How do Jehovah's Witnesses get away with lying about the scripture?

by Capitanul 15 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Capitanul
    Capitanul

    They can edit their own versions to conform to their doctrines but what's stopping people to hand flyers or glue posters with the actual quotes in contradiction to their statements?

    Examples:

    https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/questions/what-is-the-holy-spirit/ - http://archive.is/778Ch

    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+12&version=NIV

    "31 And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come."

    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+3&version=NIV

    "16 As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting on him. 17 And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”"

    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20091101/myth-the-soul-is-immortal/ - http://archive.is/0FggH

    "Therefore, “soul” in the Biblical sense refers to the entire living being. If separated from the life force originally given by God, the soul dies.​—Genesis 3:19; Ezekiel 18:20."

    Plain lies.

    "The doctrine of the immortality of the soul raised questions: Where do souls go after death? What happens to the souls of the wicked? When nominal Christians adopted the myth of the immortal soul, this led them to accept another myth​—the teaching of hellfire.

    FACT:

    At death a person ceases to exist"

    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+13&version=NIV

    "37 He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.

    40 “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41 The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear."

    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+25&version=NIV

    34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

    37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

    40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

    41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

    44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

    45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

    46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

    Many more examples and arguments against them can be found I'm sure.

  • blondie
    blondie

    They don't even have to edit their own bibles. Few jws look up the scriptures any more and the WTS uses snippet quotes and citations, not quoting anything in the scripture.

    Jws, just trust the WTS not to lie to them, after all the WTS says they are they only true representatives of Christ on earth.

    Ask most jws where is the scripture that uses the phrase "governing body" in the bible, they might say Acts 15, but when you go to that chapter in the NWT or RNWT, there is no such phrase. The WTS uses that phrase so often and then cites Acts 15, that few jws realize that the WTS never puts quotes around the phrase governing body, indicating that it is not a quote from that location. That phrase is never found in any place in the NWT/RNWT. The WTS reasons because the word "trinity" is not found in the bible, it is a false teaching. Then that must mean that because the phrase "governing body" does not appear in the bible, it must be a false teaching.

    Edited to add: Even if a jw realizes that the WTS made a mistake in interpretation or application of a scripture, they should not say anything and accept the wrong concept, until god reveals the mistake to them and the WTS makes an adjustment in the publications. And sometimes the WTS changes the concept, but says nothing in the publications, waiting for people alive then to overlook the change or those who lived during the original concept have died.

  • cofty
    cofty

    Every one of your proof-texts can easily be countered by other proof-texts and by putting a different 'spin' on the verses in question.

    For example 'eternal punishment' can be understood to mean annihilation with no hope of resurrection - the judgement is 'eternal'.

    Reasoning with a JW takes far more insight an subtlety. Trading verses is pointless. Most of their beliefs can be supported by bible translations other than their own.

    Welcome to the forum.

  • ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
    ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
    Even if a jw realizes that the WTS made a mistake in interpretation or application of a scripture, they should not say anything and accept the wrong concept, until god reveals the mistake

    That will never happen coz God has left the universe !

    What kind of God is he who preserves parts of the ancient scriptures, but lets people tamper with bits and pieces in it? All the while saying in Revelation 22:18,19 " If anyone makes an addition or takes away from the words of the scrolls they will be punished" (not exact words ,you lokk it up)

    What kind of God is he who lets people take away his Divine Name "........." (cant say for sure what that is), which is a very important part of salvation ie "Joel 2:32 And everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved ;

    and replace it with lord??? Does this instill faith in the bible for you? Not for me!

    Zing

  • Anders Andersen
    Anders Andersen
    That will never happen coz God has left the universe !

    Interestingly, according to Bible theology God always resided outside the universe. After all, He supposedly existed before He created the universe.

    The average JW otoh never think about anything outside the universe.

    Watchtower keeps blabbering about universal sovereignty....as if God is not sovereign outside the universe in their theology.

    God lives in the heavens. God also created the heavens in the beginning. So where did He live before He created the heavens?

    Yeah I know, logic against myths....


  • Capitanul
    Capitanul

    What kind of God is he who preserves parts of the ancient scriptures, but lets people tamper with bits and pieces in it? All the while saying in Revelation 22:18,19 " If anyone makes an addition or takes away from the words of the scrolls they will be punished" (not exact words ,you lokk it up)

    They will be punished in the afterlife. People can temper with it but the untempered versions can be found.

    http://www.skarlakidis.gr/en/thema/18--1579-.html

    Undoubtedly, the scientific opinion of Evgeny Morozov carries great weight and confirms the written sources that mention the miraculous splitting of the column. But I wanted a second opinion on the matter and so I turned to one of the leading Greek scientists in the field of Fracture Mechanics, Professor George Α. Papadopoulos10 of the University of Athens, to whom I sent high definition photographs of the fracture.

