Hello from an exmormon

by Cold-Dodger 35 Replies latest jw friends

  • Listener
    Listener

    Welcome Cold Dodger.

    What a coincidence....or was it??? :) I was just looking at an ex Mormon Forum yesterday to get some idea of what sort of issues an ex Mormon faces.

    What stood out to me was how the problems that leaving or not supporting the Mormon teachings effect the family, particularly marriage partners. It seems that it has the same effect as it does within the JW religion. It tears them apart so often. The partner that wants to remain in the religion seems to be the one that is responsible for initiating separation and divorce in most cases. Given that they are supposed to be the spiritually strong one it demonstrates that the religion is more cultish and entrapping than it is christian.

    Within the JW religion there are two separate classes, with there being two hopes. There is one class that believe they are anointed and have a heavenly hope when they die, they will then become Kings and Priests. Before around the year 1935 all JWs were of this class and they teach that there will only be 144,000 in it. As the number of JWs grew the President at that time decided to create this second class who have an earthly hope of everlasting life. They strongly encourage JWs to consider themselves as being of the earthly class. Today there are approximately 12,000 who call themselves anointed. It is quite mysterious as to how individuals know they are anointed but the leaders at the top, called the Governing Body (comprising 7 men currently) all claim to be anointed.

    We are so lucky today to have the internet where experiences can be shared and false doctrines are exposed.

  • Heartsafire
    Heartsafire

    Cold dodger,

    I really enjoyed your post and found it fascinating.

    To fulfill your request, I must say that growing up within the JW religion can be quite stressful. There is a lot of guilt and fear involved such as fear that God will kill you at Armageddon if you don't follow his rules and preach. And, if you don't preach when you have the opportunity to do so, then God will kill those who did not get the message at Armageddon, and you will be blood guilty. So, there is a lot of guilt when it comes to not doing all you can do 100% all of the time as a JW.

    Like Mormons, JWs can overdo it with the cheerfulness especially when it comes to finding new recruits. People who showed any interest in the message were fawned and gushed over. Typically people we met in the ministry were reasonably kind and would simply say, "No thank you," if they were uninterested in the message. However, there was sometimes a very upset person and they would yell, cuss, or challenge us. JWs believe any opposition to the message is from the devil and is "persecution," which is actually a sign to a JW that they are doing something right and making God happy.

    Of course (in the US) there was the awkwardness of not saluting the flag, not standing for the national anthem, not celebrating birthdays or holidays, not toasting a drink, nor saying "bless you" to a person who sneezes, etc. that made having a social life outside of the org a real challenge. All witnesses, including children, are taught that anyone who isn't a JW is "worldly" and is to be completely avoided unless they want to study the Bible with you.

    The JW religion has really changed quite a bit in "new light", preaching methods, and other ways from the days when I was young. Heck, even the last few years I would venture to say the org as a whole has morphed quite a bit with its new dot org website, literature carts, and Internet broadcasts. The guilt and fear hasn't changed one bit though.

  • joe134cd
    joe134cd
    Will reply to this later.
  • cofty
    cofty

    Hi cold-dodger welcome. It's great to hear the similarities with a different faith group.

  • joe134cd
    joe134cd

    You certainly made some valid points that many JWs could identify with. Funnily enough it has only been since I left the JWs that I started to look into the LDS faith. For two religious organisations that are doctrinally and theologically world's apart. Structurally, organizationally, how they behave, and the issues they are facing going into the future (e.g internet, membership retention, obvious doctrinal flaws) they are exactly the same. If I could sum up the two religions in a sentence it would be "Mormons are more fanciful in their beliefs but JWS are far more dangerous. For example the book of Abraham, the Kinderhook plates and the recent DNA testing of American Indians are just 3 examples that would make 1914 look quite believable. But despite this however I do believe the Mormon church has and will out perform the jws. They have pushed education, they have encouraged children, have been more accepting of technology, and have been more open about disclosing the church's sorted past and a convicted fraudster. As far as the jws are concerned the Mormon church would be decades ahead in been open and transparent. I do admire the church for this and I think going into the future this will serve them well.

  • FayeDunaway
    FayeDunaway

    Loved your post, CD. Thanks for that. I have always had a particular vitriol towards Mormons... Then I figured out it was my own frustration with myself being raised a JW,...venting against Mormons was sort of an indirect outlet!! So many similarities, yet discussing how WEIRD and what a CULT mormons were was a favorite pastime!!

    Did you really believe 6 kids gets your family your own planet?? And can a man say his wife's secret name to ensure her salvation??

  • Splash
    Splash

    Hey CD, nice to see you here.

    When I was growing up I had a next door neighbour family who were Mormon. I thought them a little bit odd for not drinking the same drinks as I did, after all, what's wrong with a cup of tea?

