To Seven

by Frenchy 12 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Frenchy

    Dear Seven,
    I sympathize with your dilemma. I’m in the same boat myself. I have wrestled with this for a long time and continue to do so. How does one know what is true and what is not? Most of the time there are good arguments on both (or more) sides of the issue. Most of the time we are arguing about things on which Scripture is sketchy or vague at best. The Bible is not a hand book on ‘the true religion’ in which doctrine and procedure is specifically spelled out.
    I have made an interesting (to myself, at least) observation over the past few years. People don’t go to the Bible to find the truth. They first accept a ‘truth’ then they go to the Bible to prove that it’s so. And it works! Trinitarians find ample ‘proof’ in the Bible for their doctrine. Opponents of the Trinity find ample ‘proof’ that it does not exist. Sometimes both sides use the same Scripture! I am currently debating this on another board and you would be surprised at the liberties that are taken with the Scriptures.
    We decide on what is so and then we spend our time finding passages in the Bible that ‘support’ our belief while downplaying those that seemingly contradict. The amazing thing about all of this is that the Bible will ‘support’ contradicting theologies. You can find in there exactly what you want to find! Perhaps that is the most amazing characteristic of this remarkable book. I can’t help but feel that God designed it so. Your true self eventually comes out. In the end you find yourself, you find out what it is that you really want.
    So we have to ask ourselves what it is that we are looking for before we open that book. You want to believe that God exists? You will find it there. You want to believe that it’s just a book written by men and full of contradictions and errors? You will find that too. You want hope? It’s there. You want controversy? It’s there too. You want a reason to love your fellow man? You will find it there. Do you want a reason to despise your neighbor? You will find that too.
    I sometimes feel that the Bible is more a book of questions than of answers. Questions that are to be answered from each of our individual hearts. One thing is surfacing for me that I am slowly accepting. God never intended everything to be black and white. A simple rule book would have been easy for him to produce. A simple procedural manual would have been easy too. He did not choose to do so. Why not? Why all those cryptic passages and seeming contradictions from a God of infinite wisdom? The Bible is doing it’s job. It’s making us search our hearts for what we want, what we truly desire while at the same time providing, in the background, the material that we need to construct a standard of living that God approves.
    What do you want? Life on earth? It’s promised there. Life in heaven? It’s promised there too! It’s easy to find someone who is very persuasive with words and one who has worked out some clever theory based on a portion of the Bible and then from that time forward just allow this person (or organization) to do our thinking for us. In time we delude ourselves in thinking that God is ‘using’ this person to sound down ‘the truth’ to us. In reality they are simply theorizing and in the end, they have to start revising their theories as the ‘holes’ become manifest over time. The truth has to be between us (individual) and God. The Bible will help us to scrutinize our hearts and give us the encouragement for doing what we know down deep inside that we should. It is, as Paul said, sharper than any two edged sword and it does divide.
    The truth will not be found on a web site or in some theologian’s book or from the manuals of a religious entity. Bits and pieces of the truth might be repeated from those and other sources from time to time but ‘the truth’ is not there. It’s in our hearts and with God’s help and our hard work we can release some of it.

    -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

    Edited by - Frenchy on 11 August 2000 8:31:32

  • waiting

    Wow, your fast, Frenchy!!!!!

    I was just going to recommend that you go back and put a subject line - and you already had!!!

    Remember more than you think, huh?


  • Pathofthorns

    An outstanding post Frenchy, one of the best in a long time, and reflecting the conclusions that I too am coming too.

    I think there is something deeply profound to Pilot's question to Jesus "What is truth?"

    I don't think there are any certain answers to that question, but the answer lies in the search for truth, and the satisfaction is not in having found the answers, but in having asked the questions.


  • Friend


    Hope this is not butting in, but I am compelled to add my voice to those already here. Well put!


  • mgm

    Great post, frenchy. How nice to have such an open minded discussion.
    I for myself can not take the word truth into my mouth anymore, since I don't believe that any religion on earth is the truth.
    I go even further and ask myself a lot in the last time:
    Is the bible really from god?
    But even ones believe that, you can proove almost every believe in the bible, as Frenchy mentioned.
    And the WTS is doing exactly the same when quoting other sources. The pick out, what support the teachings, no matter how old or what source it is. Did you ever notice that a lot is quoted from the last century?
    Science didn't stay still last 100 years...the WTS did..

