Probability of Earth and life being how it is

by ballistic 58 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Sea Breeze

  That is Gary Habermas's "facts" approach.

  @ TonusOH

  Professor Haberman got his PHd on Resurrection sudies and was granted his doctorate by a Jew, an Atheist and a critical Christian, not exactly a friendly panel for presenting a thesis on the facts of the Resurrection. The facts presented are not his, but representative of between 75 to 95 % of all scholars (including atheists, Jewish, and otherwise) who publish in the area of 1 st century Christianity.

  @Duran,

  All those people you mention are dead. If people want to put their eternal fate into the hands of dead people, they are certainly welcome to do that. But, I question the liklihood of getting life from / through someone dead; doesn't make any sense.

  Jesus seems to be a far better object of faith since he demonstrated that he is STILL ALIVE.
• 

  blondie

  How did this topic go so far off from the original post? "There are some things we don't know about existence and whether the Earth is a simulation or even a creation. But we can do some statistical analysis on it.The probability of a planet like Earth existing in the Goldilocks zone and having a moon that perfectly eclipses the sun is extremely low, but it's not impossible.

  • The habitable zone (or Goldilocks zone) around a star is the region where a planet could potentially support liquid water on its surface."
• 

  TD

  Games of chance, such as you would play in a Casino revolve around the probability of predetermined outcomes. Jeffro carefully explained the distinction.
  
• 

  Duran

  All those people you mention are dead.

  LOL! The fact that John, Joseph, and Muhammad are dead have nothing to do with what I asked you. Do you believe an angel of God appeared to all 3 of them?

  Jesus seems to be a far better object of faith since he demonstrated that he is STILL ALIVE.

  Any mention of Jesus that you claim shows he is alive, also comes from all those who are dead, including John. Can any living person prove that Jesus is alive today? Does Jesus himself prove he is alive today or does any so-called proof that he is alive today come only from what is writing in books by people who are currently all dead?

  Can you think of any historical examples of where hundreds of people fabricated a lie at the same time that was guaranteed to cause their loved ones to reject and shun them? Then, these same people were willing to die for something they KNEW was a lie?

  Do you believe it is true or a fabricated lie that an angel of God appeared to Muhammad and gave him the info to write the Quran?

  Will Muslims die for what they believe and kill others for what they believe?

  Will Muslims reject and shun their family for not believing?
• 

  Sea Breeze

  @Blondie,

  How did this topic go so far off from the original post?

  The OP presupposes the following miracles:

  1. Existence Comes from Non-existence

  2. Order Comes from Chaos

  3. Life Comes from Non-Life

  4. The Personal Comes from the Non-Personal

  5. Reason Comes from Non-Reason

  6. Morality Comes from Matter

  I am challenging these presuppositions the OP is founded upon while offering a reasonable alternative, one grounded in history, facts, and probability.
• 

  TonusOH

  Sea Breeze: The facts presented are not his

  For the purposes of this discussion, that is a moot point. Many of the claimed facts are only found in the Bible, and thus are not corroborated by contemporary accounts. But even that doesn't matter. As I already said, if we accept all of those facts, they do not demonstrate the the Bible is true. And those facts would still support the explanation that the disciples were deluded into thinking that a dead man had been revived, as opposed to the claim that he was an actual god.

  At best, it is inconclusive.
• 

  Sea Breeze

  TonusOH,

  At best, it is inconclusive.

  Can't disagree with that. But so what? Humans rarely make choices based on conclusivity. We spin through life making choices based upon probability. That is our reality.

  @TD

  Jeffro carefully explained the distinction

  No he did not. His statement was contradictory. He uses the word "probability" which is rooted by definition in the future to describe an artifact rooted in the past.
• 

  ballistic

  Yes Blondie, the thread hasn't gone at all the way I imagined. My ponderings were influenced by it being trendy to talk about the universe as a "Simulation" at the moment (tiktok, various forums, memes, etc) there's also much talk of quantum mechanics on some other forums and how nothing is solid, thus blurring the lines between whether something like a simulation actually has to be "solid" in any regard other than perception, and finally I've been reading a lot of Eastern Religion and existentialism, so I'm interested to know, if I'm projecting the universe "out there", how could I tell that is the case, or even likely?
• 

  Sea Breeze

  I've been reading a lot of Eastern Religion and existentialism

  @ballistic

  All these religious authors you study about the nature of LIFE are dead or soon will be, right? How much sense does that make?

  @Duran
  

  Any mention of Jesus that you claim shows he is alive, also comes from all those who are dead

  Jesus claimed to be God and predicted that he would raise himself from the dead to prove it. Why would a person who raised himself from the dead lie about being the actual author of the bible although admittedly others did the penning?
  
  If he told the truth about something as mind-boggling as a self-resurrection, why is it hard to believe that other things he said are also true?
• 

  ballistic

  I knew there was going to be at least one heckler.