Honoring Our Dead

by The Bethelite 8 Replies latest jw friends

  •  The Bethelite
    The Bethelite

    Yesterday, I was driving around on a beautiful fall day in Arizona and thinking about how lucky I was. How my dead friends could never enjoy this day or the thousands of other days they had missed over the years. I'm still alive yet they are gone.....

    Halloween has been a special day for me for 46 years.

    It was on this night 46 years ago that James Olson (the Bethelite) killed himself at the factory at Brooklyn Bethel.

    He was the first Jehovah's Witness I knew of, that took his own life.

    Sadly over the last 46 many more of my friends and family would follow in his foot steps, including my own Father in Law Robert Stillman.

    Their life of guilt and pain was so bad that death was their only option....their only way out!

    I hate this religion and what it has done to people. They are truly blood guilty.

    I miss my friends,

  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    Yes it is a sad and unfortunate fact that the JWS religious cult has indirectly caused so many suicides.

  • LV101
    LV101

    Tragic -- how many deaths! I'd love to see billboards across the globe (the eye buys more than the ear hears but maybe not re/cults). Whatever it takes to get the truth out there.

  • waton
    waton

    TB: not related to the wasted lives, if self terminated or not, that you mentioned. but

    you in Arizona will in 11 days have a special, unusual occasion honouring the useless death of the world wars.

    On 11- 11 at 11 am will be the 2 minute silence marking the 101 anniversary of the end of the killing in Europe.

    for you it will also be the last 2 minutes of the transit of Mercury, a very slight darkening of the Sun.

    Lesson 101: remember the futile death. and lives.

  • WingCommander
    WingCommander

    RIP: Jimmy Olsen.

  • Simon
    Simon
    Their life of guilt and pain was so bad that death was their only option....their only way out!
    I hate this religion and what it has done to people. They are truly blood guilty.

    Or they attract people with mental illness, there just seems to be something about religion that does that.

    To put a suicide down to the WTS, I think you need to have a clear causal link to blame them and it not be the persons own outlook on their life.

    I'm not saying the WTS wasn't to blame for their deaths, I just don't know, but just because a JW kills themselves doesn't make it the fault of the WTS.

  •  The Bethelite
    The Bethelite

    "I'm not saying the WTS wasn't to blame for their deaths, I just don't know, but just because a JW kills themselves doesn't make it the fault of the WTS."

    Yes maybe sometimes. But no fault to the watchtower.......really?

    You want to minimize their organizations involvement and let them off the hook for thousands of people's demise. Your right they should have just snapped out of it and realized it was all bull shit and moved on with their lives like we all have done here....nice to say I guess.

    I guess you don't know the same people I have known. Lets see these are some of the people I've known over the years who just should have just "snapped" out of it but decided to kill themselves instead.

    One person who couldn't stand the guilt of leaving Bethel.

    Three people who could not have any contact with all their children and grand children.

    One person who was gay and could not live guilt.

    Two people who left the organization but still believed it was real and killed themselves before god could.

    How about the hundreds of people who have killed themselves because of refusing a blood transfusion? Isn't that really suicide....or do you call this mental illness?

    Your right no big deal....

    PS I don't believe everyone who kills themselves has mental illness.

  • Simon
    Simon
    You want to minimize their organizations involvement and let them off the hook for thousands of people's demise. Your right they should have just snapped out of it and realized it was all bull shit and moved on with their lives like we all have done here....nice to say I guess.

    Read. What. I. Wrote.

    The counter to "letting someone off the hook" is putting someone on the hook to begin with.

    Unless there is evidence that the rate of suicide is statistically significantly higher than comparable groups, then there is no hook.

    Like I said, the WTS sometimes attracts "earnest" people, and sometimes it attracts people with delusional outlooks who should be getting more appropriate help. The sheer number of nuts that are obsessed with biblical stuff that show up on this forum over the years shows there is some correlation between mental illness and religion / belief in the supernatural.

    One person who couldn't stand the guilt of leaving Bethel.

    Which to me suggests they are not entirely balanced.

    Three people who could not have any contact with all their children and grand children.

    Again, it's sad and no doubt added to their mental stress, but to kill yourself over it? This sounds like the people who kill themselves over a relationship failing - is that the fault of the other person?

    One person who was gay and could not live guilt.

    This is actually more understandable if someone had been brought up as a JW, less so if they are one of those weird people who are gay and decide to join a religious group that condemns them for who they are.

    Two people who left the organization but still believed it was real and killed themselves before god could.

    So why did they leave? What else was going on in their life? People don't accidentally believe something, they choose to believe and keep believing because they are too lazy to research and learn some new beliefs instead.

    How about the hundreds of people who have killed themselves because of refusing a blood transfusion? Isn't that really suicide....or do you call this mental illness?

    I don't believe there is a massive number of deaths that are down to purely refusing blood. There are definitely some, and those are tragic, but medical care isn't so perfect that they can always put a death down to one thing. What about all the lives saved by people refusing blood and the WTS life in general? If you want to count the negatives, you have to include the positives as well. This also applies to suicides as I'm sure there are some who might not be here but for the support and fellowship that the religion provided.

    I don't believe everyone who kills themselves has mental illness.

    Again. Read. What. I. Wrote.

    Did I at any point suggest that the WTS influence was never a factor in anyone's suicide? I'm sure they were. But there's a whole range of values between "all" and "none".

  • sparky1
    sparky1

    Keith, keep honoring James Olson's memory. I believe Jehovah's Witness theology, his parents, Bethel Organizational Hierarchy and Max Larsen ' killed ' him. Those who did not know him or his situation would do well not to judge him.

    "We are born involuntarily, to please (or displease) others. That is what makes dying voluntarily the ultimate freedom." - Thomas Szasz MD

    Pushed into an undesirable life situation by others, I believe he may have taken his own life to show them that ultimately he was in control of his final destiny.

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