    Then my neighbour had some work done on his driveway and his Mormon friends came to help. I was actually very impressed. They were friendly to me, competent, and just doing this thing for their friend made an impression on me.

    Later in life you can't believe how superior I felt when some Mormons called on my door.
    There were three witness families in my street and these two men had randomly called on every one.
    When they told me that I asked "What do you think God is trying to tell you?" How arrogant and pompous!

    1914 is THE key date for JW's. All of the 'the end is coming soooon' fear mongering and all of the 'you must obey the Governing Body (the top 7 men in New York)' manipulation come from this date.

    The trouble is for them, it's looking more and more distant and irrelevant.

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    Welcome Cold-Dodger! Thank you for sharing some of your story. Were you born-in to the Mormon religion? It seems many born-ins leave their religion when it doesn't hold up to scrutiny. I would be an example of that re: JWs although technically, I was never a formal JW as I never got baptized. I was certainly raised in it though.

    The JW belief that 'Armageddon is coming soon' is rather embarrassing. Over 100 years is not 'soon' or 'imminent', nor 'closer than the inside of your eyelids'. And their shunning of disfellowshipped and others, as well as their blood doctrine has hurt many. I lost a cousin because she refused a blood transfusion. She left behind a husband and 3 children.

    We tell them that these feelings mean the Book of Mormon is true and Joseph Smith was a true prophet of God.

    Just to be clear, Joseph Smith was a fraudster but I am not sure many Mormon's are aware of that. Why would God pick someone with this type of lowbrow morals as one of his prophets? And the golden tablets/plates... where are they?

    anyone who doesn't pull their wait and do exactly as they are told is a shame to themselves and treated accordingly by the most Puritanical religious society you have ever been a part of.

    In JW world, you are called 'a weak Witness' and are typically 'shepherded' by the elders when this occurs. If you persist in being an issue, they will disfellowship you - aka kick you out, label you 'Disfellowshipped' and possibly 'Apostate', and shun you. My uncle was disfellowshipped in the early 1990s. I am not sure why but I suspect he didn't agree with some doctrine. He was reinstated after the elders that kicked him out got kicked out themselves. There seem to be a lot of politics in this religion.

    When I was little, my Mom was the one who was more strong in the faith than my Dad. He wasn't a big fan of religion at all. The JW religion was introduced to the family in the 1950s when my maternal grandfather converted from being a Catholic to a JW. The JW hardbound yearly volumes/books in my parent's bookcase start at 1960. We were kind of 'fringe' JWs when I was a kid. We still celebrated the holidays and us kids did mostly normal kid things like play sports and go to movies etc. We didn't go to the Hall except for the Memorial and I only remember going a couple of times. I think my Dad's disdain of religion kept a more even keel in our household when I was young. It wasn't until me and my brothers grew up and left home that our parents decided to become 'zealous' and get 'dedicated' (aka baptized) as JWs. Things were rather rough after that as they became mean-spirited and holier-than-thou towards us on many occasions.

    Children have built in BS meters. As I got older, mine kept going off. For example, the JW claim that they are preaching to all the inhabited Earth. The math just didn't add up. There just aren't enough JWs compared to the world's population for them to be doing this. This is still true today.

  • LoisLane looking for Superman
    LoisLane looking for Superman

    Hello C-D,

    Ancestry.com is a Mormon site. As a Mormon, do you get a cut rate?

    My cousin was a Jack Mormon. Her husband was an Elder. She kept the booze under the kitchen sink and always had her coffee in the morning. When she died, she was dressed in a white gown and a bonnet with a veil that was drawn over her face as a bride waiting in death until her husband died so they could be together forever in heaven. Before she died, she could hardly stand the sight of her husband. Don't know how that marriage in heaven thingy is going to work out for her and him. (???)

    Did you wear the magic underwear? I never knew that about the Mormon's otherwise I probably would have asked my cousin. She was given to sexy everything so I really doubt she wore them.

    I would like to know about Mormon discipline of children. JDub children are expected to be quiet. For a child to fuss, is like showing that the parents have not taught the child correctly (as in they haven't completely broken their child's spirit yet). Is it normal to hear children howling from spankings given in the bathrooms at the Mormon Temple?

    All the best to you in your life's journey.

    LoisLane

  • Truthexplorer
    Truthexplorer

    Hi Cold Dodger,

    I really enjoyed your post. In many ways we are similar to Mormons in that we too are UNDER CONTROL by a few men.

    You asked the following

    Tell me about what it is like growing up as a Witness. What is family life like? What are JW parents typically like? Share the culture with me and also, what is it like becoming a member of the JW church?

    I can tell you from my own experience what it is like to become a JW. My mother became one when I was 16. She used to speak to me about all the bad things happening etc and being young and impressionable would chat with her about the bible etc. When I was 23 I made a decision to have a bible study. I was living in London at the time. I absolutely 100% thought I had the truth. I couldn't stop talking about my beliefs. At work, at home etc....I was an absolute zealot for about a year plus. I gave up my good paying job and moved back to my hometown where I earned peanuts doing menial work. But hey I had the truth!!!

