At last finished reading Crisis of Conscience

by diamondblue1974 42 Replies latest jw friends

  • willyloman
    willyloman
    My only criticism would be my not understanding how such a bright fellow as R. Franz didn't take the next logical step in applying his intellegent skepticism to the Bible itself. The fact that he remains a Bible believer to this day is shocking to me.

    Good point. But the fact that he does believe in the Bible makes his book all the more palatable to doubting dubs. If he were an avowed atheist he''d have attracted almost no readers from among transitional JWs doing the kind of soul searching that precedes their exit from the borg. What makes his book so condemnatory -- and credible -- to waning dubs is the realization that comes through in reading the book: That this is one of the True Believers, and even he saw through the b.s.

    Also: I second the motion for www.commentarypress.com

    It's a terrific site to browse as well as a place to buy the book directly from Ray Franz.

  • LouBelle
    LouBelle

    Greendawn - I've been recently reading on how the GB would make decisions. There were 17 around about the time R.Franz was on board and he said that when they would take a vote - even if it was in the majority of say doing alternative military service it wasn't good enough - it had to be a 2/3ds' majority - Some GB brothers' wouldn't vote, some wouldn't even attend. And he mentions a time when they had the 2/3rds' majority (to change something for the benefit of the brothers) They had a 't'break and when they came back the 1 brother jumped sides and shifted the vote to majority but not 2/3rds.

    Funny how we were taught not to be political and yet the GB seem to be corrupt politicians in the making.

  • Krista
    Krista

    Hi Diamond Blue,

    Regarding what you called the "severe split" I feel very sad and sickened. I was willing to have a bible study and give it a try, which I am still doing. I know it does'nt make any sense. But my dad, all my siblings and my nieces and nephews are in this thing and that is the big struggle.

    I guess I am coming to terms with the reality that our family will be split someday and that's a hard reality to come to.

    Krista

  • jschwehm
    jschwehm

    Hi Krista:

    My mother was raised a Lutheran and left it to become a JW. My father and his parents who were nominal Catholics also became JWs. This caused a split in my family in that most of my mother's relatives who were very active Lutherans wanted absolutely nothing to do with the JWs. When I left the JWs (after being a bethelite and a pioneer) it has also caused some division in the family.

    In any case, I can relate to what you are saying. If you ever want to dialog about things feel free to email me at [email protected] or you can private message me.

    Jeff Schwehm

  • Krista
    Krista

    Jeff,

    Thank you for your understanding. I just might take you up on your offer someday.

    Krista

  • TweetieBird
    TweetieBird

    Just curious, does anyone know how many copies of "Crisis of Conscience" have been sold? I remember my dad read it back in the 80's and soon after disassociated himself. I know of a sister that read it and she said that it didn't change her feelings about the organization at all. I read it and have never been the same.

  • Liberty
    Liberty

    Hi TweetieBird,

    I don't know how many copies are out there but I had to comment on those people who claim to have read the book and yet say it didn't change their feelings about the Watch Tower Society. These folks must believe that Raymond Franz is a complete liar and a master of fiction writing because even if just half of the book were true and understood to be from the view point of a disgruntled employee it still provides more than enough evidence to damn the Watch Tower Society. It is so clear that the organization is morally corrupt and riddled with false teachings that no amount of creative writings could come up with this much absurd nonsense and bizaare politicing behind the scenes. Only a very knowledgable insider and someone with an incredable imagination could come up with a story like this and someone with that good of an imagination would be writing best selling fiction and not wasting their time bashing a piss-ant group like the JWs.

    The longer a JW has been involved with the Society the more the book rings true because I remember many of the organizational changes and date pushing from the late 1960's and on and you just can't make that stuff up and have it all add up in the end. Someone would have to really have a complete lack of critical thinking ability in order to not be moved on some level by this book if they were ever a JW and really sat down and read it.

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    Loubelle thanks for the recap on the GB s system of decision making, that voting is enough in itself to invalidate their claim to divine appointment and direction, and I am sure they themselves realise this better than anyone else which then means they are willingly and knowingly lying to and deceiving their followers with all the FDS nonsense. That's the hallmark of a cult.

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    Cameron:

    Informative. This must explain why there is an unaccountability that runs from top to bottom. Kind of like a crowd mentality ("it wasn't me pushing, it was everybody else.."). So, it is hardly surprising that I met with so many individuals there who had no sense of accountability on a personal level with anything they did - as long as they got their meetings and service in and weren't guilty of any of the biggies (fornication, drugs, etc.) They felt they were under an umbrella of protection of some sort.

    I seriously would have a problem serving a god who would condone any of this.

    LHG

  • diamondblue1974
    diamondblue1974
    Hi Diamond Blue,

    Regarding what you called the "severe split" I feel very sad and sickened. I was willing to have a bible study and give it a try, which I am still doing. I know it does'nt make any sense. But my dad, all my siblings and my nieces and nephews are in this thing and that is the big struggle.

    I guess I am coming to terms with the reality that our family will be split someday and that's a hard reality to come to.

    Krista

    Krista I know what you are going through and yes reality is hard and families can exert the biggest pressure of all even unwittingly; it would wrong of me to say what you should do or what you shouldnt as it is clearly not my place but you will have friends you can turn to here when things are bad.

    Keep smiling

    DB74

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