by Wolfgirl 8 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
...and the flip-flopping of doctrine when it comes to conscientious objecting. I'm coming up empty. Or rather, I should say, I'm coming up with a bazillion threads about Iraq.
Can someone help me find it? I'm engaged in a "debate" on another board with a few JWs, and it's being closely watched by a lot of people. Thanks.
Bonjour madame,
I'm pushing this bttt because I want answers as well !
Certainly this is not comprehensive but the 1974 shows the old thought, the 1996 the new thought, the 1998 the fallout, and 2001 the most current application of civilian service.
*** g74 12/8 pp. 23-25 The Netherlands Frees Imprisoned Witnesses ***Authorities
Begin to ListenOn March 26, 1971, three representatives of Jehovah?s witnesses met with a forum representing the ministries of Defense and Justice. The discussion lasted two and a half hours.
One of the first points of discussion presented by the forum was this: "That you wish no part in performing military service is clear and needs no further explanation. But what really is your objection to civil, alternative service?"
The Witnesses explained that it is not that they are opposed to civil service as such, but, rather, it is a matter of strict neutrality. Therefore, any work that is merely a substitute for military service would be unacceptable to Jehovah?s witnesses.
Other questions narrowed the issue down still further. "When a person objects to military service," the government?s agents declared, "he passes from military jurisdiction on to civil jurisdiction and from that moment has nothing at all to do with the military. Why, then, is the accepting of such civil service still so objectionable?"
Willingly accepting such work is objectionable to the Christian because of what God?s law says about the matter: "You were bought with a price; stop becoming slaves of men." (1 Cor. 7:23) Civilian servitude as a substitute for military service would be just as objectionable to the Christian. In effect, he would thereby become a part of the world instead of keeping separate as Jesus commanded.?John 15:19; 17:14-16.
The discussion now took a new turn. "What suggestion would you like to give as to the handling of cases involving Jehovah?s witnesses?" the committee asked. The answer: Exemption for the full-time as well as the part-time preachers of the Gospel, as the law provides. It was pointed out that members of certain religious orders in the Netherlands enjoy exemption, yet they do nothing more than live in an institution and brew beer.
The committee voiced its concern over this suggestion by the Witnesses. It feared that this would open the gates for all kinds of persons whose only purpose was to avoid military service. But Jehovah?s witnesses assured the committee that it would be nearly impossible for pretenders to get by the screening process that takes place in the local congregations of the Witnesses.
Parliament
Member Asks QuestionsLess than four months later a witness of Jehovah was sentenced to twenty-one months in prison on the military issue. His lawyer, Mr. Spermon, pleaded the case on the ground that his client was a minister of the Gospel. Then he issued a public statement in which he said, among other things: "Catholic and Protestant theology students obtain exemption from military service as well as alternative civil service simply due to the fact that they attend a recognized theological school. Because Jehovah?s witnesses in the Netherlands do not have a theological college and, moreover, their religion does not enjoy legal recognition as a religious denomination they do not come in line for the possibilities provided for in the law governing conscientious objection."
To this Mr. Spermon added: ?This criterium does not please me much. It reeks too much of the authorities? meddling in the internal matters of church societies. According to the Law on Religious Societies of 1853, the regulation of church society is taboo for the state because that is left up to the religious society itself.??De Tijd, Thursday, July 22, 1971.
These statements triggered off other action. A member of parliament, Mr. D. A. Th. van Ooijen, wrote to the ministers of Defense and Justice, asking: "Are statesmen willing to voice their opinion as to the following statement by Mr. W. Spermon to the Supreme Military Tribunal . . . ?" He then set out the substance of Spermon?s above-quoted statement.
Then the parliamentarian asked other pointed questions: "Is it true that Jehovah?s witnesses in the United States, Sweden and Germany enjoy exemption from military and alternative service if they can provide evidence that they spend a sufficient amount of time in the preaching work?" "Are statesmen willing to expedite matters so that the Law on Church Societies which leaves it up to the church society to determine who should be recognized as its minister of public religious service, also thus applies to the witnesses of Jehovah?"
