Great story, thanks for sharing. Makes you feel sorry for the ones that cannot communicate.
Story caused me to cry tears of joy
by Robdar 17 Replies latest jw friends
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doogie
this reminds me of a headline from the Onion awhile back:
"Koko the Gorilla Now Just Flipping Everybody Off."
glorious creatures, they are.
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jgnat
Oooh, now that Koko has language, I am not so sure she couldn't be fooled in to a cult.
The capacity of hominids to lie is noted early and nearly universally in human development and language studies with Great Apes. One famous lie by the latter was when Koko the Gorilla, confronted by her handlers after a tantrum in which she had literally torn a steel sink out of its moorings, signed in American Sign Language, "cat did it", pointing at her tiny kitten. It is unclear if this was a joke or a genuine attempt at blaming her tiny pet.
Another version of the story, and the one I remember:
On another occasion, Koko, who had just tipped the scales at 90 pounds, sat on the kitchen sink and it sank about 2 inches. Not knowing how it had happened, I asked Koko, "Did you do that?" and Koko signed "Kate there bad," pointing to the sink. Kate, my deaf assistant who had witnessed the incident, defended herself by explaining the situation.
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Robdar
I respect the advances of science immensly, but in a way, I think the scientific model of viewing the world also has negative effects on how people think about and interact with the environment. It's easy to objectify and exploit the things that you don't feel have the capability to interact with you.Hopefully studies like this will cause a shift in thinking and actions.
Cic, your post was beautifully written. Thank you.
i'm jealous of a gorilla... she gets dental care and i dont lol
LOL, me too. Maybe it's a perk for being an endangered species?
Makes you feel sorry for the ones that cannot communicate.
LOL Sally. Not to worry. If they are like any of the apes I used to see at the zoo, they are quite able of expressing themselves.
this reminds me of a headline from the Onion awhile back:
"Koko the Gorilla Now Just Flipping Everybody Off."
glorious creatures, they are.
Hehehehehehe, thanks for the laugh!
confronted by her handlers after a tantrum in which she had literally torn a steel sink out of its moorings, signed in American Sign Language, "cat did it", pointing at her tiny kitten. It is unclear if this was a joke or a genuine attempt at blaming her tiny pet.
JG, I love that story-- no matter which one is the accurate one. Thanks for sharing.
Robyn
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zanex
ok..as the resident xjw with a lifetime of REAL American Sign Language on my record I feel as though I should say something to this article..I read the same article in the online news today and to be honest was NOT impressed...I have been signing 99%percent of my life and have deaf parents and for someone to call the language that I use (ASL) the bridging link between myself and monkeys?! I appreciate the communication with animals thing but seriously...the monkey was taught a set of BASIC HANDSHAPES the monkey was NOT taught ASL....ASL is much more than "my tooth hurts and hurts alot" sorry...this ruffled me a bit the wrong way...Deaf people have been fighting for YEARS to get publicity for their language and one day a freakin MONKEY says that her tooth hurts and all of a sudden national headlines? oh man...anywayz...
(little ruffled son of deaf adults zanex)
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jgnat
zanex, as an ASL student, I see Koko's accomplishment differently. Her grammar is correct for ASL, I believe (object-subject-verb). For many years, people have tried to "humanize" animals by teaching them to "speak", ignoring that their vocal cords and muzzle structure prevents them from pronouncing language.
Since Koko does far more than repeat standard phrases, but recombines sign for new ideas, she proves that she is capable of language. ASL is a full blown language with its own syntax and structure. Koko is doing far more than signalling.
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Robdar
Zanex,
This post was meant as informative fluff to help spread cheer on a Monday morning. Honestly, I don't understand why you are so angred by it.
As far as I know, Helen Keller brought world wide attention to your parents' cause over a hundred years ago. ASL is counted as a second language course in college. The waiting list to learn ASL with private groups can be up to 2 years--or that's what a woman I work with said. I guess she would know since she is married to a deaf guy. Books teaching ASL are available at Barnes and Noble and other stores. It would appear to me that most of the world is knowlegable about the deaf and and sign language.
Perhaps one reason that society gets all excited about Koko learning sign language is because it's an ape doing it. Scientists used to think that humans are the only ones with a brain capable of complex communication through signing and language. Koko has proven this theory to be wrong. She has changed the way that we will look at animals in the future. She has changed the way that animals will be treated. She has also brought attention to the deaf and ASL--which can only be a good thing.
If you can't see the reason that everybody is excited and wish to be upset by a nice story, that is your prerogative. I hope that you will have a better evening.
Robyn
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zanex
sigh...still I see the pride that people take when using the sign language for communication between man and animal not enough of a reason to get weepy and teary eyed...I suppose my perception is much different...I recall years of incredible oppression and total "control" by those hearing ones who had the money to make any changes. I remember the lack of publicity when dorms for schools for the deaf were being closed down. I remember the fight it took for closed captioning to become a legal mandate...I remember the year deaf protesters/students took over a college campus in protest of invalid leadership..I do not recall these things because of the enormous television reaction but because I was close to such things. American Sign Language has been around for a long long time and it still bothers me when those things that are televised or nationally promoted are either things to do with repair or fixative measures of deaf and hard of hearing or communication gaps being bridged with animals...
I am sorry if I came off as angry...im not angry just frustrated...I work in a deaf agency and I see so much ignorance and the "eh I dont care" attitude a great deal when it comes to communication with the deaf at large but yet I imagine all that money being spent on those monkeys is being "well spent". I do understand the need for scientific research and I do applaud the usage of multiple communication styles with varying species but I just wish that we could take care of our OWN species first...I do apologize for coming off as angst-ridden as I must sound...this one hits a little close to home...
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