Are Jw's God's Organization?

by wantingtruth 15 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • wantingtruth
    wantingtruth

    Here I will quote a post written by "littleone" on another forum:

    >>>>

    When that original congregation apostasized, it formed the Roman Catholic Church.

    Was it that the Roman Catholic Church was Jehovah's organization? No. But it itself did hold Jehovah's anointed within it, did it not? What about the reformation periods? Jehovah still had his faithful anointed scattered thoughout the various sects and denominations of the nominal church.

    Was it that the baptists were God's organization? Was it that the anglican church, the presbyterian church, the adventist church, the pentecostal chuch, or any other church was to be considered Jehovah's earthly organization? No. But we do know that these various denominations had Jehovah's anointed within them. Likewise, even today, we know that Jehovah has anointed within the Jehovah's Witness congregations, but does that in itself mean that the WTBTS is Jehovah's earthly organization? Of course not.

    It can be said that these various anointed belong to Jehovah's heavenly organization, but it cannot be said that the earthly organization of Jehovah's Witnesses itself is God's organization. For we ourselves gathered here, at this site, also claim that we have anointed present, do we not? But do we dare declare ourselves as Jehovah's new earthly organization? Perhaps we should start writing posts to praise the e-jehovahs-witnesses.com website, declaring it as Jehovah's new earthly organization... telling people that they can only find salvation through this website... may that never happen!

    Likewise, how many here are active members of Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course there are some. But many here were either disfellowshipped, which means they were kicked out and therefore no longer members of Jehovah's Witnesses, or they disassociated themselves, which also means they're no longer members of Jehovah's Witnesses. Also, we have members here who never were Jehovah's witnesses to begin with... like myself. But of those who are disfellowshipped, disassociated, or who never became members of Jehovah's Witnesses, are we all to be considered OUTSIDE of Jehovah's organization? May that never happen! For if that is the case, then WOE to us! For we have found ourselves as opposers of Jehovah himself!

    This is also why everything that was carefully concealed within that organization is now being revealed. The "proof" that was used to show that the Jehovah's Witness organization was indeed Jehovah's earthly organization has now perished.

    It has been revealed from heaven that the claims made about 1914-1918 are NOT SO.

    It has been revealed from heaven that Jesus did not come in 1914-1918 to cleanse the temple.

    It has been revealed from heaven that Jesus did not come in 1914-1918 to appoint the "faithful slave" over all of his belongings.

    His "belongings" by the way also include those god fearing people of the "nominal church". Rather, what has it revealed? Transgression. Transgression against whom? Jesus Christ and Jehovah God. Transgression by whom? By those who made these claims to begin with, and by those who refuse to be reproved today concerning those claims.

    Jehovah's organization is that which it has always been since Pentecost 33 CE. It is still comprised of Jesus Christ as its foundation cornerstone, the Apostles and prophets as its foundation stones, and Jehovah's anointed being harmoniously joined together to be built up together for a place for Jehovah to inhabit with spirit. Anyone who is a part of this heavenly organization has no fear of being kicked out of any earthly organization... for their organization is that which is in the heavens, and has nothing to do with any earthly organization.

    Jesus did say that whenever two or more are gathered "in his name" (let the reader discern that I did not say "those who claim to gather in his name"), that he himself will be there. Likewise, Jehovah himself will be there with spirit and power. It does not matter what earthly organization these ones are apart of, for Jehovah recognizes none except the one in which he himself established through his son Jesus Christ... that organization is a heavenly one. This organization is also extensively organized, because it has Jesus Christ as its head. He himself is now alive and acting as head and Master over this heavenly organization... a perfect governor, one ruling to perfection those whom look to him for salvation.

    I am not trying to prove that Jehovah's Witnesses are not god's people.... for I believe that all persons belong to him.

    But one may ask: "Where was Jehovah's earthly organization before CT Russell and the Bible Students came along?"