    However, the honey moon period soon wore off. It began when an elder pulled me aside and mentioned to me that brothers didnt grow beards. At first I was annoyed him telling me in other words to shave it off. But, being humble and actually then thought it was scriptural. I did a lot of reading into it and towed the WT BS line and followed the principle on grooming.

    Being in a small congregation and constantly being indoctrinated with bad associations spoil useful habits, I didnt go out on the town with worldly friends. I dropped them all like hot potato. Oh btw. JW's do not have any groups in place to cater for children, young people etc. It is left to the individuals in each hall to do that, which on the whole is on rare occasions. So as you can imagine. Week in and week out, I was stuck at home, whilst all my old pals were going out and having a good social life. From the age of 23 till now (in my 40's), I cant say I had much of a social life. Yes the brothers organised a few get together s, some bbqs, walks, cheile dances etc which were great, but they were too far and few between.

    As a result, I ended up drinking at home and have done so ever since. I was reluctant to get baptised as was beginning to see the control aspect and wanted my social life back. I told my mother that I didnt want to get baptised as felt I was jumping straight in. This was a few weeks before I was to be baptised. BTW JW's also do everything they can to bag a baptism....just like the Mormons ie love bombing etc.

    One very early morning, I was having a lie in. It was about 9.30am. The brother who studied with actually came to our door. My mother explained to him that I didnt feel ready for baptsim. He persuaded her to come in and then came into my bedroom whilst I was in bed and stood there for an hour debating with me about how baptism is the right thing. Its Satan that is putting you off...this was expected blah blah blah. In the end I foolishly gave in and 2 weeks later was baptised.

    After 12 more depressing months, I decided to move back to London. I hated being a JW in a small town having no social life whatsoever.. When I got to London, I went back to my old hall expecting the same attention I got before my baptism and at least have a semi normal social life which I always considered important. It was like being in a hornets nest. The hall was full of regular and baptised pioneers (basically anyone doing 40 plus hours a month in the ministry. It was full of cliques. If you were shy, timid, or weren't out in the ministry very often, you were considered week. Someone who only gave a token service to Jehovah. An expression very often used at our meetings and book study. Again, I rarely got any invites to social occasions, despite the fact I was in a very large hall.

    That time in my life was hell. I fell into a deep depression, because I never felt good enough. I thought Jehovah had pushed me aside and was going to be destroyed at Armageddon. I got no practical help from the elders when I was needing some kind of support in dealing with tenancy matters. Just told to go out in the ministry etc

    Once you are baptised....like yourselves, you are suddenly someone or no one. If you are out in the ministry all the time, or become a pioneer, ministerial servant, Elder....you are someone. You are no one....if not seen to be doing works.

    It also depends on the hall. Some Congregations are very cold, some friendly and warm, some very clique.

    It is only years after you become a JW, like the Mormons, you start to see things that aren't right. We studied a book called 'Revelation...its grand climax at hand' I was looking forward so much to studying this book and on a number of occasions had to conduct the bible study as was ministerial servant at the time. This book was full of what I would call craziness. What struck me most about it was that the society (aka watchtower Org) tried to explain every single scripture away. The obvious scriptures were fine. But when It came to the difficult scriptures and their meaning, they would say this date / books/pamphlets pertained to this or that scripture. I was like thinking....that is nuts!

    Anyway, around about 1999/2000 I began searching the internet as everyone was beginning to get computers. A few years later, I came across this website forum and it was then that my eyes were truly opened. It wasn't just me had all these deep personal thoughts about my religion. Someone on their site mentioned Ray Franz's book Crisis of conscience. He was once a governing body member for many years who was disfellowshipped for eating a meal with a dissociated person. I managed to get the book out of the library and read it twice within a week. I was both shocked and angry whilst reading this book saying to myself...I knew it....it just bloody knew it. All the nagging doubts, all the reasons why I felt the way I did....was in this book.

    Jehovah's Witnesses are a high control religion. I personally do not feel any liberty n Christ as a Jehovah's Witness. Yet as a Christian (which I tell everyone)...I do feel liberty in Christ.

    My family and I still attend the meetings. I now keep a low profile....as it is now more about a social thing funny enough. My wife is very popular and has a huge circle of friends. Despite the delusion they are under, The brothers in my hall are very friendly and it is a very warm congregation. If I were to leave, it would turn my families world upside down.

    So that's pretty much it I guess. Thanks again for sharing your own personal views Cold dodger and wish you all the best.

    My apologies for not saying my name.....but am sure you are likely in the same boat in that you cant be found out, re facing the consequences etc.

    TE


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