Abaddon the destroyer is he Jesus?

by ExBethelitenowPIMA 30 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Vidqun

    ExBethelite, no what I mean is, if Satan had control over the keys, as Aqwsed suggests. But according to available evidence, the angel with the keys is as yet unnamed. Yes, it could be Jesus, after he was resurrected (cf. Rom. 10:7).

    And I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to the earth, and the key of the pit of the abyss was given him. (Rev. 9:1 NWT)
    Aqwsed: According to Rev. 12,9, Satan is cast down to earth, and power is given to him to bring about ruin, and Christ Himself sees Satan fall like lightning from heaven (Luke. 10,18). Therefore, the star mentioned here is Satan, so the meaning of the verse is this: The fifth punishment consists in the power given to Satan to release the spirits of hell for the ruin of people.
  • stan livedeath
    stan livedeath

    jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus H christ--what a long--Boring--thread.

  • slimboyfat

    Remember a JW quiz that included the question:

    Abaddon: was he a bad un’ or a good un’? (Meaning was he good or bad) The answer differed based on whether the latest Watchtower said it was Jesus or Satan.

  • EasyPrompt

    Hi @ExBethelitePIMA🙂

    So, in the scriptures, is there only one "abyss"? Do you think the "abyss" the locusts come out of is the same "abyss" that Legion's demons were afraid of going into and it's also the same "abyss" the UN came out of? There's only one "abyss" in the whole universe?

    So, in the scriptures, is there only one set of "keys"? Do you think the keys of the "abyss" are the same as the "keys" of the grave and also the "keys" of the kingdom?

    If Satan has been given all authority on earth, why couldn't he also be given keys over an abyss?

    "So he brought him up and showed him all the kingdoms of the inhabited earth in an instant of time. Then the Devil said to him: “I will give you all this authority and their glory, because it has been handed over to me, and I give it to whomever I wish. If you, therefore, do an act of worship before me, it will all be yours.""

    Revelation shows that the UN comes up out of the abyss. Revelation shows the locusts come up out of the abyss. (It's not the same abyss the demons were afraid of going into.)

    Satan is the ruler of the world. The UN is a government of the world. The locusts are agents of the world.

    Satan is Abaddon, the lord of the locusts of the UN plague on religion.

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA

    Hahaha that’s hilarious I will remember that one.

    They have always said he is a good un?

    I think Watchtower have always said Abaddon was Jesus? Please show me if they ever say he was Satan.

    pretty much every other Bible scholar thinks Abaddon is Satan

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA

    Easy yes you could be right, this is another case where watchtower disagrees with almost everyone else when they say Abaddon is Jesus.

    one translation even says Abaddon came out of the Abyss so that doesn’t sound like Jesus?


    ?NLTTheir king is the angel from the bottomless pit; his name in Hebrew is [Abaddon,] and in Greek, [Apollyon]--the Destroyer

  • EasyPrompt

    The context of the plagues of Revelation is after Jesus gets the throne in heaven.

    Jesus didn't get the throne in 1914, but when he does the great tribulation will begin on earth because the Devil will be cast down. The Devil will get the UN all riled up to attack religion.

    The plagues of Revelation are depicting different "angles" of that attack on religion.

    The WTBT$ says something like that Jesus leading the preaching JWs since 1914 is the locusts, but that can't be because the context shows otherwise.

    In Joel, the locusts were the attacking armies that God allowed as the instrument of his discipline on people who claimed to represent Him but were reproaching His name.

    In Egypt, the locust plague showed the gods of Egypt to be impotent.

    In Revelation, the locust plague of the UN coalition nations attacking religious institutions will show that those religious leaders who want to be worshipped are impotent too.

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA

    Or maybe just maybe, the Bible is a book written by a bunch of men and they all had different ideas.

    Im still agnostic so it could be Gods word or maybe it isn’t.

    Rev 9:11 is a good example of vague cryptic words that don’t translate well and modern humans all have different ideas what it means and what it could all be.

    Watchtower are very arrogant and now they have said that Abaddon is Jesus they are stubbornly sticking to it.

    this really does show the cryptic nature of the scriptures and it can be bent or twisted to suit.

    Watchtower think they are Gods one only channel on earth, and their 8 million followers truly are brainwashed into genuinely believing everything the GBody say without question.

    If they say Abaddon is Jesus and not Satan then that is the end of it, it has been settled and all other Bible scholars are wrong because the governing body can never be wrong.

    by the same token the vaccines are safe and effective because the governing body can never be wrong

  • EasyPrompt

    The GB is wrong about so many things, including the plague after the locusts...

    The next "plague" after the locusts is just another perspective of the same event, the attack on religion, from a different angle...

    Revelation 9:12-15

    "The one woe is past. Look! Two more woes are coming after these things. The sixth angel blew his trumpet. And I heard one voice from the horns of the golden altar that is before God say to the sixth angel who had the trumpet: “Untie the four angels who are bound at the great river Eu·phraʹtes.” And the four angels who have been prepared for the hour and day and month and year were untied to kill a third of the people.""

