'couldn't be done without the holy spirit' is the phrase that I have seen spouted by loyal dubbies. No Doubt appearing subtly or explicitly in one or more of the Watch Tower publications.
I'm wondering, if you could think back to when you were preaching, especially if you were pioneering, WHAT were your personal motivating factors, what did you tell yourself, and was there a source of that suggestion? And at the present, what do you see to be the motivating factors as dictated by the Watch Tower for the Witnesses you know/in general?
Did the Watch Tower ever imply subtly or outright that your righteousness before Jehovah was in some way or in a large way dependant on your performance?
Was it espoused that the fact that the JW's had a high preaching rate was is proof of the "true religion" in any publications you can recall? They're the only ones obeying the commandment of Matt 24:14???? Did you rather grand to be part of all that?? Like you were a walking talking fulfilment of prophecy?
As far as I can tell any and all "good works" that can be done are...preaching! Is the Watch Tower good at mentioning the REAL "good works" such as taking care of widows orphans, caring for the needy, or did you feel that this was the "good works" the Bible talks about on account of the Watch Tower?
To what degree do you feel that your personal door to door was compulsory?
Would you have preached as much or even at all if you were not just so sure of the promise that the 'new system' was just round da corner?
Did you feel in any way afraid that your future in paradise erf depended on your diligence in the preaching effort?
How big of a motivation for you was fear? Guilt? Pressure?
When I listened to Lorri Macgregors testimony online, she said something to the effect of "if I didn't think that Armageddon was coming each day, I would NOT have preached, I could not" Was this similar to your feelings?
How big of a factor would you say was the immenency 'probly be tomorrer' of Armageddon in going out and preaching??
Looking back now, were you doing it at the time out of pure joy and love for God and man? Were you just made to believe so because that's were how the Watch Tower put it? Do you see now you were fooling yourself sort of psychologically? Or can you see now that other factors like I've already asked here were at all involved?
How big of a motivator was the message of Jesus' D,B,&R for you? Did the Watch Tower offer this as encouragement for preaching???
Finally,,,, HOW often is/was preaching "encouraged" in the books, magazines, weekly meetings, by your JW relatives, friends, and what did that encouragement consist of? From what I can figger, it seems almost like passive psychological terrorism, just beating that drum....calling those who were not as active or are not "spiritually weak" .....phrasing rhetorical questions designed it seems to induce guilt "Don't we want to demonstrate our gratefulness for Jehovah's wonderful coming provision" or something of that nature...and many more...
Did I miss anything?
thanks in advance to everyone who responds!
What Galvanizes the Preaching in Most Witnesses? What Did it For You?
by Myxomatosis 7 Replies latest jw friends
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Myxomatosis
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mouthy
I preached even though I didnt think I would get the prize. The scriptures say your forgiven a multitude of sin if you turn one sinner back. I had a multitude be fore the witness came to my door. So I thought I would do the best I could to "cover my butt" so to speak. But I used to tell Jehovah I never wanted anything in return- just to serve him & give others the chance to have the paradise promised.... Then the brothers? would stress how close it was- so I worked real hard -made 10 people JWs...I felt it was a nessesary thing to do. after all I didnt want folks to die!!!!! Yes I was under a real Mind job!!!! they taught me well. But now I am doing all they taught me to do. Declaring to everyone who will listen to Watch out for the Wolves in Sheep clothing ( otherwise named Jehovahs Witnesses,.
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Flowerpetal
Growing up as a kid in the '50's, the message I got was we don't know when Armageddon was coming...so whenever I saw the sky look strange, and there was a bad storm, I thought this might be Armageddon. Needless to say, it scared me, because I wondered if I was worthy to be saved--because I knew God knew my thoughts, and they weren't always nice.
When I was a teenager in the '60's not every year but some years, I "vacation pioneered" during summer vacation from school just for a month though. My partner for one year became a great friend because we worked together so much. I was even in her wedding in 1969.
I preached because I thought that was the thing to do, to help people get to know about the Bible's promises which I still believe in, paradise earth included, because I believe humans were created to live forever, on this earth or at least a very long time; except I don't accept the societies chronology of counting time. So I suppose I did it out of love--I wanted people to know life wasn't going to be so stressful or always full of problems. I also want to say, I enjoy being a human being and I enjoy all the pleasures of being a human.