    Professor Papadopoulos, having examined the photographs, judged that the fracture of the column was indeed caused by an electrical discharge which occurred simultaneously with a seismic wave directed upwards. This combined pressure on the column – electrical discharge plus seismic wave – he believes to be inexplicable and he consequently arrived at the conclusion that “one could only speak of a miracle.”

    Professor Papadopoulos, in response to a related email request from me, states the following:

    Dear Mr. Skarlakidis,

    Thank you for your email dated 31/1/2010. I believe I can be of assistance to your worthy project.

    For the last thirty-five years I have been working with Experimental Fracture Mechanics at the Physics of Strength of Materials Laboratory of the National University of Athens and I believe wherever there is no scientific explanation, there is a miracle.

    I have no reason to doubt the Munich Library manuscript dated to 1634 which gives an account of the miraculous manner of the rupture of the column as well as what ensued: that the Greek patriarch used this Fire to light his candle. I do not believe it is possible to doubt a miracle and especially where there are related accounts.

    By examining the fracture from the photographs, we could conclude that it is a result of combined pressure: a combination of electrical discharge (probably a strong lightning bolt) and a large seismic tremor. The electrical discharge, due to the high momentary temperature, embrittled the material in the column down the length of a narrow area (origin). The surface seismic wave put pressure on the column resulting in torsional oscillation (fatigue). This simultaneous pressure resulted in the fracture beginning at the base of the column and continuing upwards in a zigzag course (as it appears in the photograph the course of the fracture is not linear) along the length of the area made embrittled by the electrical discharge. If the above indeed occurred, in my opinion this simultaneous combined pressure of the column remains inexplicable. Therefore, one could speak only of a miracle.

    Dear Mr. Skarlakidis I would like to offer my congratulations on your work and I wholeheartedly wish you great success.

    Regards,

    With the miraculous incident of the column that split and ignited we have completed our long journey through the centuries concerning the miracle of the Holy Fire. Our journey began in approximately the year 330, with the account of the lighting of the oil lamp that was placed at the Holy Sepulchre by Saint Gregory the Illuminator and finished in the year 1579 with the incident we have just examined. We have presented forty-three testimonies and each reader is free to assess them according to his or her own judgment.

    In a brief overview of these testimonies, three particular characteristics are noteworthy. In all the attestations there is one common parameter: the account of a light, flame, fire, or lightning that descended from the sky before the people, at a time when the ability to reproduce electricity or related phenomena artificially did not exist.

    The second important characteristic is the igniting of the ever-burning oil lamp and the illumination of a vacant, dark and sealed Tomb – an event that took place for at least six centuries. The illumination of the Tomb interior certainly did not occur just from the radiance of the ever-burning oil lamp, but primarily from the light that emanated from the actual stone where the body of Jesus had been placed.

    The third important characteristic mentioned in many accounts is the synchronization of the two above-mentioned phenomena: both the descent of the heavenly light and the simultaneous igniting of the oil lamp and illumination of the Tomb interior. Such synchronization can only be achieved, both then and now, through divine intervention.

  • ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
    ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
    They will be punished in the afterlife.

    Another spin to a story ie afterlife ! Once again another journey I am not interested in .This life is more than enough with being in a cult and wasting away.

    Such synchronization can only be achieved, both then and now, through divine intervention.

    Just coz we do not understand/have enough info yet to explain some things in nature doesnot necessarily compound evidence of gods hands in it.

    Anyway, your info on the column does not answer why god will alow some bits to be tampered with, leaving humans in the dark.He is supposed to be helping us guiding us to light, not allowing problems ie tampered scripts, that leave us walk in the dark, fumble in the dark wasting our life trying to understand the so called truth/light !

    Zing

  • ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
    ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara

    In answer to your question

    How do Jehovah's Witnesses get away with lying about the scripture?

    They will be punished in the afterlife. People can temper with it but the untempered versions can be found.


    You said it not me, so why did you ask the question?

    Zing

  • smiddy3
    smiddy3

    To me the real question is how do they get away with lying about there past history ?

    They re-write their history to give a false impression of what they taught years earlier .

    They are masters of false propaganda always presenting themselves in a favourable position when the actual evidence in their own publications proves otherwise.

  • just fine
    just fine
    They lie about everything. If you bring up shunning they claim they don’t do it. If you bring up CSA they claim it’s not an issue and they have always reported it to the police. Bring up the misogyny in the organization they deny it. So it really shouldn’t surprise anyone that they lie about scriptures or teachings.

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