    The angels who are "bound at the great river Euphrates" are the same as the angels referred to in this verse:

    "After this I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding tight the four winds of the earth, so that no wind could blow on the earth or on the sea or on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the sunrise, having a seal of the living God; and he called with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, saying: “Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until after we have sealed the slaves of our God in their foreheads.”" (Revelation 7:1-13)

    The "great river Euphrates" was by Babylon.

    The angels have been holding back the winds of destruction from Babylon the Great. The locust plague is the attack on Babylon the Great. The plagues are just different aspects of the fall of Babylon the Great and other events of the 3 1/2 year great tribulation that hasn't yet begun but will soon.

    "And now you know what is acting as a restraint, so that he will be revealed in his own due time. True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work, but only until the one who is right now acting as a restraint is out of the way." (2 Thessalonians 2:6,7)

    The "restraint" is the angels.

    Some more from 2 Thessalonians chapter 2...

    "However, brothers, concerning the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you not to be quickly shaken from your reason nor to be alarmed either by an inspired statement or by a spoken message or by a letter appearing to be from us, to the effect that the day of Jehovah is here." The GB/FDS said "the day of Jehovah" (aka Jesus getting the kingdom) began in 1914. The GB/FDS have an appearance of godly devotion but prove false to its power.

    "Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do you not remember that when I was still with you, I used to tell you these things?" The GB/FDS wants to be worshipped ahead of God. The GB/FDS are apostates.

    "And now you know what is acting as a restraint, so that he will be revealed in his own due time. True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work, but only until the one who is right now acting as a restraint is out of the way. Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence." At the great tribulation, the angels will not hold back the UN from attacking religion anymore. During that attack, Jesus will allow the GB/FDS JWborg (as well as all other groups claiming to be Christian) to be cleaned out of their properties and prominence just like Jesus cleaned out the temple in the first century. The independent religious institutions themselves will be completely gone.

    "But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved. That is why God lets a deceptive influence mislead them so that they may come to believe the lie, in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness." Satan has allowed the JWborg people to say "1914, see we predicted it!" just like Satan empowered Jannes and Jambres to seem to make frogs and some of the plagues in the Egypt. Satan is the one who lined up the nations for their WWI battles, just like playing out a war game.

    The angels of the congregations know where Christians are. The congregations of Revelation stand for all the religious groups that claim their descent from Christ's first century congregation. Revelation chapters 2 and 3 shows there is sectarianism in some, and idolatry in some, and immorality in some. When Jesus takes the throne, he will send out his angels and they will remove the weeds and gather the wheat in bundles. The leaven of the false teachings will be removed. The Christian congregation will be refined and restored by the 1,150th day of the tribulation.

    "Out of one of them came another horn, a small one, and it grew very great toward the south and toward the east and toward the Decoration. It grew so great that it reached all the way to the army of the heavens, and it caused some of the army and some of the stars to fall to the earth, and it trampled them down. It exalted itself even against the Prince of the army, and from him the constant feature was taken away, and the established place of his sanctuary was thrown down. And an army was given over, together with the constant feature, because of transgression; and it kept throwing truth to the earth, and it acted and had success. And I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to the one speaking: “How long will the vision of the constant feature and of the transgression causing desolation continue, to make both the holy place and the army things to trample on?” So he said to me: “Until 2,300 evenings and mornings; and the holy place will certainly be restored to its right condition.”" (Daniel 8:9-14)

    The UN is the horn. Genesis says "An evening, a morning, one day." An evening is half a day. A morning is half a day. 2,300 half days is 1,150 days.

    We will have to keep announcing at that point that Jesus is king in heaven and that he is coming. There will be a great crowd of former unbelievers during the tribulation that say "we will go with you people, for we have heard that God is with you people," just like there was a great crowd of unbelievers in Egypt who didn't have time to "convert" to the Israelite religion but were still saved.

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA

    I would advise don’t spend too much time worrying about the exact meaning of these cryptic things that could have just been the wild ramblings of a bunch of men.

    Yes they could be Gods word but why is it so cryptic and nonsensical?

    maybe just maybe, the Bible is a book written by a bunch of men and they all had different ideas.

    Im still agnostic so it could be Gods word or maybe it isn’t.

    Rev 9:11 is a good example of vague cryptic words that don’t translate well and modern humans all have different ideas what it means and what it could all be.

    Even if the Bibles promises are all lies, or perhaps there is a bit of truth in them but we have the wrong understanding completely?

    Im agnostic so will not commit either way. But this line “wife needs her hope, even if it's a lie” - this Could well apply to agnostics as well.

    I genuinely believe the hope that the Bibles promises give is a benefit and a comfort. I have this hope even though I’m open to the possibility that it’s just a book written by a bunch of men and maybe evolution is how the universe started.

    Or maybe it is Gods word but all this business about locusts and abyss and the one named Abaddon holding the key is the king over them. What does that actually do for you in the real world?


    it could mean many many things or it could mean nothing.

    your guess is as good as mine or as good as watchtowers guesses.

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