Now
the Ministry of Defense Takes ActionOn October 25, 1973, the three representatives of Jehovah?s witnesses were sitting at a table with the committee representing the Ministry of Defense. The committee took time to be thoroughly informed on the organizational structure of Jehovah?s witnesses and their procedure in appointing their "full-time ministers."
As this meeting progressed it became quite apparent that internally the Ministry of Defense had already taken steps toward recognizing "full-time ministers" as such. Then, unexpectedly, one of the members of the committee posed the possibility of also exempting those who were preparing to be "full-time ministers." Since it was seemingly only a suggestion, the representatives of Jehovah?s witnesses treated the proposal rather cautiously. However, the committee pursued the subject and even insisted on it.
The result of this meeting was that the Netherlands headquarters of Jehovah?s witnesses was authorized to pass this information on to the congregations. In this way all those preparing for the "full-time ministry" would know of these new developments. From now on, all those in this category would receive indefinite postponement from military and alternative service, pending a final passage of law in this regard.
You can imagine how welcome this good news was after so many years of effort! And it was thought that this would be the end of the matter. But yet another chapter was to be written into the history of the fight for freedom of worship in the Netherlands. On June 11, 1974, the same representatives of Jehovah?s witnesses met with the same committee from the Ministry of Defense. This proved to be the shortest session to date, but one with far-reaching consequences.
On this occasion the Defense representatives announced that in the future all baptized witnesses of Jehovah, on recommendation by the body of elders in their respective congregations, would be exempted from military service pending the definite passage of law. The procedure for handling these cases was then satisfactorily worked out. The plea for exemption in each case, signed by the congregation?s body of elders, would be routed through the branch office of Jehovah?s witnesses. There the signatures of the elders would be certified before being forwarded to the government. In this way the credibility of each plea would be confirmed for the Ministry of Defense.
The Ministry of Justice, in harmony with this decision of the Ministry of Defense, acted quickly by releasing all the Witnesses then imprisoned. Twelve days after the last Witness had been released, on July 31, 1974, people in all parts of the country were surprised to read in their daily papers such headlines as "JEHOVAH?S WITNESSES GO HOME."
The report in one of the newspapers concluded with these remarks: "The Ministry of Defense is working on legislation whereby all of Jehovah?s witnesses who are baptized will be exempted from military service. In anticipation of the processing of this law by the States General all prosecution of objecting Jehovah?s witnesses has been suspended. The Ministry of Justice deemed that under the circumstances it was not just to hold in prison any longer those of their co-members who already had been prosecuted."
So it was that a quarter of a century of struggle for freedom to worship God according to the dictates of one?s own conscience ended with the release of twenty-eight Witnesses. And just in time?a few days before the "Divine Purpose" District Assemblies of Jehovah?s witnesses this past summer in the Netherlands.
We hope and pray that as individuals the men responsible for this wise decision will, in harmony with the Bible?s exhortation, "kiss the son [Jesus Christ]," acknowledging him as earth?s King, and thus come in line to receive of the grand blessings that his glorious Kingdom rule, so near at hand, will bestow on all obedient mankind.?Ps. 2:12.