    The answer that most Jehovah's witnesses would give is that Jehovah during that time had faithful anointed followers that were "scattered about" throughout the various religious organizations of the times. And that these ones themselves were apart of his organization. I doubt any Witnesses would say that his earthly organization was the various churches of Christendom themselves during that time.... rather, they would say that Jehovah's organization was separate from that. Likewise, on that same thought, I contend that Jehovah's Organization now is the same one that existed even back then.... separate from ANY earthly organization.

    Likewise, I also believe that if anything is formed by man, and said to represent Jehovah's heavenly organization, then I contend that this thing formed is indeed an Idol. And those that made it are idolators. And I also contend that all those who either in word or deed that bend their knees to such an idol are also guilty of Idolatry, and need to be warned so they can turn around and repent.

    The scriptures clearly state that Jesus Christ is the way to Jehovah (John 14:6). Whoever teaches that the way to Jehovah is through an organization is teaching something contrary to Jesus Christ. Just as the Roman Catholics teach that salvation only comes THROUGH the church, can we at the same time teach people that salvation only comes through the Jehovah's Witness organization? If so, we're idolators and are in need of repentance, because we have replaced Jesus Christ with something else... this is idolatry. If we teach that salvation rest THROUGH any man or group including the anointed themselves, then we're idolators, and in need of repentance. For we have replaced Jesus Christ with something else... this is idolatry. For the scriptures clearly teach there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved... except Jesus Christ. (Acts 4:12)

    The "brotherhood" of the anointed, those who are members of the spiritual temple act as ambassadors substituting for Christ. Their mission is to tell those of the earth to "become reconciled to God!" How does one become reconciled to God? Only through Jesus Christ whom is alive and ruling as head and Master over the congregation of God in power and glory in the heavens (2Cor 5:20). He is "the way", "the truth", and "the life" (John 4:16)

    Noone, noone, noone, comes to the father except through Jesus Christ. He is the gatekeeper. And anyone or anything that comes in his place is a thief and a plunderer. (John 10:1-16)

    The God that made the world and all the things in it, being, as this One is, Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in handmade temples (nor earthly buildings, or earthly organizations), neither is he attended to by human hands as if he needed anything, because he himself gives to all (persons) life and breath and all things. And he made out of one (man) every nation of men, to dwell upon the entire surface of the earth, and he decreed the appointed times and he set limits of the dwelling of (men), for them to seek God, if they might grope for him and really find him, although in fact, he is not far off from each one of us. - Acts 17:24-31

    End quote.

  • Ding
    Ding

    One thing the WT does very successfully is to get JWs to focus on the question as to which organization is God's true organization.

    The mistaken implication is that God has one and only one true organization and that our salvation depends on finding it and serving God as part of it.

    In contrast, the New Testament teaches that the key to salvation is Jesus Christ personally.

  • TonusOH
    TonusOH

    God will hear and listen to prayer, and wants a personal relationship with each of us. So if we pray and study the Bible, an organization is superfluous. The idea of god only allowing salvation through one specific group of people and rejecting everyone else on what amounts to a technicality is dumb.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Here is my last post in a debate I had tonight with a JW on another forum before he gave me the kiss of death i.e., told me off and disabled further comments.

    Me: Your faith for salvation is entirely in men in Warwick New York you identify as the Faithful Slave.

    JW: Your statement is a lie.

    Actually it's the truth which you don't want to hear. The Faithful Slave says you must trust them or you don't trust Jehovah. Will anyone who doesn't trust Jehovah survive Armageddon? You tell me. Where does the Bible say you will not survive Armageddon if you don't trust these men in New York?

    The Bible, God's word, does not say this, but your Faithful Slave does. So your faith is not in the Bible, but in men who say that trust in them is essential to your salvation.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7
    1. Are JWs God's Organization?
  • Biahi
    Biahi

    Are JW’s God’s organization? No.

  • stan livedeath
    stan livedeath

    are jw's gods organization ? Yes--well some of them really have witnessed a big empty hole in the sky.

  • Ron.W.
    Ron.W.

    Biahi:
    Are JW’s God’s organization? No.

