CT Russell and JF Rutherford..........

Gill

If CT Russell and JF Rutherford were still alive today, for what could they be disfellowshiped or even just 'marked' for?

MidwichCuckoo

Where to start?

Russell - adultery or loose conduct http://users.skynet.be/awsid/eng/paws003e.htm

Celebrating Christmas and being in possesion of a nasty beard.

Rutherford - Smoking, drinking, fornicating.

I was going to add child abuse and false prophesy - but apparently these aren't considered as bad as having facial hair.

Considering the general behaviour of these two men, it's hardly a surprise that the WTBTS like to keep its history as quiet as possible. I began to think, that their policy on not making a fuss about individuals is more for the reason that if they should overly mention their origins a lot of nasty skeletons could be falling out of the cupboard.

Russell and Rutherford, if they were still alive, would be a terrible embarrassment to the bOrg. Imagine having to disfellowship your very founders! But their bad behaviour in the past, I believe has laid the foundations for the bOrg being willing to dismiss things such as paedophilia and forgive easily adultery on the part of elders and reinstate them very quickly.

However, any deviation from bOrg doctrinal thinking is pounced on and crushed completely out of proportion. It's probably also a reason why they do not deal with the real alcohol problem that exists amongst the JWs.

Russell and Rutherford may well have survived pretty well in the present WTBTS system of doing things but their philanderings have meant that only the sexual misdemeanours of the 'lower downs' in the bOrg are considered a serious impediment to progress in the bOrg.

I know of several elders who have had affairs, divorced their wives for young pretty sisters and are reinstated as JWs and Elders very quickly. I know many here do to.

But if sister X bats an eye lid a brother Y ..... another story all together.

Makes you wonder if they get their pattern of thinking from the old Testament. King David, always up to 'no good' and getting away with it. But if his servant did the same thing.....death by stoning!

A rule for one and a different for another.

The WTBTS must be full of nasty foul smelling skeletons in its cupboards.

They managed to escape the falling out of the UN scandal.

There's got to be more, perhaps far far worst.

And you know what.....someone, somewhere knows what they are.

MidwichCuckoo

Lol - they'd disfellowship JESUS HIMSELF - I can't imagine Jesus would AGREE with the WTBTS's teachings, so He'd be out on His ear......oh, and He's got a beard too!

Gill

MC -LOL! Then there were all those 'bad associates' that Jesus used to hang out with, prostitutes and tax collectors. Hardly any wonder they DF'd Ray Franz!

The beard's got to be the icing on the cake!

greendawn

Russell also did something very naughty when he used his printing business to publish the book written by a spiritistic medium. In that book all sayings were inspired in her by a demon. Can you imagine that! The sleezy excuse was that the demon in question was a repentant one.What a joke.

In addition he was using masonic symbols. Even after his death he wanted these by his grave, and the cross is part of them.

In Rutherford's time they were using ouija bords quite extensively in Bethel.

That's why it is almost certain that this org is under a lot of occult masonic and demonic influences behind the scenes.

Gill

greendawn - I know I didn't know about these things until reading them on the net. I was in the fortunate position of my parents having quite a few of the very old books and could verify a fair amount of the information I read.

But, I should imagine a lot of JWs would have a dreadful shock, to such an extent that they wouldn't even believe what they read about the occult, masonic influences.

As for the translating of the NW translation. I did say this to someone, that Grueber and wife were mediums and they WOULD NOT believe it! They were adamant that the WTBTS are the only organization who REALLY study the Bible, the history of the bible and the ancient languages. Ignorance is bliss!

I didn't know about the ouija boards in Bethel in Rutherford's era, however.

Wonder what they do to entertain themselves now! The mind boggles!

greendawn

Gill it's not surprising that they would use Greber since Rutherford had a similar attitute to his. They both believed that they were receiving knowledge from angels supposedly God's angels and Greber got defrocked by the catholics for this reason. Franz and Knorr were inquiring to see if the angels told Greber anything on certain dogmatic issues and this was in the 1950's.

That most of the info Rutherford got from them turned out to be wrong proves beyond all doubt what sort of angels he was contacting. Yet he never admitted the obvious. That's why he was an out and out occultist or demon driven spiritistic medium and his bullying personality had numerous demonic streaks in it.

Many of his dogmatic ideas eg the 144000 doctrine may well have originated from the demons.

As for ouija boards Rutherford reviled and kicked someone out of the org (I think it was Goodrich) when he became too opposed to this practice, who then sued and won damages from the WTS for libel.

MidwichCuckoo

Sheesh - I was amazed to learn of the Ouija board stuff - just googled it (haven't read it thoroughly yet) - yep Greendawn, it appears that Goodrich complained to the WTBTS of their usage of Spiritism and was disfellowshipped as a result!

greendawn

Yes and Rutherford was foolish enough in his boisterousness to railroad Goodrich in writing, castigating him according to his usual vitriolic lawyer's rhetoric, a devil inspired enemy of Jehovah's people etc, and he then had all he needed to start a legal case against the WTS.

I have the link to all this story somewhere but I can't find it right now.

CT Russell and JF Rutherford..........

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