***
w96 5/1 pp. 19-20 Paying Back Caesar?s Things to Caesar ***Civilian
Service16
However, there are lands where the State, while not allowing exemption for ministers of religion, nevertheless acknowledges that some individuals may object to military service. Many of these lands make provision for such conscientious individuals not to be forced into military service. In some places a required civilian service, such as useful work in the community, is regarded as nonmilitary national service. Could a dedicated Christian undertake such service? Here again, a dedicated, baptized Christian would have to make his own decision on the basis of his Bible-trained conscience.17
It seems that compulsory service was practiced in Bible times. One history book states: "In addition to the taxes and dues exacted from the inhabitants of Judea, there was also a corvée [unpaid labor exacted by public authorities]. This was an ancient institution in the East, which the Hellenistic and Roman authorities continued to maintain. . . . The New Testament, too, cites examples of corvée in Judea, showing how widespread it was. In accordance with this custom, the soldiers pressed Simon of Cyrene into carrying Jesus? cross [torture stake] (Matthew 5:41; 27:32; Mark 15:21; Luke 23:26)."18
Similarly, citizens in some countries today are required by the State or by local authorities to participate in various forms of community service. Sometimes this is for a specific task, such as digging wells or building roads; sometimes it is on a regular basis, such as weekly participation in cleaning up roads, schools, or hospitals. Where such civilian service is for the good of the community and is not connected with false religion or is not in some other way objectionable to the consciences of Jehovah?s Witnesses, they have often complied. (1 Peter 2:13-15) This has usually resulted in an excellent witness and has sometimes silenced those who falsely accuse the Witnesses of being antigovernment.?Compare Matthew 10:18.19
What, though, if the State requires a Christian for a period of time to perform civilian service that is a part of national service under a civilian administration? Here again, Christians must make their own decision based on an informed conscience. "We shall all stand before the judgment seat of God." (Romans 14:10) Christians faced with a requirement of Caesar should prayerfully study the matter and meditate on it. It may also be wise to talk the matter over with mature Christians in the congregation. After this a personal decision must be made.?Proverbs 2:1-5; Philippians 4:5.20
While engaged in such research, Christians would consider a number of Bible principles. Paul said that we must "be obedient to governments and authorities as rulers, . . . be ready for every good work . . . be reasonable, exhibiting all mildness toward all men." (Titus 3:1, 2) At the same time, Christians would do well to examine the proposed civilian work. If they accept it, will they be able to maintain Christian neutrality? (Micah 4:3, 5; John 17:16) Would it involve them with some false religion? (Revelation 18:4, 20, 21) Would performing it prevent or unreasonably limit them from fulfilling their Christian responsibilities? (Matthew 24:14; Hebrews 10:24, 25) On the other hand, would they be able to continue to make spiritual progress, perhaps even sharing in the full-time ministry while performing the required service??Hebrews 6:11, 12.21
What if the Christian?s honest answers to such questions lead him to conclude that the national civilian service is a "good work" that he can perform in obedience to the authorities? That is his decision before Jehovah. Appointed elders and others should fully respect the conscience of the brother and continue to regard him as a Christian in good standing. If, however, a Christian feels that he cannot perform this civilian service, his position should also be respected. He too remains in good standing and should receive loving support.?1 Corinthians 10:29; 2 Corinthians 1:24; 1 Peter 3:16.22
As Christians we will not cease to render "to him who calls for honor, such honor." (Romans 13:7) We will respect good order and seek to be peaceful, law-abiding citizens. (Psalm 34:14) We may even pray "concerning kings and all those who are in high station" when these men are called upon to make decisions that affect our Christian life and work. As a result of our paying back Caesar?s things to Caesar, we hope that "we may go on leading a calm and quiet life with full godly devotion and seriousness." (1 Timothy 2:1, 2) Above all, we will continue to preach the good news of the Kingdom as mankind?s only hope, conscientiously paying back God?s things to God.*** w98 8/15 p. 17 Strengthening Our Confidence in God?s Righteousness *** Feelings of Having Suffered Needlessly
6 In the past, some Witnesses have suffered for refusing to share in an activity that their conscience now might permit. For example, this might have been their choice years ago as to certain types of civilian service. A brother might now feel that he could conscientiously perform such without overstepping his Christian neutrality regarding the present system of things.
7 Was it unrighteous on Jehovah?s part to allow him to suffer for rejecting what he now might do without consequences? Most who have had that experience would not think so. Rather, they rejoice that they had the opportunity of demonstrating publicly and clearly that they were determined to be firm on the issue of universal sovereignty. (Compare Job 27:5.) What reason could anyone have to regret having followed his conscience in taking a firm stand for Jehovah? By loyally upholding Christian principles as they understood them or by responding to the proddings of conscience, they proved worthy of Jehovah?s friendship. Certainly, it is wise to avoid a course that would disturb one?s conscience or that would likely cause others to be stumbled. We can think in this regard of the example that the apostle Paul set.?1 Corinthians 8:12, 13; 10:31-33.
