Challenging JWs at Cult Carts

by cofty 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • cofty

    If I have time I always talk to JWs when I see a cult cart.

    They are in a public forum promoting a harmful ideology therefore they are fair game. Having said that, the individual JWs on the trolley are not the enemy so I think it's better to keep it as friendly and non-confrontational as possible.

    Being realistic no JW is going to admit they are wrong because of something we say to them on the street but don't underestimate the long-term effect of doubts.

    So what are your ideas for how to approach them?

    Personally I like to use the literature on the cart. If they have stuff on creationism I ask them about that. If they have brochures on why the bible is god's word I ask them about things like slavery and genocide. Make sure you have specific references in mind.

    IMO arguing christian doctrine like the deity of Jesus is a waste of time. It's one proof text versus another.

    Don't waste time telling them about bad stuff the cult did decades ago. They don't care. The ARC is a powerful weapon but make sure you have some succinct facts so it doesn't just sound like a hateful rant.

    The "overlapping generations" is always fun.

    So what if they dismiss your challenge as persecution? That's just something they tell each other to pretend it didn't affect them.

    One last thing. Don't tell them you are an ex-JW until the end of your conversation. Then tell them how leaving was the best decision you ever made. Try to leave them as a friend with a smile and handshake.

  • tornapart
    One thing I've noticed that many of the r&f Jws don't always agree with or like and feel disturbed over is the idea of God killing billions of people at Armageddon. They kind of put it to one side as though they'll get into paradise without having to think about the nastiness of it all. When they are made to face it head on they'll use the 'Jehovah sees hearts and he'll decide'. But it doesn't connect with idea that only JWs will survive Armageddon. There's a lot of CD going on with them. Ask them if they believe God is going to kill billions of people and watch them squirm.
  • James Mixon
    James Mixon
    "killing billions". Why kill billions and then bring them back in the resurrection, what's the point.
  • cofty
    Why kill billions and then bring them back in the resurrection, what's the point

    JWs believe that those who die at Armageddon will not be resurrected. Those who die prior to the big A probably will. Logically JWs should be murdering all their non-JW family.

    tornapart - I agree it's a great question. I have used that in Edinburgh. Just look at the crowds around you and pick out a family. Remind them that every time they pray for paradise they are praying for the annihilation of all these people. If they try to deny that remind them of their graphic Armageddon pictures.

  • Lieu

    Why????? Leave them alone.

    You want them to leave you alone, yes?

    I don't bother them because I don't want them bothering me.

  • Simon

    I think if the religious wants to setup a stall in the high street then they should be prepared to be questioned and challenged about their beliefs (in a reasonable way).

    I agree too that anything over 10 years ago is old news in new-age religions, they don't care, there is a good chance they may not even have been witnesses then. Some people just look at the current and whether that satisfies them or not.

    Whether Russel touched a woman's bottom once? meh ...

  • oppostate

    The best challenge, in my opinion, is the flip-flopping. Either they had it right once and changed to wrong then change to right, or they had it wrong and changed to right then changed to wrong again. Can't have both be right and wrong at the same time. Either the U.N. was bad or it wasn't. Why the Awake! articles praising the U.N. when they were members then giving up their NGO relationship once they were found out and exposed on the Guardian.

    Hypocrisy will be the death of them, I feel. It's something that opened my eyes. The cross was a Christian symbol under Russell and then pagan under Rutherford, but the gospels point out, in the revised NWT, the "mark of the nails" on the hands, so more than one, and not at all as it's pictured on the magazines sinceĀ the sign saying the phrase about King of the Jews was above Jesus' head not his hands.

    Either they can call God, Our Father, and they're children of God, or they are just friends, in which case they can't call God their Father. Who does the Bible say is "our mother", our spiritual mother is the Jerusalem above not the WTB&TS.

    There's a lot of these reasoning points that make one think.

  • Quarterback

    What??? Russell touched some women's bottom?

    That's the behavior I would expect from Rutherford, but not Russell

  • cofty

    I agree Oppostate.

    They will reply that the GB are imperfect men. So the obvious question is why the rank and file are not allowed to question their teachings. They claim the authority of a prophet but refuse to accept the responsibility of one. I have used this point and the JW agreed it was a fair comment he couldn't answer.

    You want them to leave you alone, yes? - Lieu

    No I want them to challenge me at every opportunity.

  • MarkofCane

    Agreed if they're prepared to go door to door and set up stalls to dispense their teachings, then they need to be prepared to defend it. Nobody should be allowed to spew out lies that affect millions of peoples lives, innocent children who have no say and not be challenged.

    I think pointing out the organization history is powerful, this lead me here and the rest was history. If done in a respectful way, it will leave a empty feeling "doubt" that needs to be looked into. Eventually when they realize the bOrg doesn't touch on the subject and if there honestly seeking answers they will go online. If they're content in letting someone else think for them, well they're home. The preaching work nowadays is nothing like it was in previous years where discussion and debate was welcomed, preparation was necessary. Now you just see them sitting next to a cart and making no attempt to reach out to people they are just counting time.

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