Myth what are they good for??

by frankiespeakin 16 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  talesin

  I've watched Joseph Campbell's series. He is an amazingly calm man, very non-threatening and accepting in his demeanour, which I find makes him easy to listen to.

  Check out "Women Who Run With the Wolves - Myths & Stories of the Wild Woman Archetype" by Clarissa Pinkola Estes.

  She is a Jungian analyst, and looks at a variety of myths, including The Red Shoes, the Legend of the Silky, and relates how their lessons can teach us how to be closer to our original, wilder natures.

  Although the book is titled "WOMEN", it is not male-exclusive, and Estes makes that clear. I think you'd enjoy it, frankie.

  t
• 

  frankiespeakin

  Tale,

  I was watching a video on C. Jung and he brings out that one of the reasons our Society was so many wars is that we supress the Animus(womenly) nature of man. They used a famous movie starring I think Cary Grant and some women? I wish I could remember it. Jung felt that movies are a powerful expression of what conflicts and problems confronting the human psyche.

  BTW I did a quick search on the title you mentioned and came up with this:

  http://www.rambles.net/estes_women92.html

  Throughout the book, women are compared with wolves. Like wolves, Estes argues, wild women (by which she means strong women who are in touch with their intuitive nature, not the beer-drinking honky-tonk wild women of country songs) have been falsely maligned and unjustly persecuted. Yet like wolves, wild women are playful, intuitive, family-oriented, brave and enduring. When the instinctive inner self is disrupted, the symptoms include "feeling extraordinarily dry, fatigued, frail, depressed, confused, gagged, muzzled, unaroused. Feeling frightened, halt or weak, without inspiration, without animation, without soulfulness, without meaning, shame-bearing, chronically fuming, volatile, stuck, uncreative, compressed, crazed."

  Never fear! Throughout the book, Estes gives examples of how to restore and develop this inner self, by learning to follow instinctual promptings, to recognize "leg traps, cages, and poison bait" as the wolf-based title of one
• 

  JamesThomas

  Perhaps myth can be of some value to those who know that they are feeble attempts at explaining unseen present-moment truth within us. Generally it seems, people have no clue what is being presented, or worse yet, bow-down and worship the mythological archetypes. Jesus-worship is a great example of myth gone amuck.
  
  The "Christ" is referring to our own infinite, unbroken and true nature, which is closer and deeper than the fragile individual-identity we believe ourselves to be. But rather than examine the myth and use it as a glimmer of light to seek within for what has no beginning or end, we instead shrink and reduce the Divine to a tiny character out there someplace and use it to divide us rather than reveal our inherent Oneness.
  
  Myth, though seemingly at first childish, takes a certain degree of knowledge and wisdom to exploit correctly. Generally we are not taught such knowledge, and when we do hear of it, it can seem quite weird and even sacrilegious as it takes the light of our cherished deities and places it on us, were it belongs.
  
  
  j
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  JamesThomas

  Another archetype which is extremely important to understand and which is kind of anti-worshipped -- as many put as much energy into hating it as they do loving and worshipping their god -- is Satan.
  
  The mythical Satan can be seen as the ego: the tight weave of concepts, memories, beliefs, emotions, thoughts and ideas which make up the false identity of self, that which believes itself separate from God. We cherish our little made-up identities (the antichrist), and place it higher than all else. It is the same false identity -- the Satan so-to-speak -- which reduces God to an object, thing, or person such as Jesus. For when we dedicate ourselves to worshipping a minimalistic idea of a god who is too small to be here now, we confirm, support and reinforce our make-believe individual identity which is separate from Divinity. So ironically, it is the Satan within us that makes Jesus, or Jehovah, or Allah, or whomever, into a god.
  
  However, if we use Satan (the ego/the false identity) as a point of inner investigation, our real Identity can be revealed. Here, Satan becomes Lucifer. What is seemingly bad one moment, becomes the angel of light. Who woulda thought.
  
  The most wondrous journey is inwards.
  
  j
• 

  Narkissos

  Very interesting thread.

  Whatever its connection (or the lack thereof) with history and science, a myth is a master narrative designed for collective and individual self-understanding. We can't build a self-representation (ego, "me") without referring to some kind of myth.

  I would say a myth is dangerous when it becomes unique. And the good thing in the Bible is that it often juxtaposes concurrent and mutually exclusive myths (e.g. the two stories of creation or the four Gospels). The problem arises when religion (e.g. the WT) harmonises the different myths into one meta-narrative or super-myth, making them an absolute prison of the mind instead of tools for positing one's self. I would suggest that the way of individual and collective freedom implies relating to different and incompatible myths: this is what culture and education are about.
• 

  talesin

  frankie,

  Yes, that is the essence of the book - although i don't think it is quite as celebratory and "you can fix it" as the website seemingly presents it. It's more about examining these archetypes through the myths, and seeing how they may apply to modern-day life lessons.

  I think the movie may have been "The Fountainhead", but that would be Gary Cooper?

  Myth, though seemingly at first childish, takes a certain degree of knowledge and wisdom to exploit correctly. Generally we are not taught such knowledge, and when we do hear of it, it can seem quite weird and even sacrilegious as it takes the light of our cherished deities and places it on us, were it belongs.

  Yes, JamesThomas, and this is what the book I was speaking of explores.

  t
• 

  seven006

  George Lucas was a great admirer of Joseph Campbell and openly admits that his writings were a major influence on the Star Wars movies. He has spoken about this in interviews several times. The human psyche hasn't changed for thousand of years and still craves hearing about the myths. The myths of old are what gave us the religions of today as well as the block buster movie plots.

  In ancient times as today, people have always asked the five main "W's" who, what, when, where and why. Those questions are the premise of all stories. Our thrust for knowledge and entertainment has always been two of the strongest factors that separates us from other mammals.

  In ancient times these stories or myths were easily believed because of the lack of ability to disprove them due to limited knowledge of science and a poor line of communication of the time. The myths were passed on by the main source of news and information at the time. That source was the traveling merchant who visited far off lands and brought back strange and mysterious goods and also strange and mysterious stories. Then around triable camp fires these stories were passed on and embellished for entertainment purposes. This is where we got, men who walked on water, talking snakes, world wide floods, the sun stopping so an army could be defeated, men resurrecting men from the dead, seas splitting in half so the good men can escapee from the evil ones, angels, demons, devils and gods. It was a great source of entertainment and a poor source of history. It all was based on the oldest and most loved plot of all, good conquering evil.

  What would Star Wars be without The Force, Darth Vader, Luke, Yoda, Obiwan, or any of the other interesting characters? Would it have been as successful if they did not display super human capabilities and show how good eventually defeats evil?

  The same goes for The Holy Spirit, Satan, Jesus, Krishna, Buddha, and Moses as well as other prophets of various religions. Who would have thought Moses was a great man if he did not turn a stick into a snake, bring about the plagues of ancient Egypt or split the red sea in half to save the Empire? Or Jesus and Buddha were truly not sent by god because they both raised the dead?

  Or Satan was the ultimate bad ass because he had an odd fruit faddish and became the main reason mankind is doomed? Or we could simply call on the Holy Spirit (AKA The Force), to give us the strength to mentally defeat the enemy within ourselves?

  The stories haven't changed throughout history, only the names of the characters, the place it is told, and medium used to tell the story. The only difference today is, some of us accept that Star Wars is just a story.

  Dave