by startingover 10 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Since you are one of the easiest active JW's to ask, do you know how that year 1914 for the return of Jesus was arrived at?
I'm not asking to put you on the spot, but I am curious if you would be able to explain it to me if I asked.
I notice you never post on any threads that have to do with that subject.
I always had trouble wrapping my head around the 1914 date, including how they arrived at the month of October 1914. Also, I was confused by some of the other dates such as 1919, and the 1260 days, 42 months, etc. I remember studying it, and accepting it, but I never sat down and performed the calculations. I was very trusting in those days.
W
I suspect I was a typical JW in most ways. I trusted that the governing body was correct about 1914 and how the arrived at it because I had faith in Jehovah to not let me be mislead.
Faith is the key to being a JW more than anything else is taught. They told us they were Jehovah and Jesus mouthpiece, and we trusted and had faith that they were. Defd is still trusting and having faith even though he or she may be disfellowshipped.
Until one questions their reasons for trusting such a believe they can't analize it, something we can all understand.
Balsam
sis I am not DF.
sis I am not DF.
So, that's how 1914 is arrived at...hmmm, I would've thought it would have been more complicated than that.
LOL Undercover
Defd, I was wondering if you had even read this thread, but now I know you have. I am presuming it is not something you can answer, based upon your non response and also non participation in 1914 threads.
I guess that is what I was expecting. FF really sums it up. Most JW's can't answer that, even though 1914 and how it is arrived at is the most important thing a JW can know. The whole organization exists today to accomplish the preaching work, in particular the preaching of the good news. The good news is wrapped around 1914. If 1914 is wrong because 607 is wrong, then the men in NY have not been selected by god and have no special knowledge and are guessing like everyone else. Just another religion.
I think most JW's now, even though they are studying the Daniel book, really don't pay attention to the validity of 1914, they just accept. Especially the young ones. If I didn't have a public talk I gave many times based upon Danial Ch 4, I probably wouldn't have been able to tell you either, although I've heard it my whole life. It makes me wonder how much Mormons, expecially young ones, know about Joseph Smith and the golden tablets. Next time I see them, I think I will ask them how much they are taught about that.
You know us SO well. Did you ever think that we dont bother with explaining it to some because we know they REALLY dont care?
I am a Witness, I can answer for you.
do you know how that year 1914 for the return of Jesus was arrived at?
Assumption #1: Daniel 4:10-17 has two fulfillments, The first would be fulfilled on Nebuchadnezzar and the latter would be fulfilled on Jehovah's Sovereignty over the earth (whose sovereignty is supposedly represented by a Babylonian King).
There is, however, nothing in the text of Daniel 4 to indicate a secondary fulfillment. In fact, every element of the prophecy was also fulfilled in that same chapter. So the question arises: Why apply it as a second fulfillment?
Jesus said, "Jerusalem will be trampled on by the nations, until the appointed times of the nations are fulfilled." so obviously that means that Daniel's prophecy about "seven times" (which incidentally was not a prophecy of Daniel's, but rather a dream of Nebuchadnezzar's) applied to Jerusalem being trampled at some later date.
Seven times equals seven years, because the Governing Body says so and a couple of other prophecies were fulfilled that way. But its not just seven year, oh no! That would be too easy, it is seven years of years, not days. Hah! Clever, huh? Had you looking one way, and then [whoops!] jumped the other way. Head fake, serious head fake.
But it isn't really even seven years of years. It is really seven years of "prophetic years" (a concept not founded on Scripture) that are 360 days long. Now, you may be thinking, "Well, okay but I don't see any reason to apply fulfillments of other prophecies to this one unless the text indicates it."
Seven times 360 is 2520, from 607 B.C.E. (a starting point ONLY Jehovah's Witnesses use), application of "a day for a year" (again, not indicated in the text at all) brings you to 1914 A.D.
So, in 1914 Nebuchadnezzar finally got his kingdom restored to him, and merrymaking was enjoyed by all.
Respectfully,
OldSoul
Defd,
You response indicates to me you probably can't answer it. Misdirect all you want, sounds like just an excuse. Reminds me of an answer an elder gave my friend when he questioned him about a certain WT teaching. His answer to why they beleived that way in spite of evidence to the contrary was "Because". Yes, he believed that "just because" was an acceptable answer. Hadn't heard a comeback like that since grade school.
I don't think you have a clue why I would even start this thread. Let me tell you. The 607-1914 teaching which I discovered is faulty destroyed my faith in the WTS. I find it hard to understand how someone when informed of such a mistake, can just ignore it, as my wife and parents do. I think most JW's are like FF was, they just don't stop and think about it. Or maybe if they think there is a problem they have to ignore it and hope it goes away.
Old Soul really hits it, it's all a faulty assumption that there's a secondary fulfillment.
Maybe defd does not want to really know about 1914/607 BCE. That way he does not have to take responsibility for remaining in a cult that is so intent on denying Jesus.
