Jehovah God,Christ Jesus ,IBSA ,why no direct communication between Heaven and Earth ?

by smiddy 6 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • smiddy

    According to Jehovah`s Witnesses Christ jesus was enthroned in heaven in 1914 .

    The International Bible Students ,C.T.Russell as president was approved byJesus Christ shortly after as the channell approved by Jehovah God to dispense spiritual food to his faithful followers here on earth.

    Why is it that after 100 years of Jesus Christ rule from heaven over his chosen people , the JW`s , that their is no direct contact between Jesus Christ and his earthly channell of communication ,namely the WTB&TS , and no direct contact from Jehovah God either.

    JW`s do not claim to have direct contact with GOD or Jesus Christ , isnt that strange ? After 102 years ruling as King ?

    Jesus Christ is the greater moses , Moses had direct contact with God and his people , so shouldnt the greater Moses ,Jesus Christ have direct contact with his people especially since he is now ruling over them from heaven ?

    In the 102 years of jesus Christ heavenly reign over his earthly subjects ,Jehovah`s Witnesses and not having direct communication with them ,how and why has his earthly subjects ,JW`s had to make so many adjustments ,in some cases back flips ,Rom.13:1-2 ,that have been a total embarrasment to honest hearted Bible students.

    Beliefs , doctrines , practices , that were accepted in C.T.Russells day would get you disfellowshiped if they were practiced today.

    And yet C.T Russell `s beliefs and practices were approved by Jesus Christ and he was given approval as the sole channell of communication between God and man , which hasn`t even taken place yet.

    Even after 102 years of JC Rule from heaven.


  • smiddy

    No takers ?

    I mean to say if God was supposed to be communicating with humans via dreams ,prophets , Angels etc. as recorded in the Old Testament , surely Jehovah`s Witnesses being his spokesperson for today so close to the Great Tribulation and Armageddon , Jehovah/Yahweh should have direct communication through Jesus Christ as his enthroned King , with his earthly subjects shouldn`t he ?

    Why was God communicating with humans for the first 4000 years of human history , and is mute for the last 2000 years , especially since he supposedly approved C.T.Russells movement.


  • TheWonderofYou

    The church writes that Jesus is our "kingdom of god on earth".

    (I did return yet to the roman catolic church but I grew up in it and read many booklets now.)

    For the christian church the kingdom of god is already now on earth because Jesus Christ is ready to live in our heart, what we now have is already a partial fulfilment of the kingdom on earth but not yet the full glory.

    The kingdom of god can be explained also as accepting the sovereinty of the lord. This means if someone accepts the sovereinty of God, only then she/is is in the kingdom. But the kingdom of God is not a tool to establish an adminstration over the earth, a real government with ministeres, princes, neither somewhere above in the stars nor here on earth, as it has been misinterpreted by the church too in the political arena, but only God in the midst of us, God dwelling in our hearts.

    Imagine god would have that administration, kingdom in heaven and nobody would follow its rules? God would not need that governement than. Would he annihilate all nonbelievers? What he needs is ... that we love him. And only when we love God and recognize him, his figurative "reign" can become true. God only wants a kingdom in our hearts, that we love him. Those christians who recognize god believe they have heaven on earth, the kingdom on earth through Jesus Christ.

    For christians Jesus is our kingdom on earth, his anointment with spirit, is comparable with the anointing oil that percolates the body and heals everything. The sense of becoming an anointed is to heal everyone. so Jesus healed and he heals us, Jesus christ is our kingdom of God that heals us.


    After Jesus left the earth he said that the COMFORTER and HELPER, the spirit, would come and lead the church. There would be no direct communication - voice to ear - or channeling - until Jesus return. Jesus and father would act by the means of the comforter spirit. That Jesus RULES IN HEAVEN, or sits besides the father is merely a picture that discribes his authority in words of jewish king legends, but its nothing important that implies a real administration and does not deal with the threeholiness of god.

