing the 'ideals of the UN' you are overlooking one little thing.

Even the 1996 resolution by the ECOSOC concerning an ECOSOC NGO’s support of the UN makes the following statement about that type of NGO (remember, the Society was not an ECOSOC NGO):

“3. The organization shall undertake to support the work of the United Nations and to promote knowledge of its principles and activities, in accordance with its own aims and purposes and the nature and scope of its competence and activities.”

Note that even an ECOSOC NGO, which is in a consultative relationship with the UN, isn't even obligated to support all the work of the UN. It says its support must be “in accordance with its own aims and purposes”. This means that the particular ECOSOC NGO would not support all the aims of the UN, but only those “aims and purposes” in the “scope of its competence and activities.”

In the case of Jehovah's Witnesses, those ‘aims and purposes’ would be in the field of religious freedom and human rights. That is the “scope of its competence and activities.” There is certainly nothing wrong with supporting that type of work and using whatever avenues are available for assistance. Further, if this qualified definition of “support” applied to the consultative-status ECOSOC NGO's, how much more qualified the definition of “support” must be to the DPI NGOs which enjoy no such status.

Of course, one of the main interests of the UN is human rights. If the UN wants to come to the aid of brothers being persecuted for their religious beliefs, should we not support that? The UN has not yet attacked God's people and proved itself to be an enemy of God. Did not Paul appeal to Rome when he was being persecuted? Yes — did he not use the legal system of a government which later proved to be the foretold “disgusting thing”, to advance true worship?

597

Great news. The WTS did not commit spiritual prostitution with UN.

by thirdwitness in

http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/

thirdwitness

Auldsoul and others talk as if the WT's association with the DPI meant they were a member of the UN. Jehovah's Witnesses have certainly never been a part of the United Nations, despite what many misinformed people may claim. Even when the Watchtower Society was a DPI NGO, the UN itself clearly stated to all such organizations that the “association of NGOs with the DPI does not constitute their incorporation into the United Nations system, nor does it entitle associated organizations or their staff to any kind of privileges, immunities or special status.” The very idea that access to the DPI's resources — although many and varied — was some sort of “political partnership” or “political alliance” as many of our critics claim, is not based in reality.

The DPI has never made any associated NGO organization “part of the UN” or gained that organization any kind of special treatment. This may be the case with ECOSOC NGOs, but certainly not with DPI NGO's in the 1990's!