Thank you guys so much! All of this info is great and will be useful when this topic comes up. I couldn't wrap my brain around this issue about the cross. Like some people have said on this site, the GB has basically given themselves Christ's authority have made things like this a salvation issue.
Anyone know what this sculpture is of the "torture stake?"
Do you know what article, specifically, it was from? This is yet another example of very poor investigation on JW's part.
Charity7 » ...the GB has basically given themselves Christ's authority....
Yet they call all other religions "manmade" as though it somehow legitimized their own faith. "Of course, I don't want to be part of a manmade religion," you tell yourself. "I want to be part of a religion Jesus personally picked when he was invisible in 1918!"
Yeah, so how do you know Jesus picked your religion in 1918?
“Well, who else's church would he have picked? We're the only one who correctly identified 1914 as the pivotal year of Christ's coming. We're the only ones that have a purely biblical doctrine. And the holy spirit revealed to us the true date of the destruction of Jerusalem as 607 BCE!"
Where do I sign up?
why do they not at least cover him up? was not death supposed to bring on an erection? "tie me kangaroo down mate" ?
Charity....you are more right than you know. JWs define how right they are by the amount of things that make them "different". Such as no birthdays, no voting, no cross, no trinity, no blood, no collection plate, etc....
So it can be difficult to get anywhere here. Its best to say it doesnt matter to you what he died on, but the best records available say it was most lilely a cross. Maybe here is a thought experiment. Ask if it woild mean anything to them if concrete proof was identified that ahowed he died on a cross. Would it shake their faith? (It would). Then proclaim it wouldnt matter to you.
Looking back at my 50+ years in JWville, and the things that were repeatedly stressed, over and over and over and over.....
I have come to conclude that "the cross or not the cross" the "we don't celebrate that" the "we print magazines in over 200 languages" the "we were the first to make a movie" the "we are the only ones to use God's name" ..... These things are really a distraction, something the WT makes JWs feel proud to say, as if all THOSE things make them the 'one true religion'.
WT uses the hamster wheel.. the spin, spin, spin, do, do, do, repeat, repeat, repeat idea to keep you busy, keep you from thinking about the real things that mean so much.
Are you wearing the right clothes? not yoga pants, right? men: not the "skinny" pants? no beards? (unless you are in a country that has them brokered in).. All of those things are part of the hamster wheel.
JW's have been claiming they were chosen by God in 1799/ the 1800's, 19181919 (their "governing body" "faithful slave" was chosen) BUT, they really use people to promote their book selling organization, they hide behind the Kingdom Hall "let's give our time freely" "let's put the Hall in the WT's name", they get people to donate their lifelong belongings when they die, "since we are living in the last days, and Armageddon will come at any minute"
The cross is a distraction. Who cares if Jesus died on a cross? Would God not accept his sacrifice if it was not a cross? if it was a cross? Or, what if we didn't even KNOW how he died? just that he died faithful?
The WT uses these things to keep witnesses "proud" of their man made organization, while it uses the publisher's resources up. It allows terrible things to happen to children in sex abuse cases. It blackmails families into shunning their loved ones.
The cross... just another thing to view on the hamster wheel.
I agree cha ching, The WTS has a lot of spin on very little substance. When you look closely, you are hard pressed to find real WTS fruits.
Restoring Gods name? Door to door evangelization? Stake over a cross?
How are these things fruits?
Fruits help all people of the world, like schools and universities. Hospitals and old age homes, shelters and food banks. Things that help all people always gives glory to God because Christians believe that we are all made in Gods image,
What has the WTS given to all people because we are made in Gods image?
This article was posted by someone who runs a Facebook page called Jehovahs Witnesses & Friends and it was posted on Saturday.
I have a question.. I discovered my JW husband doing a google search on the cross and Geoffrey Jackson and the whole child abuse scandal. Do you guys think there is a glimmer of hope?
When I mentioned Geoffrey Jackson both my husband and another JW didn't know who he was. She said, "oh isn't he that bald guy on the governing body?"
I just thought it was interesting that they didn't even know who the men are on the governing body. Certainly does not emulate how the apostles interacted with the early Christians.
So I guess the "new light" is that these men on the GB are fallible and make mistakes? I'm just kind of confused now. Did this just happen pretty recently? Sorry, non JW here trying to catch up with what's going on in the organization.
My stance is that to me that's not relevant. If you believe or not in Jesus, how is his sacrifice affected by the position in which he was murdered?
Jesus dying on a cross+ doesn't add up. It does not fit with the irony of the Bible; take for example the copper serpent that moses lifted up in the wilderness. It wasn't on a cross. That is just one example. Cannot be explained has to be understood. It must have worked out that Jesus died on a pole. No other way could fulfill the ironic poetry of the Bible.
Fisherman- could you elaborate? I don't follow your logic