Back to Russell Need help.

by Gordy 11 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Gordy

    I've come across a guy who was a JW, but has now become a "Dawn Bible Student" , that is he now follows Charles Taze Russell's teachings.

    He swears by Russells six volumes of Studies in the Scripture" and writings.

    I've tried pointing our Russells views on the Great Pyramid, Christ coming in 1874, Armageddon in 1914, Masonic connections etc. All the usual things about Russell.

    Yet I seem to be getting nowhere with him. He seems to think he has found the "real truth" and that the JW's have distorted Russells teachings.

    Anyone any ideas or points I could raise with him.

  • logansrun

    Ask him to get you some Miracle Wheat for breakfast.


  • dustyb

    hehe, the miracle wheat that'll clean you out better than an aenima....

  • Euphemism

    LOL @ logan and dusty!

    Gordy... my question would be, why do you feel the need to change your friend's mind? Is this Dawn group controlling your friend or harming his life, the way the Witnesses do? And if not, then what does it matter if he decides to follow a somewhat odd and out-of-date religion?

  • hooberus

    Russell denied the bodily resurrection of the man Jesus Christ. John 2:19-22, Acts 17:31, 1 Timothy 2:5

  • TD

    I don't know why you would want to change his mind, as the the Dawn Bible Students are innocuous. They also do not suffer from the doctrinal rigidity that renders the JW belief system fragile. (In other words, there probably isn't a single card you can yank out that will bring the house down.)

    Although Russell certainly had his faults, much of the information you will read on the internet about him is either distorted, speculative or just plain wrong. If you approach a knowledgeable Bible Student with the usual "Masonic connection" "Pyramidology" and "Miracle Wheat" crap, he is the one that will cut you down to size, not the other way around.

    The "Masonic connection" is purely speculative, the fascination with pyramids was not out of place, given the time period and certainly not a backbone of Russell's eschatology. Russell also appears to have acted in good faith regarding the Miracle Wheat. Although it turned out to be embarassing we can't reasonably argue today that it was his fault that the strain turned out to be a "sport." (In other words, the vigorous growth lasted for only a generation or two.) This phenomenon has embarassed many horticulturalists since then.

  • Valis
  • little witch
    little witch

    TD, although I agree that Russell is the lesser of the two evils, let's not defend the bumbling fool. I mean, he was responsible for starting the whole disaster that is jehovahs witnesses after all.

  • TD

    You and I know that, little witch, but it doesn't cut any ice with one who has taken up with the Dawn Bible Students. They think they are the rightful successors of Russell and that Joseph Rutherford was the true father of the Jehovah's Witnesses.

  • Carmel


    Just goes to show that even Russell was capable of a little scholarship!


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