8 In order to please Jehovah, the Jews were required to obey the Ten Commandments and also a wide variety of about 600 additional laws. Later, under the Christian arrangement, obedience to these laws as such was no longer a requirement for serving Jehovah, not even for fleshly Jews. The laws no longer binding included those dealing with circumcision, keeping the Sabbath, offering animal sacrifices, and observing certain dietary restrictions. (1 Corinthians 7:19; 10:25; Colossians 2:16, 17; Hebrews 10:1, 11-14) Jews?including the apostles?who became Christians were released from the obligation to keep laws that they were required to obey when they were under the Law covenant. Did they complain that God?s arrangement was unrighteous in having formerly required of them things that were no longer necessary? No, they rejoiced in the broadened understanding of Jehovah?s purposes.?Acts 16:4, 5.
9 In modern times, there have been some Witnesses who were very strict in their view of what they would or would not do. For that reason they suffered more than others. Later, increased knowledge helped them to expand their view of matters. But they have no reason to regret having earlier acted in harmony with their conscience, even when this possibly brought extra suffering. It truly is commendable that they demonstrated their willingness to suffer in faithfulness to Jehovah, to "do all things for the sake of the good news." Jehovah blesses that kind of godly devotion. (1 Corinthians 9:23; Hebrews 6:10) The apostle Peter wrote with insight: "If, when you are doing good and you suffer, you endure it, this is a thing agreeable with God."?1 Peter 2:20.
*** yb01 p. 55 Asia ***
For nearly 50 years, young Witness men in Taiwan have spent lengthy periods in prison because of their determination to maintain Christian neutrality. In recent years remarkable developments have taken place. Since more men were being drafted than could be effectively trained by the military, it was decided that the laws regarding national service would be adjusted to allow for some of the conscripted manpower to be directed to nonmilitary service. Officials used information on what had been done in other lands to accommodate those whose conscience objected to military service. Conscientious objectors who prefer a government-supervised term of nonmilitary work instead of going to prison must indicate that by filling out an application. Under the new arrangement, those who spend the 33 months doing this type of alternative service will have the weekends and apparently most evenings free, allowing them to participate in spiritual activities.
Other sources:
http://www.freeminds.org/doctrine/civilser.htm
http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/militaryservice.htm
At first I thought you wanted this from the perspective of the military...which made me wonder about "flip-flopping" doctrine. Now I see you want this from the perspective of the Society. Remember...the Witnesses in Mexico who had paid bribes to get their military reserve cards stamped were defacto members of the military.
Wolfgirl ... Are you French ? If yes please PM me !!!
Cause you write english very, very, very well ... (very interested question, sorry but true)
The Watchtower Society seems to be vascillating on this issue primarily because it has been a barrier to their activity in certain countries of the world. Even a slight moderation indicates a change that was unthinkable a few years ago when alternate service was considered "a compromise" by the leadership. Many JWs in the past have been imprisoned or even killed for their "stand" on this issue. Now, it seems that this may have been needless.
We've seen similar small changes in the Watchtower's views on blood. At one time, no blood, fraction or otherwise, was permitted. Now, a list of permitted and forbidden has been posted. In time we may see even more changes.
It is really obscene the way the Watchtower Society has played "games" with people's lives. The Governing Body members sit in their "ivory towers" pontificating while the unfortunate members pay with their lives.
Addendum to Crisis of Conscience (1995). Appendix for Chapter 12: "Perspective"
Many of us think that the key point that can be made about anything to do with the military is the fact that the WTS has owned about 50% of the stock in the Rand Engine Corporation and its sister companies, which make smart drone military planes and drone helicopters. This cancels out any rhetoric they ever put in print on the subject, since they have been knowingly profiting from the sale of military hardware for many years.
Put that in their pipe and tell 'em to smoke it.
Thank you very much, guys. That was a huge help!
Poor kiddos...so far, 3 have run from the topic in fear, 1 in tears, and now they can't think of anything smart to say in reply. I got one, "That's not true!" But when faced with quotes from their own literature (that Quotes site is invaluable) about military service, the UN, Nazi Germany, being prophets, and even the info about blood transfusions in Bulgaria, they've gone from trying to answer me to saying, "This isn't the place for us to witness."
Off to include the Rand info.
Oh, and frenchbabyface...no, I'm not French. I've lived here for a little over a year, and speak French well enough to get by in daily conversation (slowly), but I am American. English at heart, though. My husband is English.