I believe a whole lot more has to happen and I really don't believe the end is going to happen the way the society teaches. I can't say what Armageddon is going to be which means I don't agree with the teaching of it by the society.
I agree that good works also means helping those less fortunate than yourself--without conditions. The WT did not focus on Jesus death, burial and resurrection as much, but now I have been seeing more of an emphasis on Jesus, hopefully because of some members of the writing department. I was told once by someone that there is dissention among members of the writing dept. Some want to concentrate more on Jesus and the kingdom, while others want to emphasize the organization.
I would not use "works" in connection with JWs but PERFORMANCE, I believe that is a better word. The emphasis of "do more, do more, do more" is associated with PERFORMANCE more than works.
Hope I answered some of your questions!
Even though I don't agree with all the teachings of the WTS as I used to, I still feel I am a spiritual person and still have faith in God and his Son.
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jws
I think it was a combination of a lot of things. Growing up, I never wanted to do it. I can't ever remember ever getting up and being excited. I always felt forced to do it. If ANYTHING else was available, I'd rather be doing that. Then, somewhere in my early 20's I actually put in the time of an aux-pioneer for something like 7 months.
I think it was a mixture of things. The kids in the hall went through a drinking phase and somehow, my brother and I (newest transfers into this hall from another) wound up scapegoats and with a bad reputation. Part of it was possibly to try to show them I had changed. Some of it was dating a JW girl and trying to prove myself there. Part of it was probably trying to force myself to like it. I believed in the JWs and this was an integral part of it. If I was going to stay a JW, I'd either have to find a way to like it or secretly be miserable the rest of my life. I suppose some of it was to try to earn favor with God. As my mom had passed away a few years earlier and I wanted to see her again and felt like my life had gone off course for a while and any slim hopes I probably had of making it into the New World were gone.
Was any of it for the "right" reasons? I don't think so. Like, was I trying to get the word out to people and save them? I don't think I really cared. It was about the hours. Because of my past problems with the drinking with the other kids, they didn't let me "aux pioneer", officially, but I always put in the hours. And I did it outside of their system too. I went out with a reg pioneer I knew from high school who lived across town in a less uptight area of the city. I'd go to his neighborhood to get my hours in. So I don't know if they didn't believe I was getting the hours in that they wouldn't recognize me as an "aux" or what. I told myself I didn't care. It wasn't between them and me and titles didn't count. Titles within the hall count, of course. And it did bother me at first, but after a while, I was actually a bit proud that I didn't get their sanction.
Now I'm so glad that I don't ever have to go knocking on doors except trick-or-treating with the kids.
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PurpleV
My mother dragged me kicking and screaming.
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Myxomatosis
Mouthy:I preached even though I didnt think I would get the prize. The scriptures say your forgiven a multitude of sin if you turn one sinner back. I had a multitude be fore the witness came to my door. So I thought I would do the best I could to "cover my butt" so to speak. But I used to tell Jehovah I never wanted anything in return- just to serve him & give others the chance to have the paradise promised.... Then the brothers? would stress how close it was- so I worked real hard -made 10 people JWs...I felt it was a nessesary thing to do.
Myx: So as a Witness you felt it necessary since the end was so near and you wanted to give others a chance to be in paradise, though you yourself felt unworthy??? Did they ever tell you not to worry, whoever has the Son has the Father, and their is no work that you can do to "earn" it? Did they stress His Mercy?? Or would you often worry that Jehovah was just ticking up all those times you'd been a naughty Mouthy? Sort of waiting to pounce on your faults and shortcomings if you will?? and you netted 10! Are they all still good Dubs too?
Mouthy: after all I didnt want folks to die!!!!! Yes I was under a real Mind job!!!!
Myx: lol! Was that a driving factor? It seems like the Watch Tower, in all its caniving ways does very well in preying on the good peoples good hearts. Another reason why I detest it. Oh, and also peoples trust and hope, that so soon God will set up this kingdom which you can live forever on...no more hurt.
Mouthy: they taught me well. But now I am doing all they taught me to do. Declaring to everyone who will listen to Watch out for the Wolves in Sheep clothing ( otherwise named Jehovahs Witnesses,.
Myx: rock and roll.