    👍👍👍

  • wantingtruth
    wantingtruth
    The first post in this topic was a quote of a person I appreciate much .

    Here I will express with my words how I see the situation, after reading the Scriptures:
    ---------------

    ~~~ Jehovah's Organization -- how did Jesus called it ? ~~~
    .
    I have read the Bible .
    I have never found the word “organization”, nor the fact that God would ever had or has an "organization" on earth .
    The humans want to understand through the word “organization” God’s theocratic arrangement.
    BUT, what really would fit with this word (organization), it is found only in Heavens !
    God’s Organization (theocratic arrangement) is in Heaven and it is Heavenly.
    And when Jesus Christ came on earth , he did not call it “God’s organization” but God’s KINGDOM !
    WHAT is God's Organization (Kingdom) ?
    According to Jesus words in Matthew 6 :10
    "Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so on earth."
    ...we understand that His Organization (Kingdom) means the "state" or the "arrangement" where His will is done [not only at the declarative level]....
    ... and where God's authority is manifested >>> that implies that in God's Kingdom the willful sinner (or God's opponents) will not enter! - 1 Corinthians 6:9 / Psalms 101: 8.
    ...
    And furthermore, Jesus has taught us that Father’s will is that this [Heavenly] Kingdom to come on earth.
    And he taught us to pray for that.
    And because Father commanded to Jesus followers to “obey the Son” (Matt.17:5), we are praying until today “Let Your Kingdom come…”
    That is the most powerful proof that “God’s Organization” is not on earth today, because we all admit that His Kingdom is not here yet ( we are still praying for it to come) !
    Well, but then , what does God has on earth ?
    He says He has a people ! ... Acts 15:14 / Titus 2:14
    But has He always had “a people” on earth ?
    NO ! because the history of His chosen people begun with God’s “pulling his people out of Egypt”.
    So, before of that event God had individuals and "family" .
    When the Israelites entered in Egypt they were a “family” (of seventy souls). And there they become a "people". Genesis 46:6,27.
    And what God always had on earth are “human souls” because He is the OWNER of them ... Ezekiel 18:4
    “Behold, all souls are Mine;
    the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine
    The soul who sins will die."
    What is God doing “always” is as it follows :
    "The LORD looks down from heaven
    on all mankind
    to see if there are any who understand,
    any who seek God."
    Psalm 14:2.
    So, we can say that “always” God has been having on earth individuals who “seek after Him”, to know (understand) Him – but not "organization"!
    Now , Jesus has formed the “Christian community” within which God’s Kingdom has to come .
    And how does He did it ?
    To the "two greatest commandments" (to love God…and the neighbor) Jesus has added another one through which He fixed the "center" of the "Christian community".
    As a planet is formed by firstly fixing its “center/point of gravity” so did Jesus:
    He gave “a new commandment” to His followers:
    “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
    “By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”
    John 13:34,35.
    Through these words Jesus has fixed the “center of gravity” for the Christian community !
    There was never need for a human "organization" to keep His faithful ones united !
    That commandment works (like a gravitational force) in those who really have faith in Jesus and it produces unity (not uniformity).
    Within this (worldwide) "community" (or eklesia) the Heavenly Kingdom of God will “come on earth” in short time / at God’s established time.
    ==========
    Regarding the much used phrase: “God doesn’t deal with individuals, only with his organization” there is an inspired scripture proving how God deals with men:
    Job 34:29
    "When He keeps quiet, who then can condemn?
    And when He hides His face, who then can behold Him,
    >>> That is, in regard to both nation and man. "
    So, Jehovah deals with “both nation and man”/ individuals and group of individuals/people/nation (his people)...
    ... while He may be "at peace" with a certain His servant , at the same time He may be "angered" over His nation , as a "whole"
    ... while He may be "at peace" with His "people" , He may manifest His anger over a certain "individual" who proves to be "law transgressor"

    Wantingtruth.
  • punkofnice
    punkofnice
    Are Jw's God's Organization?

    No. Nor is anyone else.

    Since when did 'organisation(tm)' make it into the Bible?

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