What is meant by the expression

by poopie 12 Replies latest jw friends

  • poopie

    Persistent spiritual association?

  • Giordano

    It seems to be a reference to having spiritual based discussions with a disfellowshiped person. August 2002 Our Kingdom Ministry.

  • Village Idiot
    Village Idiot

    Persistent means continuous. Does that mean that the Watchtower allows for occasional "spiritual association"?

  • George One Time
    George One Time

    This is what the local elders make of it. In my congregation a longtime respected elder was just removed from his privileges having his disfellowshipped son visiting him while he was recovering from a serious illness.

  • konceptual99

    In the Shepherd The Flock of God Book, elders are given direction as to when a judicial committee should be formed. Item 10 provides some examples of "brazen conduct" and starts as follows:

    10. Though this is not an exhaustive list, brazen conduct may be involved in the following if the wrongdoer has an insolent, contemptuous attitude made evident by a practice of these things:
    • Willful, continued, unnecessary association with disfellowshipped non relatives despite repeated counsel—Matt. 18:17b; 1 Cor, 5:11, 13;2 John 10, 11; w81 9/15 pp. 25-26.

    Child sexual abuse and dating a non-believer are also in this list - nice to know where they all rank...

    Anyway, the point is that simply talking to a DF'ed person is in itself not a DF offence, it's the "brazen" disloyalty to scriptural and divine (read JW) process by continued association and requires repeated counsel.

    Elsewhere in the book it is clear that elders risk (note risk - not an automatic revocation) their privileges if they allow a DF'ed family member to live in the house. This is inconsistently applied and is a neat way for bullying elders to pick on weaker elders.

  • Heaven

    Persistent spiritual association?

    The word 'persistent' seems to mean 'constant' and therefore, has a connotation of 'harrassing'.

    What is meant by this phrase?

    Let's drive you nuts!

  • Island Man
    Island Man

    I think this term applies specifically to the context of JWs associating with DFd or DAd relatives. It could be a charge leveled against you when your privileges in the congregation are taken from you because you continue to associate with a DFd relative.

    Watchtower says no association should exist between current JWs and DFd or DAd ex-JWs. But they say that if the ex-JW is a relative or spouse living in the same house with a JW, then necessary family association can still occur to a reasonable degree but that no spiritual association is to take place.

    If the ex-JW is not living in the same house but is a relative, then the elders still cannot DF a JW for associating with them. The most that can be done is to disqualify them from having any privileges in the congregation.

    So when it's a case of family living in the same house, the grounds for punishing non-shunners changes from any kind of association to spiritual association. Of course, these facts are not stated much, if at all, in JW literature that is available to all JWs. Watchtower keeps it hidden in the elders' manual and tells JWs to show loyalty by shunning their ex-JW relatives, period.

  • sparrowdown

    Have you that have faded noticed that any JWs you have the misfortune of running into do not bring up any "spiritual" subjects?

    Just as island man said, deterring persistant spiritual association with the spiritually weak/sick is part of any cult's hygiene protocols.

    Keeping the apostate "virus" from spreading to non-affected dubs is to avoid or keep to an absolute minimum any "spiritual" association with weak or DA/DF family or friends lest the thinking/feeling virus spread.

  • poopie

    Don't elders have spiritual based discussions with df ones. Do not parents have spiritual discussions with do children living in home

  • Heaven

    poopie said: Don't elders have spiritual based discussions with df ones. Do not parents have spiritual discussions with do children living in home

    'Discussions'? No, there are no discussions. It's Botchtower's way or the boot-in-the-ass-shun-them way,

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