slimboyfat

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Posts by slimboyfat

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  15

  Leaked - Video tape inside Watchtower HQ of protest Nov 5, 2017

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i saw this on jw reddit and thought, okay that will just be one of the protesters videotaping near their security entrance but it's really from inside the hq's.

  i doubt the org.

  will be happy that this was taped and leaked.https://rutube.ru/video/2dbc8185062524a41ed8c9e2117ca39d/.

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  slimboyfat

  Hold on a minute. Does this mean there are spies on the inside? Working against Kingdom interests? I am shocked.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  waton you substitute "lifeless" for the word "dead", and thereby make my point. "Lifeless" seems a less problematic description for rocks than "dead". I'm just pointing out there is something a bit odd about calling a rock "dead", just as it would be odd to call a rainbow or a cloud or a flame "dead", although you could call them that if you wish.

  To my mind, to call something "dead", implies that it has "died" at some point. That's why I find it a bit odd to call rocks "dead". When does a rock die? (Apart from rocks arising from organic matter as I said)

  And anyway, panpsychists as I understand it don't argue that nonorganic matter is alive. So it's a red herring. Although I suppose you could argue that awareness on any level implies being "alive". But then the distinction between life and non-life is complicated even outside of the issue of panpsychism. All sorts of categories that are only good so far as they are useful in any case.

  I don't think panpsychists would generally say rocks are conscious. In fact Strawson denies the table is conscious for example. The point is that all matter comprises basic constituents that have "awareness" as a basic property already present at the fundamental level. This is the alternative to the supposition that awareness and consciousness somehow arise suddenly in certain structures at a certain level of complexity - which is in some ways the more mystical or voodoo interpretation of reality when you think about it.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  I don't think anyone thinks rocks are alive. I don't think "dead" a particularly good description for them either. For something to be dead, doesn't it imply it was once alive? I don't think rocks were ever alive. Having said that, of course there are exceptions, like lumps of coal for example. It might make sense to describe coal as dead matter since it was once living matter. But not so igneous rocks and so on.

  We know that we experiece things and we know that we are made of matter. This is the only instance we have direct experience. So we know that at least some matter is able to experience, because we ourselves do. Which kind of poses the question: are there other kinds of matter that lack the ability to experience? We can't say for sure. Which kinds of turns the common intuition on its head, and suggests we should take the experimental quality of matter for granted, until proved otherwise in any given case. Or at least it shows that it's not necessarily safe to assume the non-experiential quality of matter outside the consciousness of humans and other species.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  The same person told me Asimov wrote books about the Bible too. Who was that now?
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  I knew someone who knew Asimov. Because I remember talking to them about Asimov, and they said he was really grumpy in person. But now I can't remember who it was I was talking to at the time. So strange to remember a whole conversation but not remember who I had it with. Am I getting old?

  Radio 4 was all about driverless cars tonight. They say it will only be a few years now.

  Will robots have consciousness? If all matter is minimally aware then maybe it adds another dimension (or maybe not) to the whole robot awareness thing, and the Turing test.
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  23

  Pale.Emperor Meets The Mormons

  by pale.emperor in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  when i was a jw i was fascinated with the mormon religion.

  i never believed a word of it of course, but i was interested in their religion like most boys were interested in star wars.

  i’ve read the book of mormon, doctrine & covenants, pearl of great price, book of abraham, watched their videos, read critical books by ex mormons etc etc… (strange at the time that i never did this with my own religion!

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  slimboyfat

  I've always been curious how they explain away the genetic evidence that North American natives are not descended from "the lost 10 tribes of Israel".

  One explanation I've read: Mormons believe that Israelites travelled to America, but they don't believe that the whole population of the Americas came from the Israelites. Only a very small proportion. Most native Americans descend from people from Asia who crossed the Bering Strait thousands of years ago. The relatively small numbers of Israelites who joined the may have (conveniently) left little or no trace in the current gene pool.

  Apologists have got an "answer" for everything. Especially Mormon apologists.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  jp I'm so glad you had a good time in Bordeaux and I really regret I couldn't make it. Until the last weeks I hoped to travel but in the end it was not possible and I was disappointed. I should have said so at the time.

  Ruby of course I can't prove panpsychism is true. Even those who promote the idea say it simply fits the facts best, or makes sense logically, not that it can be proved. Although some scientists have apparently talked about the feasibility of empirical tests in the future, it's theoretical and well beyond my understanding. I've suspected there may be some merit to the theory for a few years, and I admit I find it amusing how Cofty will dismiss anything he (currently) doesn't agree with as outrageous nonsense. Especially since I recently discovered his favourite "thinker" Sam Harris deems panpsychism worth discussing.

  Thanks Xan for the thoughtful response, especially since I've been not so generous in my own responses in the past.

  I think panpsychism makes a lot of sense but I'm not 100% convinced. Maybe around 30% convinced, if I had to quantify it. But I think it's an idea worth thinking about. There are other possibilities as well, including theistic explanations of course.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  It means I only tend to access the Internet on iPad or iPhone these days. I know it means some sites are not fully accessible but I can't be bothered turning on the PC or laptop.
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  65

  What is the benifits to living forever?

  by Jayk in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  can anyone give me a valid reason for it?

  growing old is a drag.

  the witnesses idea of ever lasting life, that you will come back to your most youthful state is such a bs answer..

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  slimboyfat

  What would I do? Everything.

  We wouldn't get old or symptoms of old age either.
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  142

  Panpsychism - a philosophy with a future

  by slimboyfat in

  1. social
  2. current

  at one time scientists believed that living things and non-living things were made of different material, accounting for the unique properties of living things.

  this idea is called vitalism and is no longer popular.

  what does remain popular (in fact is still the dominant view) is a similar idea that things that experience the world (humans, frogs, mice) are different from things that don't experience the world (potatoes, rocks, snowflakes).

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  slimboyfat

  I've not used my PC since circa 2012.