  • Seven

    My dear French Knight, Thanks for these words of wisdom so early in the morning. I've never met anyone quite like you in my life. We are only
    dancing on this earth for such a short time that I just want to be sure to get it right. Maybe there is no truth. Maybe truth afterall is the part of us that enables us to love-that part of us that belongs to God and makes us his own. It is in our hearts and there's no need to look any further.

  • Frenchy

    Waiting: It was a blunder. I intended to make this a reply to Seven’s post and I hit the wrong button! Ah well…But I am fast –sometimes!
    Path: Thank you. I too have long been intrigued by Pilot’s question and Jesus’ silence.
    Friend: Thank you.
    Mgm: I, too’ am very discriminating when using that word. For a while I doubted also that the Bible was God’s work because I became so frustrated and angry at not getting the answers I sought. I was upset by the vague allusions to what I thought was solid doctrine. I see things differently now. It’s much like a mirror. Ever notice how much better you look in a mirror than in a video tape?
    Dearest Seven: Nor I anyone like you. You are so right about the short dance and though we just barely touch but for the briefest of moments in this netherworld I am grateful for those encounters. I don’t think anyone of us will ever get the dance right. I believe that in the end we shall be judged not by what we have done but rather by how hard we tried, not by where we have arrived but rather on how far we have traveled. I for one know that I have not gone very far in life by many standards but I know how hard I fought and clawed for every inch I gained.
    -back to you..

    -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

  • RedhorseWoman


    This post is wonderful! Thank you. I've had this same feeling for quite some time, but I doubt that I could have ever expressed it as well as you just did.

    It seems that the more you look into things, the more you find that everything is in shades of gray. We all need to decide where we fit in the spectrum of the universe.

    I think I'm getting there. I know that I have found more peace and contentment in not knowing everything as a certainty, but rather by letting things unfold at their own pace. I no longer try to force events to fit my perception of "truth", but rather let the events shape my perception.

    Thank you again for this post.

  • Frenchy

    Thank you, Red, and you're welcome. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could have a 'religion' with that sort of attitude? Wouldn't it be great to belong to a group that is more interested in the individuals rather than the group? ...More interested in helping each other discover God and his purposes as they relate to each other rather than the self perpetuation of the religion itself? ...More interested in principles than dogmatic rules? ...More forgiving than condemning? One with the attitude of whoever is not against us is with us rather than whoever is not among us is our (and God's) enemy?
    Wouldn't it be wonderful to have counselors rather than policemen? Wouldn't it be marvelous to be taught by knowledgeable men who have more compassion than knowledge? ...With the attitude of: It appears to me to be this way...but what do you think? Or, I think that you are in error but then who am I to judge? Who would not want to be part of something like that? How often I have wished for such open, honest communication.
    I heard a District Overseer (extremely kind and humble man) say once at an assembly: "My wife and I pray for all of you every day, will you pray for us?" Why can't we have that? It breaks my heart to think of how it could be and what it has become.
    I am perhaps harsh on the WTS. If I am it's because I expected so much of them. There was such a wonderful prospect that finally there was a place where love reigned, where social and economic status meant nothing, a place where racism did not exist, where all men and women were the children of God and were all brothers and sisters. ...A place where the strong helped the weak rather than abuse them...a place where the knowledgable taught the lowly one rather than ridicule them. ...a place where everyone was your friend.
    Was that truly too much to ask? Is this beyond human ability? Is it too much to ask? Could not a group of people like that come together? I can’t help but feel that is what we all want but have settled for far less. To me paradise is not a place without problems but rather a place where the problems are solved by those living there to each other’s mutual benefit.

    -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

  • Roamingfeline


    Thank you from the bottom of my pea-picking heart for that wonderful post. It was truly one of the best posts I've ever seen on ANY of the boards I frequent, bar none!

    I can always count on you to show great insight into the human condition. I'm sure glad to have found this forum, thanks to RedHorseWoman!


Share this