    Therefore up to now, there is no direct communication or channel neither to the church, to the pope or the WT-Headquarter. Because we live in the era of the spirit where the Jesus and god opens the heart in the spirit, a era where Jesus lives further in his church, the church that is his mystical body. As jesus lives in you and me, and we are his - jesus - body, and we often dont think of it at all, we should really be thankful sometimes, about his mercy


    Relating to the earthly life of Jesus Christ the church says that he was God and man and that he SPOKE the word of God to the hearts then and for all time once and ultimately to mankind.

  • eyeuse2badub


    You are just too logical. It all happens by magic within the inner circle of the gb! They never actually tell the rank and file how they arrive at certain doctrine, they just tell them to accept and obey.

    just saying!


  • deegee

    What transpired with regard to the writing of the Bible gives a clear answer as to whether or not God actually communicates with anyone.

    The writers of the New Testament (NT) did not consider the Hebrew Canon closed or aligned with today's 39 books. They freely cited Hebrew texts that are today considered NON-CANONICAL. The most influential of the Hebrew books was that of Enoch. It exercised a greater influence on the NT than all the other non-canonical books put together. It was eventually rejected by the Jews and subsequently Christians, yet quotations from the book of Enoch can be found in Jude and verbal echoes if it can be found in Matthew, Luke, John, Hebrews, Thessalonians, 1 Peter and Revelation and probably in other books.

    There is no universally accepted Bible Canon:
    Roman Catholics claim that the Bible contains 73 canonical (authentic) books, while most Protestants accept only 66 because they reject the Apocryphal/Deuterocanonical books. The Orthodox Christians accept 76 books.
    The Ethiopian church, which traces its roots to the fourth-century church, claims a Canon of some 81 books.

    Several ancient biblical manuscripts include non-canonical Christian writings.

    It is commonly held by Bible scholars in recent centuries that mistakes were made with the selection of books for the NT Canon.

    The Bible is a book of contradictions, inconsistencies, discrepancies, forgeries, myths, folklore, legends, fables, stories that did not actually occur, plagiarisms, midrash on scripture, revisionist history, failed prophecies or pretending to write prophesy when the writers were actually writing old history and not prophecy, morality that is incompatible with current standards of morality and ethics, inaccuracies - it is at odds with science and archaeology and historical facts in some instances; lots of writers of the Hebrew Bible, with editors/redactors trying to make the texts appear as though there were less writers; a nationalistic/political agenda propped up by god-talk which has led to the land-grab problem in the Middle East.

    Yet we are told that God directed the thoughts of the men who wrote the Bible and inspired the wording of the Bible.

    As far as I can see, God is a silent God - he does not communicate with anyone, or lead or direct anyone as we have been told/led to believe.

  • TheWonderofYou

    How do we come to "INSPIRATION",

    theópneustos . Paul used a greek word in 2. Tim. 3,16f to describe the worth of the scriptures.

    It fitted to the in vers 15 mentioned "holy scriptures" of the jews.

    I appears only once in the bible. And only after it was translated into latin as divinitus inspirata we came to our

    It is mostly understood as passive activity of men. The writer sits and the spirit comes. But this passive interpretation of the greek word theopneustos is not acceptable for biblescholars, better would be the interpretation "breathing god spirit".

    2. Tim 3,16 reminds scholars of the Rabbinic notion that the spirit speaks prophetically in the texts. Each scripture is inspired. The texts can be quasi fanned out in such a manner that different speakers can be distinguished.


    If I interpret everything correct the word "inspired" would not refer to the magical formation and writing of the scriptures in the past, the how it was done, at all and Paul only spoke about the "ingenious content" of the scriptures, using the expression " breathing gods spirit" .

    This has some consequences especially to the matter which sprictures then are those that are "breathing gods spirit" and "ingenious of content"? That is why lately the church or the scholars decided always which scriptures are ingenious an which not.


    To understand the meaning of inspiration correctly in jewish-christian framework you must study the jewish understanding of the "words of god", of a god who speaks in the "law" or the "prophetic words", means the concept "holy scripture" AND THIS IS VERY SOPHISTICATED:

    What we understand under inspiration today sometimes - personal dictate - is not the same what was meant 2000 years ago and not the same what the reformators said.

  • deegee



    Just wondering, has God ever communicated with you personally at any point in your life?

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