Excellent thread and your opening OP is exactly how I feel. It's interesting to note the JW's have a lot of similarities with the other cults you mention, thus correctly defining a cult.
I have a theory related to the cult spectrum
by ILoveTTATT2 22 Replies latest jw friends
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Phizzy
I don't know who this is from, but very sensible and useful I think :
Universal Definition
CULT - Any group which has a pyramid type authoritarian leadership structure with all teaching and guidance coming from the person/persons at the top. The group will claim to be the only way to God; Nirvana; Paradise; Ultimate Reality; Full Potential, Way to Happiness etc, and will use thought reform or mind control techniques to gain control and keep their members.
This definition covers cults within all major world religions, along with those cults which have no OBVIOUS religious base such as commercial, educational and psychological cults. Others may define these a little differently, but this is the simplest to work from.
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Yesu Kristo Bwana Wangu
That's an interesting question! Can a cult have mainstream views.
I once read this article, about the Brazillian Christian Congregation. It has mainstream views but is extremely orthodox. For instance, after being baptised, cutting your hair as a woman is considered a sin. You can cut your hair once you have been married. I have not done a lot of research of their belief, but maybe this comes closer to what you are searching.
it's popular in Brazil.
https://witness.worldpressphoto.org/the-brides-veil-2d14319fc061
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scratchme1010
Check out the Worldwide Church of God... they were a BITE model cult, and now Grace International, from what I have read, isn't... but they went from non-mainstream to mainstream.
I may need a little more than just a person stating that this is no longer a cult. Furthermore, mainstream and "not a cult" are not synonyms.
Universal Definition
CULT - Any group which has a pyramid type authoritarian leadership structure with all teaching and guidance coming from the person/persons at the top. The group will claim to be the only way to God; Nirvana; Paradise; Ultimate Reality; Full Potential, Way to Happiness etc, and will use thought reform or mind control techniques to gain control and keep their members.
This definition covers cults within all major world religions, along with those cults which have no OBVIOUS religious base such as commercial, educational and psychological cults. Others may define these a little differently, but this is the simplest to work from.
I am no expert, but what I have seen is that professionals an researches in the subject of cults have several different definitions and classifications of cults. In fact, some don't even use the word cult to define an organization, as it may be misleading based on the several definitions.
Here are a few definitions:
"worship; reverential homage rendered to a divine being or beings...a particular form or system of religious worship; especially in reference to its external rites and ceremonies...devotion or homage to a particular person or thing.“ – Compact Edition of the Oxford English Dictionary (1971)
"A religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious...
A system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator...
Great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work...b. a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion." - Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, Tenth Edition (1994)Then there's a "millennial" definition of a cult:
"A group or movement exhibiting a great or excessive devotion or dedication to some person, idea, or thing and employing unethically manipulative techniques of persuasion and control (e.g. isolation from former friends and family, debilitation, use of special methods to heighten suggestibility and subservience, powerful group pressures, information management, suspension of individuality or critical judgment, promotion of total dependency on the group and fear of leaving it, etc.), designed to advance the goals of the group's leaders, to the actual or possible detriment of members, their families, or the community. – West & Langone, 1986, pp. 119-120"
That definition applies only to what they call a "totalistic type" of cult, which is one of the several ways in which some experts classify cults, such as:
- cults as dangerous, authoritarian
- cults as culturally innovative or transcultural
- cults as loosely structured protoreligions
There's a 4th form of classification of cults, based on Stark and Bainbridge’s taxonomy (1985) that distinguishes:
- audience cults
- client cults
- cult movements
As I mentioned, it's not that cut and dry, what is clear in any of the descriptions, classifications or definitions, is that all those groups have several typical characteristics, many of which some are:
- unethical influence
- conversion
- manipulation
- mind-control - brainwashing
- exploitation
- charismatic group
- new religious movement – alternative movement
- psychological abuse
- harm
That's the school where I come from, so my question is how does one can say that some organization became/was a cult and now isn't? How is that measured, what makes them a cult before and not a cult now?
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GLTirebiter
Check out the Worldwide Church of God...
That is an unusual case. Their reformation came about when Armstrong's prophecies did not come to pass, and his successors did considerable soul-searching (if you will pardon the pun) and re-assessed their doctrine. They are now a more typical evangelical sect. If they can do it, there may be a glimmer of hope that even the WTBTS could reform itself. Long odds, but it could happen.
Your four-quadrant graph left out the Orthodox churches, who would be far in the upper right corner--more Catholic than the Catholics, so to speak.
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ILoveTTATT2
Hi, so... coming back to this:
Do you know of any churches that teach non-orthodox christian beliefs, such as no trinity, no hellfire, soul sleep, etc... and which could not be considered cults using the BITE model?
I know of plenty of healthy christian churches that would not be in any way considered cults in the BITE model, but they are orthodox. Examples: a typical catholic church, a liberal, non-fundamentalist baptist church, etc... These teach the existence of God, the Trinity, hell, etc... but are pretty liberal environments... -
oppostate
Not all Bible students are Dawn cultish.
Those who separated from Russell early on are not BITE-ers.
Like ones from the Christian Believers Conference.
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Londo111
I believe there are some fringe groups that evolve into cults over time, that is, they become increasingly authoritarian so that the BITE model comes into play. It is unlikely Russell started off with the intention of forming a cult (he was anti-organization to start with), but by the end of his life, he was regarded as the Faithful Slave. Then Rutherford took the Bible Students to another level, especially after 1925. Then Knorr/Franz took it to another level, adding shunning, no blood transfusions, ect…
I suppose if Rutherford had not gone in the authoritarian direction, the Watchtower organization would have been a forgotten historical footnote.
A cult demands—you must believe this, you must live up to these demands. It’s hard and requires sacrifice. When people factcheck, they realize the beliefs fall apart and the sacrifice is not worth it. Therefore, information must be controlled. Add to that severe consequences for leaving, like shunning, and that keeps people in, and keeps information damaging to the cult contained.
High demand groups evolve into the BITE model or they don't survive.
BTW…some (but not all) Pentecostal groups border on, if not cross the line into cult territory.
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ILoveTTATT2
Those who separated from Russell early on are not BITE-ers.
Ok, but how would you know if you're going into these groups that they're NOT going to meet the BITE model?
That would be an option if they really weren't BITE-ers as you say. -
oppostate
@ ILoveTTATT2
I've been to some of their conferences here in Massachusetts at Gordon College. They're pretty cool. The conference of Free Bible Students had its start in 1909 in Brooklyn, NY, they'd split from Russell over the issue of the New Covenant.
http://www.cbfchurch.com/history-of-cbf.html
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