A simple question among other things...

by megaboy 8 Replies latest jw experiences

  • megaboy

    I would like to ask a question freely to anyone, just to get a feel for those I eccounter in life and be able to meet with them through empathy.

    Those who spent time with this organization, did you ever feel any sense of wisdom coming from it at all? When I mean wisdom I mean in a truly sensible manner not the illusion of it.

    Were there any teachings that would manifest in you respecting your self and your thoughts, as well as others, being able to detect reasonable behavior and detect teachings which promote moderate actions with others? Anything to harvest justfying thoughts are behaviors with others? Or was it all elements that harvest a thoughts of inferiority?

    How would describe the sort of breathe or energy that moved through the organization as a whole? Ignorance? Fear? Anger? Apathy? Confusion? How have these things transformed over the years.

    Studying this org I think it is conceptually at its weakest point, regardless of its longevity in mere existence. One of its strenghts was the fact that its heads were behind a curtain, now that the veil is lifted, there is little room for simply being fooled or making an erroneous choice in dealing with them.

    Are many people lingering hoping that the house can be fixed?

    To me, if the foundation of the house is poor there is no way to salvage it, the problem is at the root, but the root is usually hidden from sight, now the root is exposed to see and evaluate, the people have a choice to make.

  • Bonsai

    There are basic teachings sprinkled in that are attractive to any peace loving person who wants his family to be united in the same goal to accomplish something(such as living on a paradise earth with your family forever). A lot of their articles on drawing closer as a family have some practical value. I'm sure they quote mine professionals. Unfortunately, the organization doesn't take its own advice when dealing with those who no longer toe the line and conform to its dogmatic standards.

    As long as affluent, fat, Western men run an international organization, as long as men who aren't in touch with reality run the show, there can be no real significant change or improvements from within.

    I was reading on another thread your thoughts on the influence from "Western empire". I think this religion as well as most other Protestant religions are a relic of that Western empire. They can only see things from the Western view. I know for a fact many in Japan became witnesses because they loved the Nation behind the religion. JWism wasn't just a religion but an American ideal. It was softer than the traditional culture of showing no emotion (or tough love) to your children or spouse. All this talk of mildness, affection, warmth and family love was so appealing to Japanese women in a loveless marriage.

    On a surface level, those things are perfectly good and should be focused on. Unfortunately, it was the strings attached to being a Witness, to being stuck in a captive organization that has robbed many of their happiness. It's less about the love and everything to do with conforming and service time nowadays.

  • Finkelstein

    1 John 4:1

    Test the Spirits

    4 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.

  • Freeandclear

    Great question.

    When I was in I found most congregations to be warm and loving. I would travel around a lot as a youngster and visit many different halls. Only a time or two did the hall feel cold or unloving. I got to go to an international convention in Prague in 2006 (back when I was an uber dub) and it was a wonderful experience.

    I had many friend in the hall and would spend at least an hour after meetings talking and socializing, for me it was warm and loving.

    I never thought any of the information presented was particularly full of wisdom, certainly not wisdom from God, merely wisdom from man. What I mean by that is all the stuff in Proverbs and such is just human wisdom acquired by simply living life and observing how to and how not to treat others. I don't think anything in the bible is special knowledge or from god.

    However, from a personal standpoint regarding my overall feeling at meetings, one word comes to mind. Guilt. Okay two words; negativity.

    Very much harping on how bad the world is, how evil satan is, and how bad worldly people are. And as for the guilt. It was a serious dichotomy. On the one hand we were told to "do your best" "do as much as you can" etc...but then there was the "You must always be improving" "Keep reaching out" etc etc etc..... So even though you WERE in fact doing your best and being the best imperfect human you could be it was never enough. You were always brow beaten and made to feel worthless because you weren't doing enough.

    That's how I felt there anyway. It's also why I left. Thankfully I found jwfacts.com and came to learn the real truth about the organization and that has helped me alleviate my fears that I would die at Armegeddon. I am free now from slavery to the borg.

  • Beth Sarim
    Beth Sarim
    Fear. Obedience induced by fear.
  • theliberator

    I am still a Christian. I actually learned many things from that sick organization. I became very familiar with the Bible. And so it was a little easier for me after I left. Also too, they talk alot about love, kindness, generosity, forgiveness, and so on. These concepts became a part of me and so I was always conscious of them. Not everything they teach is necessarily wrong when it come to the fruitage of the spirit in Galatians. Jesus identified the problem: "All things therefore whatever they tell you to observe, observe and do, but don't do their works; for they say, and don't do. For they bind heavy burdens that are grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not lift a finger to help them. - Matthew: 23. 3, 4

  • theliberator
    I wanted to add to my last comment. The Watchtower did teach one thing that has affected me and I always told people this. "If you want to be a rebel against society, become a witness." The organization undermines every "norm" of the world. And so after leaving, I still refuse to be swept away into pop culture thinking. I don't accept something just because "every" scientist says it is true. While I love college, I hate how so many get out and they change from having real opinions to being piously politically correct. I know I left one indoctrination. I don't want to be swept into another. In other words, the Watchtower has taught me not to trust society in general. A good thing? Yes and No.
  • megaboy

    These are interesting replies and helpful. I want to say that simply having love doesn't particularly qualify as set a part, anyone in the world can have that. A man can have love for the poor but steal from others to serve the poor. Anything can be used as a tool a person can be used as a tool.

    Would anyone say that the love used in the organization was conditioned under the circumstances to manipulate people into joining? It doesn't have to be daibolical, but it can organically mutated into this manipulative process. Not particularly compassionate love, but an eagerness to display "love"? The enviornment sounds like it adds pressure, can that pressure alter how love is presented? If something has some parts of something that are good but not others does that sheild then from critical judgement looking at the whole? Is love is shown in the org under certain circunstances does it still qualify as love based on the organization itself or is it the people showing elements of that nature in man? Is love harvested there or is more like the few plants that struggled to break through the cracks in concrete?

    Its something to think about when wondering if its really worth the tine even taking the organization seriously at all.

  • theliberator

    megaboy: You are correct in what you said. The organization taught nothing, other than the words ( love, joy, etc). You mentioned the phrase "display love". That is the crux of the matter. Our "acts of love", were just visible acts. The Watchtower is all about the Watchtower. They wanted us to "display" qualities just to impress outsiders (much like quick built KH's).

    That is why an arrogant jerk elder could remain as an elder. If he is pushing the Watchtower agenda, he remains. But if you are caught in a sports bar, well you need to be dragged into the back room.

    Isn't it funny how we all know the phrase "back room"? Weird.

Share with others