The end of Social Security (Not a flame thread)

by Preston 24 Replies latest social current

• 

  metatron

  I give Bush credit for having the guts to confront the Social Security issue. The Democrats

  are being dishonest and gutless about it.

  If you or I tried to do what the government does with Social Security, we'd be arrested

  for running a pyramid scheme. If the demographics aren't bad enough, consider that

  science is closing in on the cause of aging - and getting ready to exploit stem cell

  research. You can't have large groups of people living off Social Security for 4, 5, 6

  decades.

  Consider what's happening down in New York state with Medicare as an example

  of where these entitlements are going. Major cities like Buffalo and Schenectady

  are going bankrupt along with county governments like Erie because there's just

  no way they can pay for medicare. They are shutting down local parks, libraries,

  and police patrols - and New York State is too endebted to pick up the tab.

  Remember Jesus saves

  . ...... but Moses invests!

  metatron
• 

  stillajwexelder

  put tax on gasoline = that will solve the problem
• 

  xenawarrior

  I also think one of the best things the clinton administration came up with was not taxing social security as income

  One of the first things Bill Clinton did was RAISE taxes on social security. And in 2000 when the Republicans wanted to repeal it he said he would veto a repeal of it.

  The 1993 Omnibus Reconciliation Act (OBRA 1993) requires senior citizens who earn more than $34,000 (singles) or $44,000 (couples) to pay income taxes on 85 percent of their Social Security benefits. Over five years this bill returns the amount of Social Security benefits subject to income tax to 50 percent, the level of benefits taxable before OBRA. The percentage of Social Security benefits subject to income taxes will drop from 85 percent to: 75 percent for tax year 1996, 65 percent for tax year 1996, 60 percent for tax year 1997, 55 percent for tax year 1999, and 50 percent for tax year 2000

  http://www.uscare.com/sceact.html
• 

  bigboi

  Not trying to increase tension on this thread but I just wanted to let you know BB that the above statement is actually factually incorrect.

  No tension here, dude. By all means explain. I'm eager to hear your point of view.
• 

  Happy Guy :)

  Without getting into a lengthy explanation regarding economic theory, it has to do with (permanent and unrecoverable) inefficiences which stem from "dead weight loss".
• 

  Satanus

  The ss future sounds dire, but it's like so many other things, if the govt wants the money to be there, it magically is there. Money is created and destroyed every day. No big thing really, if there is a will.

  S

  Ps, has anyone heard of these cafr things where federal, state, local govts, school boards, etc have supposedly invested money in stocks and other investments that have generated a huge fund. Supposedly, this investment fund is being hidden from general view. Here is a site on this: http://www.americanfreepress.net/RFA_Articles/Media_Watchdogs

  _Won_t_Expose_S/media_watchdogs_won_t_expose_s.html
• 

  Preston

  give you a personall example. I just had to lay off two workers who were each making $25.00 an hour plus the standard benefits. There were a few reasons involved but a main reason was that I can't afford the federal payroll taxes (FICA, etc.) It's especially brutal when my guys put in over time. These tax laws are killing small businesses. It sucks when a corporation sends job overseas but it's even worse when small business close their dorrs because of these tax burdens.

  So, the Bush tax cuts aren't working?

  Actually bigboi, what roy is talking about isn't directly related to the Bush tax cuts per se, so that isn't entirely a correct statement. Companies have to deal with a lot of double taxation and it sucks. I don't know the entire makeup of Roy's busienss, but for every dollar of medicare and social security that gets taken out of an employee's paycheck every week for a corporation's #941 taxes, that company has to pay the same amount included on its #941, dollar for dollar. If that's the case then an employee at Roy's business working at $25.00 /hr 40 hours a week is making $1000 dollars a week. That's $150 in social security and medicare that our company would pay out for the same employee. To be fair though our company noticed a decrease in our federal taxes because of the new tax laws, but that's money that gets taken out of an employees taxes that the company doesn't have to pay out dollar for dollar. If I had my own company, I would just 1099 my staff and let them worry about their deductions....
• 

  xenawarrior

  If I had my own company, I would just 1099 my staff and let them worry about their deductions....

  You can't just "do" that. That staff would have to be independent contractors and the IRS rules and the criterion for unemployment compensation (at least in our state) is very rigid about who can be considered as such.

  Edited to add: also, on $1,000 of payroll, the SS allotted amount that the employee pays is $76.50. The employer then pays their portion : $76.50 also. The SS rate is .0765% with OASDI & FICA for each the employee and the employer
• 

  heathen

  I guess I jumped to some conclusions there . I heard somewhere that social security is not taxable anymore . So now you are saying that it depends on how much you make after you file for SS ? I don't know anybody that can survive on SS alone and feel strongly that people should have the right to work with it not being included in their income . WTF there are people getting welfare so why shouldn't people be entitled to something when they retire ? I agree it is so much like a pyramid scheme the whole concept needs to be scrapped at some point and let people decide what to do with their own money .
• 

  roybatty

  So, the Bush tax cuts aren't working?

  Somewhat. One of the best things he did was increase the depreciation rate I can take when buying new machinery. I ended up buying two new machines that I otherwise wouldn't have bought. I'm sure that machine manufacturers liked that. For the Bush to re-do the payroll tax system, THAT would be a major undertaking. I can't see that happening no matter who's in office. I have to admit, in some ways I was actually more impressed with Kerry's attention to small businesses.