Flowerpetal
I preached because I thought that was the thing to do, to help people get to know about the Bible's promises which I still believe in, paradise earth included, because I believe humans were created to live forever, on this earth or at least a very long time; except I don't accept the societies chronology of counting time. So I suppose I did it out of love--I wanted people to know life wasn't going to be so stressful or always full of problems. I also want to say, I enjoy being a human being and I enjoy all the pleasures of being a human.
Myx: Would you have preached if you didn't think that the 'new system' was so close, so that others might share in this promise by coming into the 'visible organization'??
Somethings about Paradise earth in the way the Watch Tower has made it not only perplex me but really disturb me. It's in the way the Witnesses talk about it I s'pose. I don't know how else to put it, but it seems that they have the people on "paradise" earth separate from God and Jesus...like they are still off in the heavens while these new people are inhabiting a pretty earth simply with other humans. They are living forever APART from the bridegroom and the Heavenly Father. First, I think that to have a reward and not be able to dwell in the presence of the one you have served, to not be in the presence of the Christ and the Father for all time, is quite UNrewarding. I think if anything God wants us to BE WITH HIM. Otherwise why did He send His Son? I wouldn't be a very happy bride if my beloved who I had trusted believed and worked on account of was off somewhere with just a very small number of 'anointed'...I'd probably prefer to be near Him...
Besides, in an orthodox fashion one could very well look at the supposed "paradise" and if separation everlasting, though you would be in a very lovely place with very lovely people, one could rightly compare this to Hell ...without the figurative descriptives. In its essence, Hell as it is thought, would be, separation FROM God...I see the same thing be happily purported as a paradise by the WT. The other thing is time, It looks as if the 'paradise' expected is still functioning on a four-D plane, with organic life and matter. I would not say that a new earth is not possible or in the works, we won't know til we die. But the WT in its essence is to me encapsuled in the word 'manmade'. I think it's Rutherfords farce.
FP: I would not use "works" in connection with JWs but PERFORMANCE, I believe that is a better word. The emphasis of "do more, do more, do more" is associated with PERFORMANCE more than works.
Myx: very good. The reason I asked this was so I wouldn't shoot my mouth off to Witnesses I encounter who if they will talk to me at all will likely bring up the preaching effort. (I have the idea 'the end is so near' rhetoric and constant spoken 'encouragement' from the WT and congregation...seems there's more to it :) I'm trying to understand so I can direct their attention to WHY that is in a way that even if they deny, they'll perhaps have to admit to themselves!?
btw, FlowerPetal, how long have you been out?
thanks so much for your response!!
Myxomatosis -
BluesBrother
Most witnesses? I bet the reasons are as many as their are witnessses. Some , mostly women I must say, seem to really enjoy it. They love meeting new people and talking, talking ..talking.
Personally , I found it really hard. I took it as an essential part of the package. I enjoyed the study, the meetings ,the talks and association and the future hope. So I just put up with it, as a necessary thing to do in order to enjoy the rest
I felt guilty because I did not feel enough care for the people on the doors, but carried on anyway. I took heart from 1 Cor 9.16..17 "Woe is me if i did not declare the good news. If I perform this willingly I have a reward, but if I do it against my will, all the same I have a stewardship entrusted to me.
Somebody said that this showed that if we did it unwillingly , Jehovah appreciated it all the more
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mustang
Basically, all I ever got out of the preaching was numbness and a "something ain't right" feeling. It wasn't natural.
Following the tenets of the religion, it seemed logical to just keep doing it. But, I later figured out that was a matter of "insufficient data". There didn't seem to be any choice. And part of that was financial dependency on my parents. So, pressure was the motivation.
So, I drifted away without any real confrontation or even expressing any distinct objections at the time.
What seemed most telling was later when I rediscovered the scriptures that "some were given as teachers, some as evangelizers, some as this & some as that...". That hit a "resonant chord" with me.
Certainly my father was given as an evangelizer. He was overjoyed to stir others, poke and prod them. That is still the case. :(
Me? I DEFINITELY WAS NOT "GIVEN AS AN EVANGELIZER". I have done all the preaching that I ever will do. I don't see that any more is required of me. I might gripe and talk to others about it, as a negative reaction, but there will be no more formal witnessing/preaching/whatever.
I became an Engineer. Was this "calling" in the Bible? No, but so be it.
In other words I do not believe the JW Doctrine of "CLERGY/LAITY DISTINCTION".
Being the Laity is just fine with me.
"What, they don't have a Laity Class???"
"That's even better!!! I've found my niche."
Mustang